39 replies to this topic

[Sagamore]

I love how the now defunct Section 8: Prejudice handled hot drops. Something similar, albeit more constrained, could work well for MWO.

See this video at the 3 minute mark:

Edited by Sagamore, 15 April 2015 - 11:09 PM.

[Raflik]

Quote

To help prevent drop zone camping, players would need to be able to pick their drop zones

And it's perfectly impleted.

YES YOU CAN CHANGE THE DROP ZONE YOU APPEAR!

Suprised?

Well of course it's not a big red button like for clans "Press to win" and you need at least 1 smart enough guy.
Let's call him... DROP COMMANDER!

Did you know that one guy like real commander can give order around, and select where mech should appear? To gain tactical advance, mech could spawn in the drop nearest open gate, and to defensive support he can order dropship to land not on camped spot, but on more security one.

So learn for this "THINKING person shooter" as MW:O were claimed 2 or 3 years ago, hit "B" Button, take command, and shufle your deck when someone dies and going to be respawned on that haunted Alpha Lance Drop Zone on Sulphurus Defense.

More thinking and at least 2 people are required to keep this for whole game, even when YOU are dead and waiting for respawn, but first learn to maintain it while you are alive...

so its like...

LEARN TO PLAY
in it's very positive meaning.

Edited by Raflik, 16 April 2015 - 01:12 AM.

[G-LOC]

ThisOneDiesALot, on 10 February 2015 - 03:47 PM, said:

i have an excellent idea to prevent drop zone camping. and its very efficient because no implementation from PGI is needed! its called

Spoiler

DEFEND YOUR DROPZONE AND DON'T BRING LURMS TO A BRAWL

Yeah, really helpful post there, well done you.

[Sir Wolfenx]

ThisOneDiesALot, on 10 February 2015 - 03:47 PM, said:

Spoiler

DEFEND YOUR DROPZONE AND DON'T BRING LURMS TO A BRAWL

Lurms are awesome in the regular, non clan drops, but IN CW not many team mates support The ECM. They like to stick together in tight formations, lurms work with different tactics. No one tags, or narcs. Clan tactics don't accomodate. The early clan maps had narrow chokepoints which forced teams to stack in the same quad. If they made more spacious maps, ECM mechs will have to be more mobile. Its sad that lurms are nurfed. Running formations which force the enemy to break up would help support lurms. Lurms are great for running battles. Running at 70kph behind the lights and mediums. A heavy or assault lurm boat can still help the battle. Stop using stacked formations and you will improve the effectiveness of lurms.

[sC4r]

@raflik

if this works then its rather interesting... but it is inconvenient you see the defenders will have one less player fighting

and yes i agree with OP... you should be able to select where do you want to drop as nothing can survive focused fire from 6-10 mechs especially if you are unlucky to be dropped with your back turned to them

Edited by sC4r, 16 April 2015 - 05:31 AM.

[LordNothing]

i do kind of want side objectives that make your primary target easier to kill. like a forward landing zone that you can capture to spawn closer to the target (or enemy if defending). only one problem: the maps are way too small for that.

[Summon3r]

Mystere, on 11 February 2015 - 08:02 AM, said:

His method may be crude, but he still does have a point. Getting slaughtered at your drop zone is a clear indication of a massive failure on your part. And one way to prevent such occurrences from happening is to actively secure your drop zone.

its also one pug drops vs 12 mans is almost never going to happen, the whole "how about defend your stuff and be better" is just asinine in the current state of the game. the most recent map Emerald garbage makes for the easiest spawn camping yet.

so how about give the OP credit for a good idea (that will likely be ignored) and not spout retardation like no sorry you must suck defend your sh!t and L2GITGUD. CW is boring as hell im for anything that makes playing stomachable.

[Summon3r]

Raflik, on 16 April 2015 - 01:11 AM, said:

And it's perfectly impleted.

YES YOU CAN CHANGE THE DROP ZONE YOU APPEAR!

Suprised?

Well of course it's not a big red button like for clans "Press to win" and you need at least 1 smart enough guy.
Let's call him... DROP COMMANDER!

Did you know that one guy like real commander can give order around, and select where mech should appear? To gain tactical advance, mech could spawn in the drop nearest open gate, and to defensive support he can order dropship to land not on camped spot, but on more security one.

So learn for this "THINKING person shooter" as MW:O were claimed 2 or 3 years ago, hit "B" Button, take command, and shufle your deck when someone dies and going to be respawned on that haunted Alpha Lance Drop Zone on Sulphurus Defense.

More thinking and at least 2 people are required to keep this for whole game, even when YOU are dead and waiting for respawn, but first learn to maintain it while you are alive...

so its like...

LEARN TO PLAY
in it's very positive meaning.

again your assuming everyone is 12 mans, you think pugs are gonna worry about where another pug drops let alone anything except what his score is going to look like?

so while your mouthing off about "thinking" maybe think about the fact there are a lot more pugs then us 12 mans with "thinking" dedicated DC's.

this game is on life support if choosing your LZ makes it more fun why not?

[Nazar24]

Summon3r, on 16 April 2015 - 06:33 AM, said:

you think pugs are gonna worry about where another pug drops let alone anything except what his score is going to look like?

Pugs problems.
You don't even need a "commander". Just take the command while you are waiting to respawn and move yourself in another lance, then resign.
Whops , i was wrong, my bad.

Of course, an in game tutorial would help knowing that, but it doesn't change the fact that we already have this option.

Edited by Nazar24, 16 April 2015 - 08:17 AM.

[Mystere]

Summon3r, on 16 April 2015 - 06:29 AM, said:

its also one pug drops vs 12 mans is almost never going to happen, the whole "how about defend your stuff and be better" is just asinine in the current state of the game. the most recent map Emerald garbage makes for the easiest spawn camping yet.

so how about give the OP credit for a good idea (that will likely be ignored) and not spout retardation like no sorry you must suck defend your sh!t and L2GITGUD. CW is boring as hell im for anything that makes playing stomachable.

Did you conveniently ignore my first sentence, which did give credit to the OP?

[Stoned Prophet]

Meh. For some reason, i NEVER get spawncamped. I wonder why that could be... i play a fiar bit of cw... but never get spawncamped... curious indeed.

If you need the game to "fix" spawncamping, it aint the game that needs fixing.

I would howeversuppor dynamic drop points forattackers IF defenders have more powerful dropships. Its gotta be "fair" right?

[Stoned Prophet]

Summon3r, on 16 April 2015 - 06:33 AM, said:

again your assuming everyone is 12 mans, you think pugs are gonna worry about where another pug drops let alone anything except what his score is going to look like?

so while your mouthing off about "thinking" maybe think about the fact there are a lot more pugs then us 12 mans with "thinking" dedicated DC's.

this game is on life support if choosing your LZ makes it more fun why not?

Wow cool down the anger and hate.
I refer you to my last post.
Proof the game is dying pls.
Dont have any?
Im just supposed to "know" like you do?
What i "know" is this game is awesome fun, and the people who zay its dying are generally the Bads and the rest are just... well, i dont have a polite word for it so imma let thatt go...

[Dawnstealer]

I had a longer post here, but then the forum wiped it when it decided I wasn't logged in anymore. :|

Anyways, I say this in every one of these threads I see, but I think the problem is the game mode. Yes, being able to control your spawnpoint directly (as opposed to having to rely on a commander who's likely busy fighting) would help a lot. But...so would different game modes.

Right now, the two modes we have echo two of the modes we have in the PUG Queue. Counter-Attack = Skirmish, Attack/Defend = Assault. What we're lacking is a Conquest analog.

In Conquest, there's five node and your team starts with one pre-conquered. Then you can go out and capture literally any of the other ones, including the other team's start-node. Other games have done this better, and I wish PGI would steal an idea from Joint Operations (a game from the early- to mid-00s that could have up 50+ players on a side, and gigantic maps that tiled).

In Joint Operations, like Conquest, you'd start with 5 (to 7) nodes with one for each team that was "pre-conquered." From there, you had to go out and conquer the other nodes IN SEQUENCE. So you couldn't, say, go from #1 to #5, you had to take and hold #2, completely conquering it.

If you completely conquered a node, it became available as another spawn point, allowing you to move the front forward. If the node was contested, then you couldn't do this. But you always had the choice: if you wanted to reinforce the front, everyone would just respawn that farthest forward node. If it looked like you were getting overwhelmed, you could fall back and regroup to the next node in the line. If you were really getting trashed, you could fall all the way back to your start node (where there were typically better weapons, turrets, and vehicles - I guess the MWO equivalent would be turrets and resupplies? Maybe a big-ass dropship?).

You only won when you controlled all the nodes - there was no 750 point limit. You couldn't just control three nodes and call it good until time ran out.

TONS more strategy involved. Do you push out with Lights to zerg the nodes, or do you move out with Assaults to stomp the other team's zerg? Or do you do a combination, sending out a lance of Lights to scout and conquer and have the Heavies and Assaults coming behind to hold the territory?

Mediums suddenly have a place as being able to bridge the gap. ALL mechs and styles become important. Most importantly, as the OP says, you could select where you dropped and since the nodes were usually laid out more or less in a line, spawn-camping was less of a thing.

Final note was that the number of respawns was unlimited and no time limit: games in JO could go on for HOURS. There were times I'd go to bed with the game almost won and wake up to the game still going. That's not a lot of fun, and there obviously should be limits on the number of mechs and time, but man....so fun.

Edited by Dawnstealer, 16 April 2015 - 07:59 AM.

[Raflik]

Quote

if this works then its rather interesting... but it is inconvenient you see the defenders will have one less player fighting

Nope. The amount of time it take to take command and swap someone droppoint is around 5 seconds. Of course you won't be able to do it during trade and pushing, but all proper bulid for CW get hell hot with those LL or ER medium prety quickly, and you have to fall back and cooldown. There is enough time to do the swap, and get back to battle.

Quote

you think pugs are gonna worry about where another pug drops let alone anything except what his score is going to look like?

I do Pug a lot and I Care. So for total newbie team who shall be anihilated in 15 minutes(we are holding that enemy premade longer in match = other group of pug get easier enemies), so as for equall battle when spawncamping 1 or 2 mech can decide the fate of game (like 36-36 score, and 2 best enemy players *BAM* - get spawncamped their last mechs), and caring about others doesn't interfere with score, as I almost always end as 1'st, 2'nd or 3'rd best player in team.

Quote

take the command while you are waiting to respawn and move yourself in another lance, then resign.

Nope, after you are dead, the HUD is blocked so you cannot do what you wrote, moreover you even cannot resign a command to let one of your comrade to move you. And it's too late to switch lance while you are in dropship, cause landing zone were determined already. - This bolded tip is incorrect


and my personal - Very personal statement is "MW:O is Thinking game - so if you think you won't play CW if you cannot do 1000 dmg during 1 match"

[Summon3r]

Stoned Prophet, on 16 April 2015 - 07:44 AM, said:

Wow cool down the anger and hate.
I refer you to my last post.
Proof the game is dying pls.
Dont have any?
Im just supposed to "know" like you do?
What i "know" is this game is awesome fun, and the people who zay its dying are generally the Bads and the rest are just... well, i dont have a polite word for it so imma let thatt go...

whether im 1337 good average or bad makes no difference the fact i see the same people night in and night out is not a good sign. draw your own conclusions mine is what it is.

[Ace Selin]

There aren't that many people playing CW and a good portion of those are PUGs, and many wont waste 5 secs to assist another PUG if it means they may die. So being able to choose spawn points is logical and likely easy solution. I guarantee you would see more people continue to play the mode if this was implemented.

[sdsnowbum]

Stoned Prophet, on 16 April 2015 - 07:37 AM, said:

If you need the game to "fix" spawncamping, it aint the game that needs fixing.

Certain maps need fixing.

Raflik, on 16 April 2015 - 08:09 AM, said:

Nope. The amount of time it take to take command and swap someone droppoint is around 5 seconds. Of course you won't be able to do it during trade and pushing, but all proper bulid for CW get hell hot with those LL or ER medium prety quickly, and you have to fall back and cooldown. There is enough time to do the swap, and get back to battle.

Taking command and switching the lance of people who are about to be dropped to their instant death is a great idea and really the only reliable tactic on some of these maps.

Unfortunately you basically have to have someone on your side who knows the drop locations, keeps an eye on who has died and responds instantly.

The issue here is really that some maps have made spawn camping into a tactic, and defending against them is another tactic.

Yes if the skill levels are wildly uneven it is a non-issue, but pretty much any tactic is a non-issue with enough of a skill imbalance.

If the certain spots on certain maps were changed these spawn camping tactics would be a non-issue for everyone in every case.

How hard is it really to tweak the maps??

Edited by sdsnowbum, 16 April 2015 - 05:46 PM.

[Triordinant]

In the just-concluded Town Hall, it seems Russ Bullock's preferred solution to spawn camping is dropships permanently hovering over the drop zone and focus-firing on one enemy 'mech at a time.

[Stoned Prophet]

Summon3r, on 16 April 2015 - 03:46 PM, said:

whether im 1337 good average or bad makes no difference the fact i see the same people night in and night out is not a good sign. draw your own conclusions mine is what it is.

Youre anecdotal evidence counts for nothing, and is easily countered by my own. As i said, PROOF or do you just "know". Seems you just "know" which explains a lot about you

[Telmasa]

Stoned Prophet, on 16 April 2015 - 11:01 PM, said:

Youre anecdotal evidence counts for nothing, and is easily countered by my own. As i said, PROOF or do you just "know". Seems you just "know" which explains a lot about you

you must sound really smart when people around you are stoned too

Mystere, on 11 February 2015 - 09:19 AM, said:

That's pay to win!

(Just anticipating a potential response here. )

Yeah, so I'm almost a week late, but you were right. No thanks.

And while I'm at it, please no deployable turrets. If it's something you could do in Call of Duty, burn it. Burn it with fire and forget it ever existed.