93 replies to this topic

[Alienized]

my huginn needs you too

Edited by Aliisa White, 21 December 2014 - 11:19 AM.

[Felicitatem Parco]

KuroNyra, on 21 December 2014 - 11:14 AM, said:

Damn, so I am wrong for having fun in my Quickdraw?

Yes, you are wrong. Steam Stistics prove that you are wrong for playing in a Mech that's not a Timberwolf. They also prove that the world is flat, that mice Spontaneously Generate from piles of rags, and that the new player bonuses pay only in runes that cannot be spent in-game.

Edited by Prosperity Park, 21 December 2014 - 11:19 AM.

[Gyrok]

Mcgral18, on 21 December 2014 - 11:16 AM, said:

Wait, OP, stay. I need pilots I can slaughter in a Mist Lynx.

LOL @ Gecko facepalm...

That might be the funniest meme I have seen in quite a while...

Nice one McGral....lol.

[RustyBolts]

Sorry but I saw the been gone, came back, nerf Clans blah blah text and didnt get past the second paragraph before realizing op does not know what he is talking about.

[Mavairo]

Don't worry he'll cry some more, whine, rage then quit again in a day.

[Alienized]

KuroNyra, on 21 December 2014 - 11:14 AM, said:

Damn, so I am wrong for having fun in my Quickdraw?

we should express our love for the quickdraws together.... best mech <3

[Jack Corban]

hashinshin, on 21 December 2014 - 10:39 AM, said:

There comes a point when the grind is so insurmountable that even being "available for in game currency" remains P2W. Think of it with a mind game with me:

There is a mech that shoots Timber Wolves. It shoot Timber Wolves that then roam the map and kill enemies for you. It has a 3 second cooldown and each shot creates another Timber Wolf. It is available for 999,999,999 cbills and 1000 MC. Pay2win? Yes. But now it's available for 500,000,000 Cbills. Still pay2win? Still yes. What about 250,000,000. Still pay2win? When is the cut off that it stops being pay2win since reasonable a player can farm for it? Timber Wolves cross that line. I imagine it would take 50 hours for your average player to get Cbills. You can say JUST GET GOOD AND FARM AND I DO 600 DAMAGE AND I GET 200,000 A MATCH WTF NEWB. but... without Newbs you wouldn't be managing to get that score would you?

So 50 hours a Timber Wolf, 3 Timber Wolves is 150 hours. And that's me being generous and assuming that no player has quit until they have all their timber wolves. 150 hours is more than steam stats would say your average player will put in to pretty much any game they don't like. So reasonably no player can get a timber wolf for in game currency before they quit the game for not liking it. Only a player who ALREADY likes the game (meaning isn't getting destroyed) will continue for that long.

And 50 hours is me being GENEROUS to your cause. Your average player who gets 30,000 or less in half his matches will take far longer.

OP went full ******.

You never go full ******.

Edited by Jack Corban, 21 December 2014 - 11:34 AM.

[C E Dwyer]

hashinshin, on 21 December 2014 - 10:33 AM, said:

Across the entire internet MWO is sort of a joke. Once the Clans came out that joke became hilarious. I wasn't here for that, but across all internet sources people joked about how pay2win MWO had become. It started with hero mechs, then they nerfed cbills, then they did pre-order packs, then t hey did the clan invasion. Culminating in an unmistakable P2W scheme.

Well CW came out and MWO got some attention again so I decided to come back despite the most adamant claims being to the OPness of Clans and how the game remains P2W. Some people said "oh Clans got nerfed it's okay now" well the first thing I see on the website is another pre-order package. Joyous.

However it's only once I start playing games that it becomes unapproachable the concept that clans are still OP. After reading these forums it becomes clear that Clans are OP. Why? Not because people say they're OP, but the degree to which people will go to defend them, something that isn't OP doesn't get defended so strongly and by so many personal attacks unless we all know that they are OP and that people just don't want to lose that.

The problem remains that MWO is still a joke across the internet. The problem is that PGI pretends that now since everyone can "get timberwolves for free" (farm for 60 hours to get 1 of the 3 you need) that the problem is gone. Well first off if something is OP it's OP no matter if it's given out as a christmas gift to everyone for actually free. Second off, no. Clan mechs are most expensive than their IS counterparts by far. The game still remains a massive grind fest taking absurd times to just get a few mechs. Worse yet though is that even if people DID want to buy in to the game they'd hit a massive ******* pay wall of $50 to get a Timber Wolf.

Now lets compare MWO to two games it always likes to compare itself to, LoL and WoT: The first comparison is obvious since PGI themselves compared their pricing scheme to LoL's and said it was fair. The problem with this one is that you do not need to buy a new rune page for every champion in LoL, and champions in LoL tend to be balanced enough against each other. Worse yet is that champions in LoL do not need endo-steel nor DHS and most of the time they don't even need an XL engine. WORST yet is that since making that comment Clantech has come out and the pricing for the strongest mechs has gone up considerably with the best clan mechs themselves not even being available for in game currency for like 6 months. The Timber Wolf is more expensive by far than the most expensive mech in the game as of the time of PGI's comment and the comment itself ignored the fact that mechs need more upgrades and parts after purchase, LoL champions do not.

The second comparison is the good one. WoT tanks are about the same price as MWO mechs, right? Except the more expensive the purchase the higher tier you fight along. A new player can buy a Centurian and go "oh boy time to play me some MWO" promptly get **** slapped by a Dire Wolf or Timber Wolf. What's more is that WoT's pricing structure is there because their XP/money curve matches up. You can level in WoT and never float XP nor money and feel like you're progressing on par. In MWO you quickly start floating XP while struggling to afford even medium mechs in a reasonable time (lord help you if you want a heavy+ clan mech.) This means the player is often left with little choice than to buy in if he wants to keep progressing. The problem then becomes the pricing. Hawken and other similar games with small playerbases place their prices low to encourage new players to buy in. MWO acts like it's an industry juggernaut when the reality is it struggles to get by.

The combination of an absolute grindfest to reach anything worth noting, the power spike in the higher priced mechs (Clans) and pre-orders constantly being released containing more powerful mechs is exactly why MWO is such a joke to the gaming community. It's P2W, Pay2NotGrind, Pay2Play in many cases since going in to CW without a top tier set of Clan mechs means you're going to be dying to many Timber Wolves, and worse yet it's feature light.

Maybe MWO can keep acting like it's an industry juggernaut, keeping it's P2W and it's pricing and everything about itself while at the same time not actually being what it thinks it is. Maybe the dedicated playerbase will keep shoving money at you. But how many more tricks does it have left in store? They won't allow any mech to be better than the Timber Wolf and CW is now "released." That's pretty much it for your strategies. Unless you make some real changes (and it's probably too late as is) you're just going to continue to alienate anyone who tries to play while at the same time discouraging your remaining players from staying.

This is all a lie! I have anecdotal evidence that this one time I used a trebuchet and killed three Timber Wolves clan tech is fine and balanced and I think the game is fair and please don't notice my clan founder insignia!

so where are your sources that says MWO is a joke, are they professional ones or just a few slucky brats like you ?

[Bishop Steiner]

Prosperity Park, on 21 December 2014 - 11:09 AM, said:

Did you guys read that comment from page 1 where Steam statistics prove the Timberwolf is P2W because players who don't like MWO are unwilling to play for 150 hours to buy a trio of Timberwolfs?

Because MWO is only fun in a Timberwolf. THAT is the crux of this thread...

dangit...so since I hate playing in my Timberwolves, I guess there is no hope at all for me?

Cathy, on 21 December 2014 - 11:15 AM, said:

There are far worse people that you can be forced to agree with, though yeah..its not so much the feeling dirty when it happens it's the guilt that you know sooner or later its going to happen again

[Gyrok]

Jack Corban, on 21 December 2014 - 11:29 AM, said:

OP went full ******.

You never go full ******.

I cannot believe he is so terribad that he only gets 30k cbills every other match...? The reward tables are set at 50k. How can he earn less than minimum? The game knows he is a troll and is trolling him accordingly?

I can guarantee you this much, I have not tracked my cbill rewards in a while, but when I did after the new rewards came out...I had several 400k+ cbill matches (which I had not seen in a VERY long time previously...), and on the low end was around 90-150k.

So...terribad player is terribad...?

[Bishop Steiner]

Aliisa White, on 21 December 2014 - 11:19 AM, said:

my huginn needs you too

ok...that's just weird, awesome and little disturbing all in one.......

[Mavairo]

Bishop Steiner, on 21 December 2014 - 11:39 AM, said:

ok...that's just weird, awesome and little disturbing all in one.......

The original version had the cat going "what?? What's happening?"
And the sloth's response was "Shhhh no words just sensations"

[mogs01gt]

hashinshin, on 21 December 2014 - 10:33 AM, said:

Across the entire internet MWO is sort of a joke. Once the Clans came out that joke became hilarious. I wasn't here for that, but across all internet sources people joked about how pay2win MWO had become. It started with hero mechs, then they nerfed cbills, then they did pre-order packs, then t hey did the clan invasion. Culminating in an unmistakable P2W scheme.

Well CW came out and MWO got some attention again so I decided to come back despite the most adamant claims being to the OPness of Clans and how the game remains P2W. Some people said "oh Clans got nerfed it's okay now" well the first thing I see on the website is another pre-order package. Joyous.

However it's only once I start playing games that it becomes unapproachable the concept that clans are still OP. After reading these forums it becomes clear that Clans are OP. Why? Not because people say they're OP, but the degree to which people will go to defend them, something that isn't OP doesn't get defended so strongly and by so many personal attacks unless we all know that they are OP and that people just don't want to lose that.

The problem remains that MWO is still a joke across the internet. The problem is that PGI pretends that now since everyone can "get timberwolves for free" (farm for 60 hours to get 1 of the 3 you need) that the problem is gone. Well first off if something is OP it's OP no matter if it's given out as a christmas gift to everyone for actually free. Second off, no. Clan mechs are most expensive than their IS counterparts by far. The game still remains a massive grind fest taking absurd times to just get a few mechs. Worse yet though is that even if people DID want to buy in to the game they'd hit a massive ******* pay wall of $50 to get a Timber Wolf.

Now lets compare MWO to two games it always likes to compare itself to, LoL and WoT: The first comparison is obvious since PGI themselves compared their pricing scheme to LoL's and said it was fair. The problem with this one is that you do not need to buy a new rune page for every champion in LoL, and champions in LoL tend to be balanced enough against each other. Worse yet is that champions in LoL do not need endo-steel nor DHS and most of the time they don't even need an XL engine. WORST yet is that since making that comment Clantech has come out and the pricing for the strongest mechs has gone up considerably with the best clan mechs themselves not even being available for in game currency for like 6 months. The Timber Wolf is more expensive by far than the most expensive mech in the game as of the time of PGI's comment and the comment itself ignored the fact that mechs need more upgrades and parts after purchase, LoL champions do not.

The second comparison is the good one. WoT tanks are about the same price as MWO mechs, right? Except the more expensive the purchase the higher tier you fight along. A new player can buy a Centurian and go "oh boy time to play me some MWO" promptly get **** slapped by a Dire Wolf or Timber Wolf. What's more is that WoT's pricing structure is there because their XP/money curve matches up. You can level in WoT and never float XP nor money and feel like you're progressing on par. In MWO you quickly start floating XP while struggling to afford even medium mechs in a reasonable time (lord help you if you want a heavy+ clan mech.) This means the player is often left with little choice than to buy in if he wants to keep progressing. The problem then becomes the pricing. Hawken and other similar games with small playerbases place their prices low to encourage new players to buy in. MWO acts like it's an industry juggernaut when the reality is it struggles to get by.

The combination of an absolute grindfest to reach anything worth noting, the power spike in the higher priced mechs (Clans) and pre-orders constantly being released containing more powerful mechs is exactly why MWO is such a joke to the gaming community. It's P2W, Pay2NotGrind, Pay2Play in many cases since going in to CW without a top tier set of Clan mechs means you're going to be dying to many Timber Wolves, and worse yet it's feature light.

Maybe MWO can keep acting like it's an industry juggernaut, keeping it's P2W and it's pricing and everything about itself while at the same time not actually being what it thinks it is. Maybe the dedicated playerbase will keep shoving money at you. But how many more tricks does it have left in store? They won't allow any mech to be better than the Timber Wolf and CW is now "released." That's pretty much it for your strategies. Unless you make some real changes (and it's probably too late as is) you're just going to continue to alienate anyone who tries to play while at the same time discouraging your remaining players from staying.

This is all a lie! I have anecdotal evidence that this one time I used a trebuchet and killed three Timber Wolves clan tech is fine and balanced and I think the game is fair and please don't notice my clan founder insignia!

Good post Hash! Your posts on the old LoL forums are missed.

Both games, LoL and MWO are getting worse. I cant get match where teammates last more than 3 minutes.

[KharnZor]

hashinshin, on 21 December 2014 - 10:40 AM, said:

It's exactly this emotional filled defense that assures me Clantech is OP.

He's right. You are a bit ignorant.

[MechB Kotare]

Mcgral18, on 21 December 2014 - 11:16 AM, said:

Wait, OP, stay. I need pilots I can slaughter in a Mist Lynx.

Mist Lynx \m/!
So Op!.
New meta! Must nerf!

[Mercules]

hashinshin, on 21 December 2014 - 10:33 AM, said:

However it's only once I start playing games that it becomes unapproachable the concept that clans are still OP. After reading these forums it becomes clear that Clans are OP. Why? Not because people say they're OP, but the degree to which people will go to defend them, something that isn't OP doesn't get defended so strongly and by so many personal attacks unless we all know that they are OP and that people just don't want to lose that.

So if we don't defend Clan mechs then people say, "See no one disagrees with me. I must be right and they are OP." If we defend them then it is OP because we feel the need to defend them? Do you see an issue with this?

Look, I don't even own a Timberwolf. I own Stormcrows but I am also FRR and intend to be for a pretty long time and so won't be playing Clan mechs in the foreseeable future. So really I have no reason to see Clans retain an overpowered status if they are overpowered.

Now the Timberwolf and Stormcrow are powerhouses among the clans. They are the best of them. They might be slightly overpowered but there are IS mechs that are a solid challenge to them. I am taking Stormcrows out with a Firestarter or even Wolverines, for example. However, in general the grouping of "Clan" is not overpowered. Many mechs in it are underpowered. 2 outliers for general powerlevel does not require a "Clan Nerf". You do something to correct those particular mechs and then look to what can boost the other Clan mechs.

[KuroNyra]

mogs01gt, on 21 December 2014 - 11:41 AM, said:

Good post Hash! Your posts on the old LoL forums are missed.

Both games, LoL and MWO are getting worse. I cant get match where teammates last more than 3 minutes.

Hey look, the troll brought his friend.

[mogs01gt]

KuroNyra, on 21 December 2014 - 11:51 AM, said:

Hey look, the troll brought his friend.

Brought.....I've been posting on these forums longer than Hash has.


Hash is right but the blind supports of MWO and Battletech games have no true gaming experience when it comes to F2P games. MWO will always be P2W until princing of mechs gets into the 5 to 10 dollar range.

Clans are OP. There is no reason to not run a Crow, TBR or DWF since they are the best mechs in their class even compared to other Clanners.

I understand most blind MWO and Battletech supporters will ignore this. That is because most are not true gamers and havent tried multiple F2P. Im not talking 5, Im talking like 20. Hell there are around 15 F2P MoBa's to try to understand what true F2P is.

Edited by mogs01gt, 21 December 2014 - 12:02 PM.

[KharnZor]

mogs01gt, on 21 December 2014 - 11:54 AM, said:

Brought.....I've been posting on these forums longer than Hash has.


Hash is right but the blind supports of MWO and Battletech games have no true gaming experience when it comes to F2P games. MWO will always be P2W until princing of mechs gets into the 5 to 10 dollar range.

Clans are OP. There is no reason to not run a Crow, TBR or DWF since they are the best mechs in their class even compared to other Clanners.

I understand most blind MWO and Battletech supporters will ignore this. That is because most are not true gamers and have tried multiple F2P. Im not talking 5, Im talking like 20. Hell there are around 15 F2P MoBa's to try to understand what true F2P is.

True gamers? seriously? get over yourself.

Edited by KharnZor, 21 December 2014 - 11:57 AM.

[Xetelian]

It is very hard to take anything in this thread seriously.