58 replies to this topic

[HBizzle]

Blueduck, on 03 January 2015 - 09:20 PM, said:

I was in a 12 vs 12 man against merc star earlier. We still gave a GG but make no mistake we do feel that a team of 10+ ppc spamming thunderbolts is a cheap way to play. Effective but cheap.

Our unit is about fighting battles where both sides have the chance to win in a brawl. We want everyone to have fun and if we lose oh well, it was a good fight. This is the reason we don't do 12/4 stormcrow rushes. Just not a fun way to play.

In regards to the rest of my unit; some of them are very angry about the ppc spam right now. Most will still be polite but I cannot make promises for everyone.

Well then don't go crying when you get beat. Thanks.

[Star Wolves Admin Account]

InspectorG, on 03 January 2015 - 09:41 PM, said:

HAHA

I dont know how a Doctorate in Physics compares to Art skool, likely harder(?), but yes, from experience, Teaching develops a nice callous...
I had to come to the sad realization that i had to be depressed to do my best artwork...but i learned from it, lols.

Now my understanding from what some of the more 'comp/tryhards' have said is MWO is a niche franchise and there are prolly around 1000 people who spent/spend $1000+. World wide. Many are average who spend for entertainment. Some are the comp players who have a deal/endorsement/whatever with PGI. Reddit could prolly supply more info than I.
I personally have not spent anywhere near that much. Im south of $100.

Smaller transactions are nice but i think that if they reduced the cost of the cosmetics, more people would buy them. Ive played PSO2 and, there are many Americans who went through the hassle to get Yen to buy tons of cosmetic stuff that didnt alter gameplay. Pretty sure thats an untapped market here.

Back to topic:

I think the business model is eared to comps...in the long run?

Trash talk is, unfortunately, part of competitive endeavors regardless of gaming/sports/community bingo/etc.
Im just glad PGI gave me the option to cut All Chat. I keep it on, but it is there.

I appreciate your points; you are correct on much of the competitiveness. That said I wish people could be just a wee bit nicer to the new/unitless people. Especially the ones that really aren't talking trash and are maybe just learning.

Tx for the discussion.

HBizzle, on 03 January 2015 - 09:46 PM, said:

Well then don't go crying when you get beat. Thanks.

As I say people are a bit frustrated at the PPC spam, bringing back bad memories of the stalker reign.

That said we have always given a good game and complimented the other team when it is a nail biter or just a competitive game regardless of win or lose.

I think you may find your luck turns around after this Tuesday when we will see a likely nerf of the thunderbolt. Remember you never did take one of our planets when you were ghost bear. >:-)

Edited by Blueduck, 03 January 2015 - 09:51 PM.

[MauttyKoray]

A lot of the more mature and organized groups are running CW, so you won't see them in solo or group queue as often. Sadly this leaves a lot more of the less mature players to fill the games.

[InspectorG]

Blueduck, on 03 January 2015 - 09:48 PM, said:

I appreciate your points; you are correct on much of the competitiveness. That said I wish people could be just a wee bit nicer to the new/unitless people. Especially the ones that really aren't talking trash and are maybe just learning.

Tx for the discussion.

Agreed. Thank you!

[The Cheese]

MauttyKoray, on 03 January 2015 - 09:51 PM, said:

A lot of the more mature and organized groups are running CW, so you won't see them in solo or group queue as often. Sadly this leaves a lot more of the less mature players to fill the games.

Really? I've found the pub queue to be a lot friendlier since CW started.

[Max Liao]

Blueduck, on 03 January 2015 - 06:30 PM, said:

As an example in my unit we let randoms open the door when they are really having issues and encourage them to try again or join a unit. Is it really that rewarding to completely stomp and humiliate new and random people?

I tend not to talk in matches, other than my Magistracy of Canopus macros , but in CW I have no sympathy for anyone ... not you, not new players, not myself. (and as someone who is average, at best, there are time when I could use the sympathy.

In CW play to win or be left for scrap. There is no excuse for playing half-assed. Save that for the random PUG drops.

Blueduck, on 03 January 2015 - 06:30 PM, said:

1) Is it really fair or fun to take snipe a team to death with nothing but ppcs

Yes. A win is a win, I don't care how it is achieved (other than cheating/hacking). If LRMs are the meta, use LRMs. If PPCs are the meta, use PPCs. If light rushing is the meta, use light rushing.

Blueduck, on 03 January 2015 - 06:30 PM, said:

2) or to counter this by doing nothing but 4 groups of 12 man stormcrow rushes?

If that's what wins that's what you should be doing.

Blueduck, on 03 January 2015 - 06:30 PM, said:

Are you really that biased or frankly unsportsmanlike to see that its fun when both sides have a fair chance to win? Do we really have to call each other names and curse at them over the forums which simply shows how insignificant and dumb we are?

Win, lose, or draw, I don't get with the name calling or the trash talking. You and I agree 100% in that; however, yes, ROFLstomping the enemy is a good thing. Being ROFLstomped sucks, but I can either lean to play better, save up for better 'Mechs, find a better team, or stick to random drops. There's no place in CW for lackadaisical fighting. It's a war simulation (sort of) not a peewee league t-ball game.

Blueduck, on 03 January 2015 - 06:30 PM, said:

Consider this, if you keep smashing people in one sided victories and humiliating new players, there isn't going to be anyone to play with. Meaning all this work you put into the game will be completely fruitless.

Again, when it comes to trash taking, we agree. When it comes to random PUG battles, we agree; however, when it comes to community warfare I couldn't disagree with you more. Community Warfare should be cutthroat and unforgiving ... especially when/if PGI puts in actual meaning for capturing and losing planets.

Blueduck, on 03 January 2015 - 06:30 PM, said:

With that, perhaps we could all try a little bit harder to think what is best for the game rather than just our win count. Try to think what will make it most fun and fair rather than just what gets us more kills.

Winning is fun. Losing sucks. Play to win. When it comes to the random, 15-minute matches, play for fun and fairness, and whatever. When it comes to community warfare, use whatever advantage you have -- win at all costs (other than cheating/hacking, of course). If that means all Ryokens, then use all Ryokens.

This is why I'm not whining about the FedRats eating up the Confederation. It's war, and they are doing what they would do. All I can do is try my best to help stop them and let the chips fall where they may.

[CMDR Sunset Shimmer]

Xythius, on 03 January 2015 - 07:33 PM, said:

I really do not understand this aversion/complaining about legging a 'mech. I have seen a few posts about it lately and was even flamed in game for it today. It is a viable tactic. If you are dealing with a 'mech that has superior manuervability, even the playing field. Especially if the leg is already damaged. Why is legging 'bad' yet stripping an arm is ok? I fail to see how this is rude.

This is actually holdover from Mechwarrior 3, if you can believe it. [yeah, a game that's 16 years old, is still impacting what people complain about now.]

In Mechwarrior 3, the quickest way to kill a mech, was to leg it, because loosing a single leg, ment death in MW3.

MW4 fixed this, and allowed a mech to "limp" along, much like we have in MWO.

The complaint was STILL in Mechwarrior 4, despite the fact that loosing a single leg didn't kill you. But what had happened, was that the MW3 community had gravitated to lower armor on the legs, and up-armoring everything else/using less leg armor to save tonnage. That thought process gravitated into MW4, and when people started legging mechs over there, the players from MW3 complained because they couldn't save weight by shaving armor off the legs.

That same mentality has persisted all this time it seems. The legging system is fine in MWO. People who complain about it, are either 1)Piloting light mechs or 2)under armoring their legs to save weight.

[Kiryuin Ragyo]

Blueduck, on 03 January 2015 - 06:30 PM, said:

Update: TX for some nice discussion and manners people, helped renew my faith in the player base somewhat.

I understand that there is some genuine frustration around here and in game recently. Certainly both IS and Clan pilots have had their annoyances with the maps and balance but the toxicity has just been increasing exponentially.

In game today I played with a team of PUGs that were trashed talked and stomped into the ground by a competitive team that frankly should have shown extreme sportsmanship. As an example in my unit we let randoms open the door when they are really having issues and encourage them to try again or join a unit. Is it really that rewarding to completely stomp and humiliate new and random people?

Likewise on here and in game no one is sympathetic to the other sides view in that:

1) Is it really fair or fun to take snipe a team to death with nothing but ppcs

2) or to counter this by doing nothing but 4 groups of 12 man stormcrow rushes?

Are you really that biased or frankly unsportsmanlike to see that its fun when both sides have a fair chance to win? Do we really have to call each other names and curse at them over the forums which simply shows how insignificant and dumb we are?

Consider this, if you keep smashing people in one sided victories and humiliating new players, there isn't going to be anyone to play with. Meaning all this work you put into the game will be completely fruitless.

With that, perhaps we could all try a little bit harder to think what is best for the game rather than just our win count. Try to think what will make it most fun and fair rather than just what gets us more kills.

QQ detected.

[GumbyC2C]

It's PGI's job to balance the game. It's our job to win matches. We can only play the players lined up against us on the other team. We can only use the mechs, maps, and weapons PGI provides. It does your opponents a dishonor and a disservice to not play your best and try and win. Otherwise their victory (should they win) is hollow and unearned. Playing your best is part of good sportsmanship. Now, having said all that, I will also say it is totally unnecessary to talk smack to a team you just beat 12-2 or worse regardless of who is on that team. I have always felt that in anything I have every played the scoreboard was the best smack talker. I do agree that things have felt a little more toxic around here lately. That is probably the influence of CW which makes you want to win even more and rightly so. People just need to remember where the line is between a fierce competitor and a jerk and stay on the correct side of that.

[Mudhutwarrior]

If you haven't faced fear in real life many end up with the attitude. Some of you may remember 9/11. I was in NY then.

Right after for about six months was some of the nicest driving around the city and upstate. I mean every one was courteous and respectful of others. Soon after though it faded and it was back to the usual.

War Torn countries I have been in the same. Nothing but people being human and decent past the animals as animals will be animals.

It is the internet though. Late 90's I was pretty heavy in an online forum. We had a bunch of bullies that dominated the forums. I took a lot of crap from them just like here. The owners decided that they would have a convention. As it was in my hometown I decided to go. Got to meet most of them there. How pleasant, Not an ill word was spoken Never had issues with them after that. ( I used to be a bouncer and body guard)
It seems the biggest in toughest on the forums and in game really do sit on the couch in moms basement.

[Kiryuin Ragyo]

Oh dat community... some one mentioned some relations with OP's mom and...

Edited by Kiryuin Ragyo, 04 January 2015 - 03:44 AM.

[StraferX]

Eh well CW is a different animal it is war and all with the slaying of worlds and stuff, sort of meant to be by what ever means necessary but exploiting is just lame at any level. If your getting roflstomped hit eject 4 times then sit back and watch and take notes to see what your doing wrong then develop counter measures.

Outside of comp play the regular servers should be a kinder funner environment but I will blame ELO, what elo is a lie. I understand what you mean that people are just down right ignorant and hateful, I get that a bunch. Every time I join a game I start with "Gl Hf and God Bless from the Seraphim @ seekhim.com" or "Battle with Honor and God Bless" Most stuff I get is just fun like Hey wait is this Christian Mingle? or dude that sounds like a gay site or Hail Thor or Odin or random god of the day. I enjoy this bring it on. Sometimes I get the "your a loser don't you know god isn't real" or "your fake jesus crap is not welcome hear" Well what ever bro I came to play and offer a nice salutation of welcome and I would be glad to talk to you about my Jesus anytime you like however right now put your dukes up and lets rumble.

I will say that I have met a lot of good people here and honor is still here, I have played with folk and had a nice dog fight in canyon, both of us under 40% and the E backed off a cliff and got legged, I dropped down face to face, both nodded and hit R then called it a day and I have had people do the same to me and just left me for LRM fodder.

As for those who at the end of the match after I have had my teeth kicked in by a nohit firestarter and a daily high score of 8 and you ask me "Where is your God now" lol He is right here beside me in the cockpit saying well for petes sake you doof bucket, you JJ right into that fatlas 78.9 alpha right to the core then offered him your backside as you fleed. L2Twist and don't face 2 face with someone double your weight, weave and dodge son you'll do better next time.

At the end of the day play to win, Battle with Honor and have fun but remember that until the ELO is fixed or that newb must go through 30 days of training until released to the hounds "Do hard things but Use kind words"

[Lily from animove]

play apb relaode,d get known to what rude really is.

[Gattsus]

Please read this topic I started about VOIP and handle of harassment. Some answers will surprise you.

I summarized some of the most notable answers on the first post.

http://mwomercs.com/...90#entry3971090

[KuroNyra]

Blueduck, on 03 January 2015 - 06:30 PM, said:

Update: TX for some nice discussion and manners people, helped renew my faith in the player base somewhat.

I understand that there is some genuine frustration around here and in game recently. Certainly both IS and Clan pilots have had their annoyances with the maps and balance but the toxicity has just been increasing exponentially.

In game today I played with a team of PUGs that were trashed talked and stomped into the ground by a competitive team that frankly should have shown extreme sportsmanship. As an example in my unit we let randoms open the door when they are really having issues and encourage them to try again or join a unit. Is it really that rewarding to completely stomp and humiliate new and random people?

Likewise on here and in game no one is sympathetic to the other sides view in that:

1) Is it really fair or fun to take snipe a team to death with nothing but ppcs

2) or to counter this by doing nothing but 4 groups of 12 man stormcrow rushes?

Are you really that biased or frankly unsportsmanlike to see that its fun when both sides have a fair chance to win? Do we really have to call each other names and curse at them over the forums which simply shows how insignificant and dumb we are?

Consider this, if you keep smashing people in one sided victories and humiliating new players, there isn't going to be anyone to play with. Meaning all this work you put into the game will be completely fruitless.

With that, perhaps we could all try a little bit harder to think what is best for the game rather than just our win count. Try to think what will make it most fun and fair rather than just what gets us more kills.

Sadly, butthurts prefer to keep there toys and broke the one of the opponent.
There is also the wannabe-trolls who create flamewars. Talking about stuff they don't even use.


Clanners insultins IS because they are "biased toward IS Mech" and vice-versa.
Since the CW, it has become a trollfest.

[LordBraxton]

Blueduck, on 03 January 2015 - 08:34 PM, said:

My friend, I completed a physics doctorate program over a 6 year period while teaching. In terms of demoralizing art school has nothing on that. I was around when 1/4 of engineering classes were demolished by the curve and people learned they were not coming back next year. I learned over this time that I had developed a thick skin but that most things in life aren't worth being an a$$ about.

And I don't know if whales drive this game. A lot of people in my unit might spend $20 bucks once or twice, or buy some premium time.

They have some mechanics that allow for smaller transactions.

A little off topic but, trust me, real art education is much harsher than engineering.

Art (including all medias such as music) is the only higher education route that includes competitive grading.

Engineers might fail because the work is too difficult.

Some art students WILL fail, because there are only so many passing grades that will go around.

SOMEBODY is going to fail.

This creates a brutal\competitive\backstabbing culture within the programs.

Oftentimes anyway.

(Not saying engineering\physics etc. arent incredibly challenging, you just dont have to worry about your study partners trying to get you to fail.)

Edited by LordBraxton, 04 January 2015 - 10:45 AM.

[Star Wolves Admin Account]

LordBraxton, on 04 January 2015 - 10:44 AM, said:

A little off topic but, trust me, real art education is much harsher than engineering.

Art (including all medias such as music) is the only higher education route that includes competitive grading.

Engineers might fail because the work is too difficult.

Some art students WILL fail, because there are only so many passing grades that will go around.

SOMEBODY is going to fail.

This creates a brutal\competitive\backstabbing culture within the programs.

Oftentimes anyway.

(Not saying engineering\physics etc. arent incredibly challenging, you just dont have to worry about your study partners trying to get you to fail.)

I understand about the backstabbing in art school. That does unfortunately happen in the sciences and engineering as well but not quite as much with the students. Its a long drawn out 6-7 year slog where the students tend not to stab each other in the back so much as rival professors will try to sabotage eachother's students. I unfortunately experienced that and you do not know what terror is until you realize that someone with power is out to get you and there is nothing you can do about directly. I suffered a year of hell before my major professor was able to work the politics to solve the problem. There were trashing my research to build theirs up, and unfortunately life is unfair like that sometimes. Granted it just ended up making them look stupid but still I lost a lot of time.

In the end you had to deal with the backstabbing, peer review, as well as a level of mathematics and experimental work that had no direct solution and did not allow the same level open ended interpretation you see in the arts. The question is did your hypothesis and theory reproduce experiment in the end.

Edited by Blueduck, 04 January 2015 - 11:04 AM.

[Xx Mechwarrior xX]

Been playing pugs since I started, a week or so ago. Since then I have been called blinded, stupid and screamed at over the voice. I have since turned off chat and voice which is really to bad cause it would be nice to know what is goin on with the "team" but as I don't feel like getting yelled at by some elitest jerk, I would rather it just be off for pugs.

[cSand]

VELILLENUS

LEVEL 78 NECROMANCER

Edited by cSand, 03 February 2016 - 12:45 PM.