61 replies to this topic

[Escef]

Dawnstealer, on 20 January 2015 - 07:44 PM, said:

I don't even think melee would be that hard to implement. You just have it as a weapon with a range of, say, 5m that does X damage (where X is a % of the mech's weight). Then you just have the animation.

That might work in a 2D fighting game or just about anything in the 16-bit era of console gaming, but people that I've talked to that have done such work say that while that a simple solution like that would be easy to implement, it would play like garbage.

Edited by Escef, 20 January 2015 - 07:54 PM.

[Scratx]

Dawnstealer, on 20 January 2015 - 07:44 PM, said:

I don't even think melee would be that hard to implement. You just have it as a weapon with a range of, say, 5m that does X damage (where X is a % of the mech's weight). Then you just have the animation.

Not if you want it to look better than garbage, and play better than garbage.

Either they do melee/melee weapons right or it's just outright best to leave them out entirely.

[TheSilken]

I want the Annihilator:

Edited by TheSilken, 20 January 2015 - 08:08 PM.

[Dawnstealer]

Bah - I've seen several non-2D games that implement a punch or a knife-stab as an attack. It's not some mythical attack-mode that's never been pulled off in any game before. You're making it sound like a moon-landing.

[MeiSooHaityu]

Adam Steiner Axman. Needs to happen.

[Metus regem]

TheSilken, on 20 January 2015 - 08:07 PM, said:

I want the Annihilator:

Oh the bad bad things they can do in a city fight....

But I want the:



Coyotl 40t 119kph first omni mech.

[DONTOR]

I'm for Hatchetman and Axeman! More so than I ever was for the Urban mech, even though i will still get one.

[SgtMagor]

lets go all out and bring out the Axman http://fc02.devianta...uns-d51vvbw.jpg

[Skarlock]

Dawnstealer, on 21 January 2015 - 07:46 AM, said:

Bah - I've seen several non-2D games that implement a punch or a knife-stab as an attack. It's not some mythical attack-mode that's never been pulled off in any game before. You're making it sound like a moon-landing.

The mechanics would probably be fairly easy to code on the client side and server side, the animations, not so easy since every mech is different, and each mech would need to be animated at least slightly, if not entirely different. That's quite a lot of work to get every mech to punch properly. QA would take a ton of work, as it always does in any development cycle, and balancing it would also take a ton of work. Now, I may be mistaken (and please correct me if I'm wrong) but I believe a punch from an Atlas or any 100 ton mech would do 20 points of damage, and cost zero heat. That's basically giving it a free AC/20 no ammo attack that only works at point blank range. Sure, the Atlas is a slow mech, but 20 damage for no heat still needs some careful consideration when you're just giving it to a mech like that for free.

Kicks are also part of the melee attacks you can make, and they have a chance to knock down opponents (not sure about punches knocking down, it's been forever since I played table top). I'm pretty new to this game, but from what I have heard, knockdowns did previously exist in this game as a possible result of collisions, and they were completely removed due to numerous gameplay and server issues they caused. A lot of questions would need to be answered and a lot of potential imbalance issues fixed, like how often could you melee attack, would the range be dependent on the size of your mech, would they have a chance to knock down, what's an appropriate damage amount, etc. That also would take a ton of time and consideration. Think about all the potential ways to abuse these mechanics, and they will have to have solutions and safeguards implemented to prevent things like the 90 kph battlemaster with an xl400 that simply runs up, kicks, knocks down, and then wubs a dire wolf to death like it was nothing, or a 3 light mech wolf pack that kicks stuff as a group until one of them scores a knockdown and then they kill their hapless target.

[shellashock]

Skarlock, on 21 January 2015 - 08:06 AM, said:

The mechanics would probably be fairly easy to code on the client side and server side, the animations, not so easy since every mech is different, and each mech would need to be animated at least slightly, if not entirely different. That's quite a lot of work to get every mech to punch properly. QA would take a ton of work, as it always does in any development cycle, and balancing it would also take a ton of work. Now, I may be mistaken (and please correct me if I'm wrong) but I believe a punch from an Atlas or any 100 ton mech would do 20 points of damage, and cost zero heat. That's basically giving it a free AC/20 no ammo attack that only works at point blank range. Sure, the Atlas is a slow mech, but 20 damage for no heat still needs some careful consideration when you're just giving it to a mech like that for free.

Kicks are also part of the melee attacks you can make, and they have a chance to knock down opponents (not sure about punches knocking down, it's been forever since I played table top). I'm pretty new to this game, but from what I have heard, knockdowns did previously exist in this game as a possible result of collisions, and they were completely removed due to numerous gameplay and server issues they caused. A lot of questions would need to be answered and a lot of potential imbalance issues fixed, like how often could you melee attack, would the range be dependent on the size of your mech, would they have a chance to knock down, what's an appropriate damage amount, etc. That also would take a ton of time and consideration. Think about all the potential ways to abuse these mechanics, and they will have to have solutions and safeguards implemented to prevent things like the 90 kph battlemaster with an xl400 that simply runs up, kicks, knocks down, and then wubs a dire wolf to death like it was nothing, or a 3 light mech wolf pack that kicks stuff as a group until one of them scores a knockdown and then they kill their hapless target.

Bingo. As cool as it would be to have melee in this game, it will take such a long time to get perfected and balanced properly that we might as well put the priority for this the same as the single player campaign PGI wants to make when *everything else* is done.

PS: I think knockdown/ collisions should be in-game once they get them fixed, but full scale melee should be left alone at least until we get weapon mechanics perfected

Edited by shellashock, 21 January 2015 - 08:15 AM.

[MATRAKA14]

Funky Bacon, on 20 January 2015 - 06:22 PM, said:

Hatchetman, the answer to our Catapult ear-size problem.

ROFL

[Avimimus]

I'd go for a Spector:
http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Spector

It would automatically have 10 extra heat (constant), built in ECM, and Alpha channels to make the 3d model 'semi-transparent'. Quite doable and wouldn't throw off the balance.

Another interesting one is the Emperor:
http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Emperor

Jump jet equipped assault, with two Ballistic equipped arms, 90 tons and five energy hardpoints.

[Brody319]

I go through all the work making this thread and no one uses it
http://mwomercs.com/...t-released-yet/

[AlmightyAeng]

Can we rename this thread to "Melee arrives on the battlefield?" I feel like that would open up more doors

[kapusta11]

I can't see why melee is such a problem in MWO, TES has pretty good melee with FPV for example, a bit too fast paced but that shouldn't be a problem in MWO.

[Davers]

Look at the Axeman's axe. It will make shooting the arm off ridiculously easy.

[kf envy]

you get your hatchetman as soon as i get some elementals with battle claws or even some omni pods that have claws and or talons hard points

[Otto Cannon]

[Frederick Steiner A F]

Proposal Melee: Allows mechs without weapons / ammunition further struggle participation, immersion perhaps a little better because melee is part of the Booklore.

2 types of attack possible a) arm b ) leg

-a) the arm of the mech performs a animated movement to represent the blow. You can trigger the attack by holding a button , similar to the Gauss mechanism requires a 2-3 sec summons (so no spamming possible), and can then be triggered within a short time frame . Is targeted with crosshair. Damage is calculated according to weight class. Lights-3 Med-5 Heavy-7 Asslt-10.
Alternatively, the targeted Mech taken screenshake for 1-2 sec. If the attacker misses, his mech might also get a 1-2sec Screenshake.
Release while walking at max 50 Kp/H possible?

b ) the leg of the 'Mechs performs a kick / walk motion as attack animation . Triggered also by hold a button , but here is the precharge time 3-6 sec(should be long so no spam is possible) . Is aimed via a crosshair , which may also appear after holding the charge button on leg height. Damage by weight class : Light-5 Med-8 Heavy-10 Asslt-15.
Alternatively, the kicked Mech taken upset shake (or can fall when hit from behind ) or Screenshake for 2-3 seconds , the attacking Mech falls if missing the targeted Mech / get shake / can not speed for 1-2 sec.
Execution only when standing or max 10Kp / H.

Values ​​are variable.

Animation of Kick or Punch shouldnt be hard to make. Bad use of the Mechanic may be adressed with changing the Preloadtime and Damagevalues.

One can dream.

[wanderer]

Quote

That might work in a 2D fighting game or just about anything in the 16-bit era of console gaming, but people that I've talked to that have done such work say that while that a simple solution like that would be easy to implement, it would play like garbage.

That's actually how it works in Team Fortress. Very well.