37 replies to this topic

[Nehkrosis]

So, how are we going to deal with this exactly?

[CyclonerM]

I fear we are not dealing with it. People are burned out of CW and are not playing really much.. I keep dropping as much as i can

[_Comrade_]

Nothing we can do, CW in its current state is s failure and most people have left the game. Clans no longer have the numbers to fight , IS mercs can have fun ghost dropping on clan planets. Created an alt account and playing IS at least brings a little bit more action

Edited by Grimwill, 09 January 2015 - 06:48 AM.

[Carl Wrede]

Grimwill, on 09 January 2015 - 06:47 AM, said:

Nothing we can do, CW in its current state is s failure and most people have left the game. Clans no longer have the numbers to fight , IS mercs can have fun ghost dropping on clan planets. Created an alt account and playing IS at least brings a little bit more action

So the game was fun and working as it should while you clans were advancing but as soon as your advance stalled and we started to counterattack the game became a failure?

[AlmightyAeng]

Carl Wrede, on 09 January 2015 - 07:12 AM, said:

So the game was fun and working as it should while you clans were advancing but as soon as your advance stalled and we started to counterattack the game became a failure?

More like "whichever side, Clan OR IS, has vastly more players it's impossible to stop the number of ghost drops which occur"...so while Jade Falcon started out winning and enjoying life while we fought and watched planets go byebye, it's now reversed and THEY are having less fun, like we did starting out.

Edited by Ghost Badger, 09 January 2015 - 07:13 AM.

[Vassago Rain]

But you all told me that clans had the most players, and all your players were simply elite. That's why you had 90% win ratio. Are you telling me that you're BAD, and that the clan userbase was heavily exaggerated?

Are you saying that you were only taking those planets because CW has so few players, and all the best units flocked to you?

My god! Who'd have thunk it.

[_Comrade_]

Carl Wrede, on 09 January 2015 - 07:12 AM, said:

So the game was fun and working as it should while you clans were advancing but as soon as your advance stalled and we started to counterattack the game became a failure?

No it was fun when the game was balanced , PGI needs to limit the number of merc units that can sign with a faction

Players are leaving the game , CW will soon be nothing but 20 min waits for ghost drops......enjoy fighting turrets

Edited by Grimwill, 09 January 2015 - 08:31 AM.

[Nehkrosis]

I do agree that tbh, we were smoking the IS, and now that a sizable chunk of Merc units have sided with the FRR, it seems largely one-sided.

this will need to be addressed by PGI, if CW and MWO in general is to have a future.

[Amarus Cameron]

I think our loses have less to do with them and more to do with us. I think we let the idea of being clan go to our heads. We started with some great merc units because we had great bonuses and they get to play in clan tech. Well the honeymoon is over, the FRR has some great bonuses and IS mechs are not as shoddy as they once were. We get nowhere by pontificating on what we cannot control. Strong merc units left, we have to deal with that.

So now the question is how to we attract more to our cause? How do we push forward glorious in victory and honorable in defeat. I have seen so many comments and posts about how CW is dead, I would say no, not at all. I would also say that these posts do nothing but make us look like a bunch of whiner babies. If you cannot post something that contributes to our success then why post, vent your frustrations personally with your clanmates off the official forums, lest you dishonor your unit and your clan.

I believe units within their clans need to work together, not caring who holds the world but just dropping together for the ultimate success of the clan. Do you think every galaxy in the clan always liked working together, don't be naive, we are all humans, vat born or otherwise, and we need to deal with that. So you can either talk about what PGI needs to do and accept your defeat, or you can circle the wagons and talk about what we can do to win for ourselves. That type of determination itself will attract more to our glorious cause. Show them what you were made for!


TL;DR
1) Accept that this is our problem, not merc units' or PGIs
2) Stop venting frustration on the official forums, keep that to teammates who understand and care
3) More communication between units and clans for coordinated assaults
4) Attract more to our cause through honorable conduct in victory as well as defeat

Thank you for your time, and Good Hunting Clansmen,
Amarus Cameron

[Nehkrosis]

this ^^^^
i approve of this

[Revis Volek]

This problem will not stop though until the MERC CONTRACTS are dealt with. At this time whoever had/has the most numerous Mercs aligned to their faction gains the most ground.

The Mercs were fighting for Green chicken and Bug Bear and those clans made great strides in little time.

Now the Mercs are fighting for Viking Snake and Blue (ball) Fist and as you can see the Planets are just flipping to the other side now. There is no secret to it no master plan. They just are a LARGE Unit and have many members...so whever they go will gain ground. Anywhere they are not will be stalled or loose territory.

CW is now MERC WARFARE....if you dont have them you are not going to have any fun.

Now that the MERCs are back with GB we will see a large Planet grab from GB this weekend.

[Crzy]

Edited by Crzy, 10 January 2015 - 05:25 AM.

[Alexander Steel]

Who the heck are the Smoke Adders? Is that like some combo of Smoke Jag and Star Adder?

Nehkrosis, on 09 January 2015 - 10:46 AM, said:

I do agree that tbh, we were smoking the IS, and now that a sizable chunk of Merc units have sided with the FRR, it seems largely one-sided.

this will need to be addressed by PGI, if CW and MWO in general is to have a future.

They addressed it by who they give money rewards to.

[Osis]

Alexander Steel, on 09 January 2015 - 12:16 PM, said:

Who the heck are the Smoke Adders? Is that like some combo of Smoke Jag and Star Adder?

Hail,

Theta Galaxy - Clan Star Adder - The Smoke Adders (Community Warfare - Clan Smoke Jaguar)

Because of the limited options on the Clan side of Community Warfare, we picked the Clan with the smallest user base to bolster the other groups.

Seyla,

[Abivard]

The largest and most active comp Merc units have been on the clans side from almost the beginning, most noticeably in CGB. Some have switched colors for a short time but their actions have always benefited CGB.

At the FRR's present population height the largest merc unit working for us is ranked about 9th in size of units.(there can be more than one unit sharing a rank in population)


The Largest FRR house Units are but a fraction of the size of the AVERAGE clan loyalists unit. In fact if all the FRR house units were to combine, they would still have less numbers overall than CGBI.

Of the 19 units listed at rank 10 or above, 8 are non is/clan border factions, 4 are CGB, 4 are steiner, 1 wolf, 1 kurita and 1 FRR, the FRR unit is EU based.

Of the 6 units rank 5 and above, 3 are davion, 1 steiner and 2 CGB.

Edited by Abivard, 09 January 2015 - 05:17 PM.

[XSurusX]

The issue isn't with player skill (although it is a factor), or mech balance. The issue is mostly due to population balance.

Prior to this past week, the balance of CW was pretty decent (with the exception of FRR who had a horrible population). The Clans were pressing, but this was mostly due to the ease of focusing their smaller populations. Most clans only had one decent planet to attack, so 100% of their forces were given to that planet. The IS factions, who shared more borders, had their populations split across multiple fronts. Even though the IS had a larger population overall than the clans, their population was more spread out. When you also consider the clans refusal to attack each other, and you can see that the clans were just overall more focused with their efforts than the IS.

When the larger merc units signed up with CGB, their population inflated, as did their territory. I think this action is what prompted the whole 'nerf clans' mentality that surrounded CW. The merc units were a focused, competetive force that expanded CGB's holdings by a large amount.

With the contract offered by FRR, we saw the merc units leaving the clans to resign with the IS, as well as a number of highly organized units leaving the clans to side with the IS. Now the already low population of the clans is even lower, with the large and organized units mostly fighting along the IS/Clan front. It seems CJF has the lowest population, but CW suffers the most as they are right in the middle of the Steiner/FRR front so they've been losing two planets a day with little defense.

Just because there are units that are loyal to certain factions, doesn't mean those units participate in CW. My unit is about 140 members but we've rarely had more than a 12-man running CW, and now my unit has unfortunately abandonded CW. Personally I don't care about wins or loses, I just like to shoot things for an extended period of time.

I think a lot of the casual players/units have just gotten tired with CW and until new changes are made I think we'll just continue to see the participation dwindle.

[Aresye]

Carl Wrede, on 09 January 2015 - 07:12 AM, said:

So the game was fun and working as it should while you clans were advancing but as soon as your advance stalled and we started to counterattack the game became a failure?

Before it was fun because both IS and Clans both had a decent number of Merc units. For the sake of argument I'm just going to use the following as definitions:

-Merc Units: Units that don't have a "favorite" faction and/or side. For example, a unit that spends 1-2 months with CGB, switches to IS for 2 weeks, then spends another month with CGB would NOT be considered a Merc Unit.

-Permanent Units: Units that spend the majority of their time playing for 1 faction, whether by permanent contract and/or long durations between contracts, with the majority of contracts spent in one particular faction.

Most permanent units tend to encompass a large number of players (100+) that are loyal and aligned with their chosen faction. Examples include: CGBI, JFP, CWI, SRoT, HHoD, etc.

Because of their popularity and large numbers, a good majority of players in these permanent units are either average, or below average in skill. They're there for the lore and/or immersion in the BT universe, not for upper tier competitive play.

On the other hand, most (if not all) Merc units are comprised by competitive teams. Examples include: Lords, EmP, -MS-, SJR, 228, etc.

Because they are looking for fights and are not/marginally interested in lore, their contracts are unpredictable and don't have any ties to any particular unit/faction. They also tend to be smaller in number, however the numbers they do have are at a vastly higher competitive level than the players that make up the majority of the permanent units.

So to go back to the beginning, it was fun both because it was new, and also because most of the merc units were split between factions and both sides.

The Clans made headway due to large numbers of permanent units backed up with the strength of a few merc units, but the progress forward has not been as drastic or rapid as the progress (or lack thereof) backwards this past week. This is because a lot of permanent units in the IS were engaged in IS vs IS battles, leaving only a few merc units to defend against the Clan invasion. The merc units could hold their own against most of the Clan's merc units, however the numbers advantage was provided by the Clan permanent units.

Nowadays, the Clans still have the same number of permanent units, but 2 big things have changed:
1. Most of the permanent IS units have stopped fighting each other and have started focusing on the bigger threat up north.
2. The large majority of all merc units have switched to IS.

This has left the majority of Clans with only permanent units filled with average players, and they have neither a skill nor numbers advantage against the IS side.

It isn't the counter-attack that has changed our minds about CW, but rather the nature of the counter-attack. It shows a gaping flaw in how balance can change on the fly based solely on where the majority of competitive teams align, and I personally don't think an experience designed around lore works very well when smaller competitive teams have more of an influence on the entire map than larger, more permanent teams.

In other words, it basically shows that it doesn't matter what you want out of CW. You're at the mercy of however the competitive teams want to do it. They dictate how everyone's overall experience can go, and I think that's a big problem.

Edited by Aresye, 09 January 2015 - 05:52 PM.

[Grendel408]

Keep up the good fight folks. Here at BSI, we lost a few members due to CW and it's issues in general. As far as contracts go with us... I post a POLL to have folks vote on renewing the current contract (Davion currently), or signing a new contract with another faction... that POLL if chosen to sign a new contract, we hold another to vote on the next Faction to align with.

I find my way of choosing contracts fair for my unit, but in all honesty. CW needs work, new maps, new modes (those are coming according to Jan Road Map), and some more balancing and rewards thrown into it. Right now, the current award system for winning the match is too low. Yes, we can gain a good ton of XP and Cbills for performing very well in a CW Match, but honestly... I can gain much more currently in Public Queue faster than with CW.

Got my fingers crossed PGI does some serious work to entice folks to come back to CW and encourage those wary of it to try it out.

[Mechsniper]

Its not the fault of the merc units to be successful in the game we are presented. The same tactics we are succssful at were used by all others as well. CI is acting as a defacto comgaurd ROM controlled unit would. Comstars interests are seldom aired in the open and are somewhat mysterious to the outsider. I submit that one large issue is that too many planets are open for the number of players on at certain times. Perhaps an algorithm opening sufficient planets to keep the players in CW busy at any time would help. This is only one of CW's issues though. Other modes in different maps are needed such as full on skirmish and perhaps search/destroy and resource missions. This will keep one meta from ruling all. Other issues certainly exist as well, just quit blaming it all on us Mercs.

[RedDevil]

I think if everyone got organized, we could take territory back. But to be honest, CW is just too much waiting for not enough reward. The public queue is a lot more fun.

I stopped playing CW while we were still rolling IS :/