53 replies to this topic

[BlackSquirrel]

I don't know if you need to rework the maps or spawning mechanics, but this is frustrating to a lot of newer players trying out CW. (Getting stomped by pre-mades is already frustrating... Now you're just kicking people when they're down.) This is universal to any game. I've seen plenty of comments of dismay, and rage. (True not something new to MWO.)

Furthermore selecting spawning zones after the first drop would also be useful. (Also expanding existing spawn zones could help as well... This way it's more of a guess who is spawning where.)

Also there are also places on maps in which only IS lights can get to. While i'm not 100% against this as a boon to IS... It does cause issues with plinking away the objectives with near impunity.

I'd also like to suggest adding radar towers/anti ECM to certain parts of the bases (Destroy-able mind you) assuming spawn camping/changing the maps can't be dealt with.

Thanks!

[LordMelvin]

Spawn camping is really a factor of spawns being right in the middle of the enemy's objective (in the case of camping defenders), and aggressive defender pushing out of base (in the case of camping attackers).

Attackers camping is just obnoxious since it means they already have the battlefield advantage and are just farming c-bills instead of finishing the game. Defenders pushing out of base to counter-attack is less of an issue I think since it opens them to potentially getting circumvented and leaving the base open, although if they're camping they probably aren't leaving that opportunity available.

In either case it's annoying to the team getting camped since they can't do anything but die.

[TexAce]

10xAC20s, 15MLs, 10xSRM6 and 12xSSRM2 for the dropships

case closed.

Edited by TexAss, 24 February 2015 - 01:07 PM.

[Screech]

What would be the acceptable disadvantages for not defending your landing zones?

[HARDKOR]

Even when I try not to start the spawn killing, someone always starts lurming from spawn, and then it starts. If you start shooting from your spawn or standing right in front it and are shooting at me, I'm going to go over there and kill you until you die for good.

[spottiedogman]

But no one cheats in this game right

Edited by spottiedogman, 24 February 2015 - 01:18 PM.

[Trashhead]

I suggested to put the CW maps without respawn (which would require tweaking them somewhat; removing the gates and turrets, for instance) into the Pub queue and see if this could work.

You will have no spawn-camping, but of cause the occasional rofl-stomp then.
So, we would trade one evil against another, basically.

If you feel like reading it, here it is:
What If... We Would Have No Respawn ?
Be warned, its a wall of text!

[Fonzie260]

What about turrets that respond on a timer? Might that help or hinder the game?

[Devilsfury]

Most matches the drop ships hit and connect way more than the guys you are fighting against. Seriously...those things hurt!

[BlackSquirrel]

HARDKOR, on 24 February 2015 - 01:11 PM, said:

Even when I try not to start the spawn killing, someone always starts lurming from spawn, and then it starts. If you start shooting from your spawn or standing right in front it and are shooting at me, I'm going to go over there and kill you until you die for good.

Well yeah, but when you're spawn camped you can't do anything other than shoot out of your spawn.

[Coolant]

yep, enemy spawn camping our drop zone was a problem when I played it a month ago, haven't played it much since. Playing against 12-man clans with superior range while in a pug or our casual unit just is a waste of time. Plus, Nascar objective rush is boring...

[Jetfire]

LordMelvin, on 24 February 2015 - 01:01 PM, said:

Spawn camping is really a factor of spawns being right in the middle of the enemy's objective (in the case of camping defenders), and aggressive defender pushing out of base (in the case of camping attackers).

Attackers camping is just obnoxious since it means they already have the battlefield advantage and are just farming c-bills instead of finishing the game. Defenders pushing out of base to counter-attack is less of an issue I think since it opens them to potentially getting circumvented and leaving the base open, although if they're camping they probably aren't leaving that opportunity available.

In either case it's annoying to the team getting camped since they can't do anything but die.

I am of two opinions. Spawn camping the attackers drop zone is a serious case of beating the newer players when they are down. They have no opportunity to fight back and no real defenses and to set it up you had to smash them so hard and fast in wave 1 that you could then push out all the way to the drop ships in time to catch the waves of respawns.

Spawn farming the defenders means fighting off drop ships, turrets and enemy mechs. The defenders have every advantage and if they cannot leverage it enough to even get some extra damage and make some extra cbills then I am not sure what to say. That is a roll beyond rolls and if the enemy mechs had even the slightest capability should result in the enemy needing to launch at least another wave to gain the win. I have most often seen this as more of a bonus brawl wave than kill the mechs before they hit the ground.

Ultimately the game needs more incentive for attackers to just kill the cannon quickly for bonuses rather than farm mechs for more CB AND the attackers to get a large drop ship with heavy arms to protect the immediate drop zone. Destroying it could likewise grant a bonus to the defenders such that farming mechs is not viable or productive.

Take away the incentive and you take away the behaviour.

Edited by Jetfire, 25 February 2015 - 01:30 PM.

[Kristov Kerensky]

My question is..wtbf are new players doing in CW? They don't have Mechs worth using, they don't have modules, and they sure don't come equipped with any consumables, and that's without even touching on the fact that they do NOT know how to play in the first place.

I've seen people in Trial Mechs in CW, because it appears someone told new players that they can make a lot of cbills and xp in CW. True, you can, IF YOU WIN, losses pay worse then doing solo PUG que drops and losing does, especially for the time spent. I've been told by people that consumables are not honorable and they refuse to use them. ALMOST always new players, often using Trial Mechs because they don't own any yet, still in that Cadet bonus stage, occasionally by people I know have been playing for a while but are still noobs, lets face it, some people just can't do video games.

You don't do your job, your spawn points are the price you pay. It's not like they can just walk in and spawn camp you after all, they fought to get that far....who's at fault here?

[stjobe]

Kristov Kerensky, on 25 February 2015 - 01:38 PM, said:

My question is..wtbf are new players doing in CW?

Trying to play the game?

It's not their fault PGI in their infinite wisdom decided to make CW the 12-man playground and also let anyone in to be cannon-fodder for those 12-mans.

There's no "you have to be this tall to ride" sign on CW, anyone can join. That it's not a really good idea for new players (or anyone not in a 12-man, really) is something anyone not new knows - but the new guys don't know that, and PGI sure isn't telling them.

[Scout Derek]

If pgi can get some tank AI to come out and defend the base when there's less than half of the defending mechs left and/ or when omegas open, that'd slow them down ALOT.

[Hellen Wheels]

Spawn campers are a special breed of ****. That's why they are reviled in every game.

[Necromantion]

Devilsfury, on 24 February 2015 - 01:44 PM, said:

Most matches the drop ships hit and connect way more than the guys you are fighting against. Seriously...those things hurt!

I died laughing.

Now I dont think that the spawns are set up in the best way but if your team is really getting rolled that bad the problem is not the game, the problem is your unit/you. :\ sorry

[terrycloth]

On Sulpherous, Charlie Lance drop zone is closer to the gate than the gates are to each other. You don't have to push in very far to do it, and if you're in a solid wave of 100 ton assaults up against a random assortment of general purpose defense mechs, yes -- you will lose your wave of assaults. But not before you've wiped out the defender's Charlie lance. Now you have 2-3 waves of 12-8. GG.

[Astrocanis]

BlackSquirrel, on 24 February 2015 - 12:17 PM, said:

I don't know if you need to rework the maps or spawning mechanics, but this is frustrating to a lot of newer players trying out CW. (Getting stomped by pre-mades is already frustrating... Now you're just kicking people when they're down.) This is universal to any game. I've seen plenty of comments of dismay, and rage. (True not something new to MWO.)

Furthermore selecting spawning zones after the first drop would also be useful. (Also expanding existing spawn zones could help as well... This way it's more of a guess who is spawning where.)

Also there are also places on maps in which only IS lights can get to. While i'm not 100% against this as a boon to IS... It does cause issues with plinking away the objectives with near impunity.

I'd also like to suggest adding radar towers/anti ECM to certain parts of the bases (Destroy-able mind you) assuming spawn camping/changing the maps can't be dealt with.

Thanks!

I think a way for "dead" players to coordinate drops so that it's not just one here and one there occasionally would help. As it is, one person drops and is killed. 30 seconds later 2 more drop and are killed.

If drops occurred with more than one at a time, that would help. Having "indestructible" (read that "orbital" or "aerospace") drop zone defenses would also help, although it might just end up in turtles.

But letting ~advanced~ groups spawn camp is really not fun, although (and I have watched several twitch feeds) it does seem to feed the campers' sense of superiority.

[Necromantion]

Thats fair about the coordinated drops. Turtling would indeed happen with indestructible defenses, and already does with dropships as teams use them to eat away at enemies to weaken them.

Well honestly drop camping does nothing for me and the only reason we do it is to finish matches sooner. *shrug*