119 replies to this topic

[Widowmaker1981]

1/1/1/1 with no tommage limit would suck - i am jacks complete lack of variety, even more so than now.. only bit of thought required is Kitfox or Adder for clan side, for example.

1/1/1/1 while keeping the tonnage limit would work better, but im still opposed to it because it harshly forces light mech specialists to derp about in assaults, and forces heavy mech specialists to derp at driving a light.. Im an assault pilot, through and through, but i can pilot heavies perfectly OK. i SUCK at lights, so i sacrifice my assault mech and run 3 heavies and a medium (as IS anyway), so i dont hamstring my team in a light i dont enjoy and am bad at piloting (and am unlikely to improve on much due to above mentioned lack of enjoyment)

However i DO think limiting drop decks to 1 of each chassis (has to be chassis, not variant or it has 0 effect on clans) would be a very good thing, but ONLY after either releasing some lighter clan mechs that aren't total garbage (Arctic Cheetah, Huntsman, Viper, Shadowcat are your options there) or fixing the garbage mechs with quirks (and im not talking about 5% energy heat per arm on the nova. its not even close to enough)

[Lily from animove]

Bigbacon, on 06 January 2015 - 05:43 PM, said:

they will never do 1/1/1/1 but i think it would extremely interesting to see it tried.

because you want to see every CLAN dropdeck being DWf, TBR, SCR, whatever? I don't at least.
And IS will probbaly be atlas and Crabs everywhere, becaue you don't need to save tonnage in the assault class for bringing other mechs.

Edited by Lily from animove, 07 January 2015 - 04:03 AM.

[Nightshade24]

Wait a minute...

1/1/1/1...

That'll force the IS to only use 1 firestarter and 1 thunderbolt instead of 3 thunderbolts or 3 firestarters and what ever other mech.


PLEASE MAKE IT 1/1/1/1! I want to play CW again!

(I have not a single problem using clans lights, meds, and assaults... besides the fact I have no clan heavy yet but in 12 days I'm getting all 3 mad dogs!)

[Joseph Mallan]

Kyocera, on 06 January 2015 - 05:35 PM, said:

I'm not a fan of CW, only played a few games and backed out due to the lack of playability for solo players.

What I have observed in game and on these here forums is complaints of light rushes, the TDR-9S and unholy trinity clan loadouts, especially where stacking some of them is concerned.

I haven't come across anything that suggests the same (so forgive me for being too lazy to search) but wouldn't bringing in a 1/1/1/1 drop deck over a tonnage limit perhaps suit CW a bit better?

That is of course 1 light, 1 medium, 1 heavy and 1 assault mech in each drop deck, regardless of the tonnage.

This has quite a lot of benefits. It prevents stacking lights, it only allows 1 TDR per deck and it also forces clanners out of multiple SCR/TBR decks.

Now I know tonnage limits are the more "lore" way to go about things but in light of many gamer's inability not to stack things and just exploit every little thing they possibly can to simply win at all costs, would moving to 1/1/1/1 go some way to fixing this?

Anyway as I say I'm not a CW player at the moment but I thought I'd still throw in my thoughts nonetheless.

The problem with that is it is even more restrictive than a Drop Deck of 240. I am a fan of less restrictions, I understand that would let players like me bring 2 Atlas a King Crab and a Battlemaster, but I am an Assault pilot after all.

[RolfS]

I think 1/1/1/1 is a bad idea. I only have the thunderbolt that I am elite on, every other IS chassis is basic for me. With 1/1/1/1 I suddenly need to master 4 different IS mech chassis and probably additional ones becuase meta game changes.

Instead of trying to destroy the game further, use restrictions that make it easier to play and work with Lore. For instance how many times have you seen Jade Falcons drop with Summoner? I like the Summoner but only because it looks good, as stats go it is worse than timber wolf and hellbringer.

If there should be a limit to what you can bring I suggest hard coding one or two mech slots to faction specific mechs. It stops people from bringing 3 thunderbolt-9S while making battles versus specific factions different.

Hence Clan Jade Falcons would be forced to bring a summoner a kit-fox and two mechs of a players choice, while Clan Wolf would be forced to bring Timber Wolf and an Adder and two mechs of a players choice.

There is also a lot that can be said about maps which aren't planet specific. For instance shouldn't heat be roughly the same on all maps on a single planet?

[Bigbacon]

Widowmaker1981, on 07 January 2015 - 02:29 AM, said:

1/1/1/1 while keeping the tonnage limit would work better, but im still opposed to it because it harshly forces light mech specialists to derp about in assaults, and forces heavy mech specialists to derp at driving a light.. Im an assault pilot, through and through, but i can pilot heavies perfectly OK. i SUCK at lights, so i sacrifice my assault mech and run 3 heavies and a medium (as IS anyway), so i dont hamstring my team in a light i dont enjoy and am bad at piloting (and am unlikely to improve on much due to above mentioned lack of enjoyment)

but CW is bigboyhardcoreinyoface mode... L2P .....

I hate assaults as much as you seem to but I'll bring the only one I am comfortable using in CW if needed. I'm either going to have fun or not fun based on other factors, not my mech selection.

Oh and I am pretty much unlikely to improve in skill in the game at all, I've hit my ceiling.

Edited by Bigbacon, 07 January 2015 - 04:55 AM.

[Hardin4188]

Aside from it being silly that a dropship would only have one slot for each chassis you would be hurting yourself and your team if you didn't chose the highest tonnage from each class. Why would you bring an Awesome if you could bring an Atlas with ecm? Yes the community asked for tonnage, don't go back to the old idea.

[Kuritaclan]

RolfS, on 07 January 2015 - 04:46 AM, said:

Hence Clan Jade Falcons would be forced to bring a summoner a kit-fox and two mechs of a players choice, while Clan Wolf would be forced to bring Timber Wolf and an Adder and two mechs of a players choice.

Do you see were the problem in your philosophy is? Look @ my post #33. You will set wolf per player on a advantage of 5tonnes per light and 5t per heavy mech. 10t @ 12 players equals a bonus of 120t. This is like an assault and a light for free or two heavy mechs.

Min/Max-Player will kick you in the nuts for such an idea. High ELO Players will exploid this advantages as there are no morning. At least would you say running a heavy wave with the armor added of a thirteenth mech is a clear advantag not even counting, that a TBR is the crown of all mechs. Also the SMN will stand forever a step behind of dat Timby, because this is the upper border of balance if you heard Russ talking about this 75t mech. On the short end of the stick as it stands now Timby could outequip the SMN and exploit his Loadout (set by hardpoints, e/b/m slots and tonnage) easy.

And this would only be one Relationship, that isn't fair if i look at it.

Edited by Kuritaclan, 07 January 2015 - 06:14 AM.

[Karl Streiger]

Joseph Mallan, on 07 January 2015 - 04:44 AM, said:

The problem with that is it is even more restrictive than a Drop Deck of 240. I am a fan of less restrictions, I understand that would let players like me bring 2 Atlas a King Crab and a Battlemaster, but I am an Assault pilot after all.

Same here - mediums and assaults all the time - I'm not so glad about heavys (the mobility of assaults mixed with the fire power of mediums.... doesn't work for me )
- only have Catapract - because its a Catapract and the Thunderbolt - because its a T-bolt. The only Mech in the heavy segment i did buy because of need was the Dragon - well an this thing is obsolete.

Maybe they should use a lance drop weight - (160-250t per player) = 640-1000t - (yes I know that the current minimum is 140t- but i call it "unfair" because the light specialist - can drop with 4 light mechs and the Cicada as a medium plays like a light - but for the size - the assault specalist can't drop with 4 assaults

Edited by Karl Streiger, 07 January 2015 - 05:28 AM.

[Ace Selin]

So the people who play the meta now (because they are often forced to do it) will simply get the current meta for each weight class. Still wont bring diversity to CW.

Edited by Ace Selin, 07 January 2015 - 05:42 AM.

[Kuritaclan]

Karl Streiger, on 07 January 2015 - 05:28 AM, said:

Maybe they should use a lance drop weight - (160-250t per player) = 640-1000t - (yes I know that the current minimum is 140t- but i call it "unfair" because the light specialist - can drop with 4 light mechs and the Cicada as a medium plays like a light - but for the size - the assault specalist can't drop with 4 assaults

As i would think this idea of traded tonnage between a 12 man sounds nice - it wouldn't be fair to every group which drops with lesser people in the normal cw queue. Since what you would need to do to overcome the advantage a 12 man group can help a good heavy player fill up his 4 heavy drops with the spare of like a medium guy for example isn't balancable. Ok the disadvantage would be that you have in most cases waves with mechs of different weightclasses, but you have the coordination anyway and also pugs do not really say first wave this tonnageclass,you and you go with ecm and you go for backup lrms. Hell this would even bring up a greater skillgap since the unitplayers can play mechs they are advanced in while pugis small groups can't compensate this advantage.

You could name this the hardcore mod of cw. IF such a thing comes well i give it a go, if only 12 man groups can choose this queue. I'm ok with it. But if so since they go away from "usual cw" and dry out this main players to make a own thing, hell if you don't find a match, you have to w8 and or suck it up and go back into normal group queue. Unslles you don't have 12 opponents you don't change planets.

[Alex Warden]

we have already been through this several times, especially PRIOR to CW ... 4x1 was PGI´s initial plan, but too many ppl complained they won´t be able to play this way, because they didn´t have one mech of each class, or were focussed on one weight class only (stubbornness of players )

so PGI dropped that plan and came up with tonnage limited dropdecks...

you know how it is, there´s always some people who are being screwed, but i guess with the tonnage limits it´s less bad than with 4x1....

sure, it would make sense, and i´d have ZERO problems to build a deck in which ever way, but i´m one of those who played this game long and frequently enough to have the stuff i need... i know at least 2 people in my unit who also play long enough, but were pretty focused on 2 or even 1 weight class, and those guys were already scared when PGI announced the 1/1/1/1 limit last year...

@shared tonnage limit... theoretically okay, but only doable for full 12 premade groups... the matchmaking is already bad enough for solo/ small groups... i guess the MM would really have some trouble to fit in the correct tonnages for partial groups to match the total company limit... i doubt it would work...

Edited by Alex Warden, 07 January 2015 - 06:03 AM.

[Karl Streiger]

They had this challange some time back - were you get an bonus for drop weight - it was much calculation because you didn't had a drop weight calculator - afaik - the drop weight per mech was reduced with rising numbers of participating players in the deck.

Same could be made for CW.
in the worst case - one side consist of a team 12 solo player with a total company drop weight of 3360 tons. (280 per player) vs a 12 men team - with a drop weight of 2760 tons (230 per player)

Think it is a fair trade for the better communication of the 12 men team. An aspect that was ignored for to long

[MechWarrior9376871]

Its a good idea but would be a barrier to some new players who just started. On my experimental alt account I only have 4 mechs. 3 TDRs and a spider. The Spider is not elited because I only have 1. When you are just starting out you need all your resources to get 3 chasis of the same mech in order to elite them.

Yes people can use trial mechs but those are going to be at zero proficiency and are somewhat suboptimal builds.

[Kuritaclan]

@ Karl Steiger
yes and now - yes you can overcome with tonnage limits linked to groupnumbers disadvantages withing groupcount, but this would only stay true in a likely even elo. And this is something you can not set appart. Also why you shouldnt drop with 9 people in the que and 3 have to go as randoms, maybee you can get them with the right timing into your drop. And whats now? - Idk how you would balance the randoms add in? Have they full tonntage free choice or in tonnage 35+55+75+100=265t?

Edited by Kuritaclan, 07 January 2015 - 06:22 AM.

[EvilCow]

Rather than classes limitations I would keep tonnage cap and forbid more than one mech of the same type.

Definition of type:

Normal mechs: a variant, so a RVN-3L is different from a RVN-2X. You cannot bring two RVN-2X.
Omnimechs: mapped on pods, so no more than one "Stormcrow Left Arm A" pod for example but you could still mix them and bring 3 different crows.

Classes limitations would be too boring, I hate assaults for example.

Edited by EvilCow, 07 January 2015 - 06:43 AM.

[MechWarrior9376871]

I have a solution. You can choose to either use 1/1/1/1 unlimited tonnage or have a very restrictive tonnage deck like 150-220.

Of course then we would get 4 Stormcrow deck in every meta match:(

[Bigbacon]

how about you pick you mech and it drops with no armor or weapons and then you need to run around the map and collect them.

they can hide a quad damage and mega health somewhere.

[Karl Streiger]

Bigbacon, on 07 January 2015 - 07:06 AM, said:

how about you pick you mech and it drops with no armor or weapons and then you need to run around the map and collect them.

they can hide a quad damage and mega health somewhere.

or you can buy new equipment - after you have killed something - first you start with a locust - oh wait thats MWLL

[Bigbacon]

Karl Streiger, on 07 January 2015 - 07:14 AM, said:

or you can buy new equipment - after you have killed something - first you start with a locust - oh wait thats MWLL

but only if you return to the dropship store.