173 replies to this topic

[Bishop Steiner]

hmmm... I thought I had seen that left arm before......

Axeface, on 07 February 2015 - 09:21 AM, said:

Thats the kind of thing I was thinking yeh, looks much better and more like the concept imho, good job.
The 'mouth thing' should be shrunk down too though.

I'd be content if they simply made it into another cockpit pane so it served a purpose

[Deathlike]

Bishop Steiner, on 07 February 2015 - 09:06 AM, said:

Doubt it will have hitboxes equal to the Centurion, which tanks with an XL like a boss, due to monster arms, and it's hardpoints, are, in general, inferior, in part because it cannot use missiles. And they are mounted too low to be "great" PPC Carriers.

Real JJs I think would make it as effective as you hope, but I doubt hoverjets will be sufficient.

I'd think it (the shape and hitboxes) would be closer to a Firestarter, but obviously enlarged a little.

I don't think Cents in an XL is as great as you are suggesting. I think there's a certain speed level in a Centurion that makes them acceptable to justify an XL (mostly for getting in and out of trouble) and the last bit of changes in the hitboxes hasn't helped it.

A 275 engine in the Centurion doesn't seem to be enough IMO... it would have to reach the level of a 300XL in the YLW or even the stock speed/engine in the Centurion-D to justify it. There is a notion to aim for the LT of the Centurion these days... only to rid of the bulk of the SRM builds that are run and if it manages to side-core the mech out... the better. That and the loss of the missile bay protection is also contributing to this behavior. I wouldn't mind taking the threat out of a Centurion-AH that holds SRMs and AC20s, since I know that the AC20 isn't the primary goto weapon, but the SRM LT that is where the real damage is done... which has been true since the popularity of the Centurion in the first place.

Whatever I guess.

Edited by Deathlike, 07 February 2015 - 09:39 AM.

[Bishop Steiner]

Deathlike, on 07 February 2015 - 09:38 AM, said:

I'd think it (the shape and hitboxes) would be closer to a Firestarter, but obviously enlarged a little.

I don't think Cents in an XL is as great as you are suggesting. I think there's a certain speed level in a Centurion that makes them acceptable to justify an XL (mostly for getting in and out of trouble) and the last bit of changes in the hitboxes hasn't helped it.

A 275 engine in the Centurion doesn't seem to be enough IMO... it would have to reach the level of a 300XL in the YLW or even the stock speed/engine in the Centurion-D to justify it. There is a notion to aim for the LT of the Centurion these days... only to rid of the bulk of the SRM builds that are run and if it manages to side-core the mech out... the better. That and the loss of the missile bay protection is also contributing to this behavior. I wouldn't mind taking the threat out of a Centurion-AH that holds SRMs and AC20s, since I know that the AC20 isn't the primary goto weapon, but the SRM LT that is where the real damage is done... which has been true since the popularity of the Centurion in the first place.

Whatever I guess.

Look at the arms though. What makes the FS9 hitboxes work so well, aside form it's small side and speed is MASSIVE shoulder guards. The Victor, also. These have decent arms, but the shoulders won't intercept near the incoming damage.

And as for the XL in a Centy? Sorry to say I have been proving that myth a lie since CB, along with how easy it is to lose the RA. Any good YLW jock laughs about the lie of XL Centy Fragility. And my others usually pack a 255XL, and more firepower. My AH, for instance. Which is still a solid 600 damage, 3 kill mech.

Edited by Bishop Steiner, 07 February 2015 - 09:43 AM.

[Brody319]

I think the enforcer will just end up as a centurion without the shield arm.

[STEF_]

Brody319, on 07 February 2015 - 10:36 AM, said:

I think the enforcer will just end up as a centurion without the shield arm.

Without shield-arm, but with JJ and more hardpoints.

[Brody319]

Stefka Kerensky, on 07 February 2015 - 10:42 AM, said:

Without shield-arm, but with JJ and more hardpoints.

yea but lose a side torso and you lose half your guns.

least with the centurion it has some CT energy hardpoints to keep fighting. and I've seen what a good centurion pilot can do, will just keep twisting and soaking up damage, and dishing it back with CT energy hardpoints. this thing won't have the luxury of being able to lose both STs and get away.

[Bishop Steiner]

Stefka Kerensky, on 07 February 2015 - 10:42 AM, said:

Without shield-arm, but with JJ and more hardpoints.

Off the exceedingly limited info we have, my basic expectations can be broken down thusly:

Mobility: Enforcer.
-Faster and has Hoverjets^tm. (mind you, this is assuming it's not gimped in it's twist range or speed, or given a stupid terrain profile, like the Gargoyle)

Durability: Centurion.
-Famously tanky, good shield arms. Arms/STs from what we can tell on the ENF look OK; but not as good a proportion balance as the CN9.

Firepower: DRAW.
- The ENF will be better equipped for carrying energy weapons, as it's LT and LA hardpoints are much less limiting than the CT mounts on the CN9 (which conversely do give the Centy a zombie capability the ENF will lack) and could carry multiple PPC/Large Lasers, if desired. CN9 wins on being able to carry missiles, and has a decent number of hardpoints for that in all models. Ballistics is largely a draw, as both have the same restrictions (overall) due to tonnage and crit slot limitations in the RA. The ENF-5P will be able to break this some, due to LA ballistics, to, but those are limited by tonnage, and the CN9-AH has an advantage in being the only one able to carry an AC20.

Preliminary Conclusion:

The CN9, due to hitboxes and missiles, will be the better tanky brawler, with the ability to pack multiple SRM launchers, Zombie CT lasers, and a Medium Heavy to Heavy AC. The Enforcer will be a better Flanker/Skirmisher being a little less tough, but more mobile, and probably be best served with ballistics and low duration or pinpoint energy weapons.

[Davers]

Bishop Steiner, on 07 February 2015 - 08:54 AM, said:

some quick mods to the Enforcer, that I would suggest to the Modelers

for side by side comparo


AC Barrel should reach the bottom of the knee, when the arm is straight. Dome is modified to be more pronounced on the head, and lowered to make it less bug eyed.

Thoughts?

That gun arm is way too big. You would be able to shoot it and have your weapons recycle before the rest of it came around a corner!

[Bishop Steiner]

Davers, on 07 February 2015 - 10:59 AM, said:

That gun arm is way too big. You would be able to shoot it and have your weapons recycle before the rest of it came around a corner!

which makes it close to where the TRO art put it, or even the original concept art for MWO.

[STEF_]

Brody319, on 07 February 2015 - 10:49 AM, said:

yea but lose a side torso and you lose half your guns.

least with the centurion it has some CT energy hardpoints to keep fighting. and I've seen what a good centurion pilot can do, will just keep twisting and soaking up damage, and dishing it back with CT energy hardpoints. this thing won't have the luxury of being able to lose both STs and get away.

For this reason I hope it will has good hitboxes. The fact it looks like a Firestarter is a good thing. Let's see

[Brody319]

Stefka Kerensky, on 07 February 2015 - 11:04 AM, said:

For this reason I hope it will has good hitboxes. The fact it looks like a Firestarter is a good thing. Let's see

yea but it isn't running 151 kph. least I hope it wont, that would be terrifying.

[LordKnightFandragon]

pbiggz, on 06 February 2015 - 07:30 PM, said:

I will withhold judgement until i see it in game. I remember being extremely concerned that the direwolf had an enormous unshapely nose in comparison to the rest of its body, and it turned out to be PGI taking screenshots with a stupid wide angle lens or something like that.

The DWF just has an enormously gigantic everything. Now it looks like a massive moving box got put on the legs of a 6 year old....the nose is like that of a 747...just way to big overall...

It should be the height and overall size of a WHK.

[Brody319]

LordKnightFandragon, on 07 February 2015 - 11:37 AM, said:

The DWF just has an enormously gigantic everything. Now it looks like a massive moving box got put on the legs of a 6 year old....the nose is like that of a 747...just way to big overall...

It should be the height and overall size of a WHK.

Warhawk is off size too you know.

[STEF_]

Bishop Steiner, on 07 February 2015 - 10:58 AM, said:

Preliminary Conclusion:

The CN9, due to hitboxes and missiles, will be the better tanky brawler, with the ability to pack multiple SRM launchers, Zombie CT lasers, and a Medium Heavy to Heavy AC. The Enforcer will be a better Flanker/Skirmisher being a little less tough, but more mobile, and probably be best served with ballistics and low duration or pinpoint energy weapons.

Very good analsis and I agree.

Really need a strong medium skirmisher and flanker, tasks that I prefer over brawling.
That's why I want to be optimistic about Enforcer.

[LordKnightFandragon]

Davers, on 07 February 2015 - 10:59 AM, said:

That gun arm is way too big. You would be able to shoot it and have your weapons recycle before the rest of it came around a corner!

GOOD!!!!! Now MWO needs to go do the same thing to the:

Warhawk
Centurion
Mad Dog
Awesome(no, this does not mean Booblies on the Awesome)
Stormcrow

Edited by LordKnightFandragon, 07 February 2015 - 12:11 PM.

[Brody319]

I will probably pick up an Enforcer once its out for C-bills.

[LordKnightFandragon]

Brody319, on 07 February 2015 - 11:42 AM, said:

Warhawk is off size too you know.

Yeah, it should be the size of the Stormcrow, or no taller then a Mad Dog, and only barely wider....Its about the size of a Mad Dog, only bigger, buffer upper portion, much beefier legs, alot bigger guns and arms........

But basically all Clan mechs are 12m, aside from the Executioner and Garg who are like 15m......

DWF should only be the size of the WHK, just with a fatter Upper torso, same legs though.

https://www.google.c...52F%3B500%3B700

To bad that isnt how the DWF actually looks in game.

Edited by LordKnightFandragon, 07 February 2015 - 12:15 PM.

[C E Dwyer]

Bishop Steiner, on 06 February 2015 - 07:18 PM, said:

I actually really like the Panther, it doesn't look near as odd and gangly as the concept art, at least from that angle.

The Enforcer, especially the head,has a little too much Firestarter DNA, and the arms.... I really wish the weaponry was more impressive looking. In particular, I think the barrels need to be longer, especially on the AC.

You?

I love the Panther, as to the Enforcer, it looks more like the Enforcer from the TRO, though the head seems alittle more rounded, I think, if it has Ember DNA in it, that comes from the fact it looks alot different from its TRO form, but I like them both and looking forward to using both soon

[C E Dwyer]

Bishop Steiner, on 07 February 2015 - 11:02 AM, said:

which makes it close to where the TRO art put it, or even the original concept art for MWO.

I think that's due to poor perspective by the artist in the TRO

[MeiSooHaityu]

Bishop Steiner, on 07 February 2015 - 09:41 AM, said:

Look at the arms though. What makes the FS9 hitboxes work so well, aside form it's small side and speed is MASSIVE shoulder guards. The Victor, also. These have decent arms, but the shoulders won't intercept near the incoming damage.

And as for the XL in a Centy? Sorry to say I have been proving that myth a lie since CB, along with how easy it is to lose the RA. Any good YLW jock laughs about the lie of XL Centy Fragility. And my others usually pack a 255XL, and more firepower. My AH, for instance. Which is still a solid 600 damage, 3 kill mech.

I run XLs in all my Centurions. They are still rather tanky, and quick to boot.