79 replies to this topic

[Riffleman]

Especially on the jagermech, it seems it wouldnt be a waste of time to take its arms off before going for the kill, lessens your chance to die and drastically reduces the effectiveness of the mech, same with the centurion arm. The tabletop solved this by having randomized hits for the most part. In an online game you can purposley exploit huge weaknesses like this.

Anyone else shying away from using these 2 mechs for that reasoning? If I were just trying to fill my garage with a mech of each chassis these 2 would be the absolute last 2 I would consider using space on.

This is also a good strategy when a mech has an obvious hard hitting weapon, like the hunchback, but the arms have it even worse because of the reduced armor protection and also if the mechs side torso happens to die the arm comes with it anyway as a freebie.

[Shiinore]

General rule of thumb, if you want something to die, you won't bother stripping it's arms anyways.

Also, just about any Mech has severely limited performance without arms. I don't see how these two chassis in particular are any more vulnerable than the rest.

Edited by Shiinore, 22 July 2012 - 09:42 PM.

[Sidra]

I will still use them, heck do it to a catapult there goes half it's missile ability. But it is all about just what you prefer to play with and enjoy playing. It's like going for the legs, disable then finish them off. Just strategy really, also they do have their benifits, you have a Jager with autocannon sniping. Again just what one you prefer

[Riffleman]

Shiinore, on 22 July 2012 - 09:41 PM, said:

General rule of thumb, if you want something to die, you won't bother stripping it's arms anyways.

Also, just about any Mech has severely limited performance without arms. I don't see how these two chassis in particular are any more vulnerable than the rest.

I disagree the jagermech has the lions share of its firepower tied up in the arms, makeing it very easy to take out of a fight. And its not like it could move its autocannons to its chest for suprise because of the hardpoint system it has limited spots where it can put weapons, so removing its arms reduces 75 precent or more of its firepower.

[Tincan Nightmare]

Is the Centurions and Jagermechs just standing there while you fire at there arms? Yes arms have lower armor values than any other location on a mech, but while you are firing at an arm the enemy pilot could be blating away at your CT. Even if you blow the arm off, while you were doing that you will have lost armor as well, and the Jagermech has another arm with weapons while both it and the Centurion have torso mounted lasers. It would suck to take an enemys arm off only to get destroyed while doing it.

[Shiinore]

Riffleman, on 22 July 2012 - 09:46 PM, said:

I disagree the jagermech has the lions share of its firepower tied up in the arms, makeing it very easy to take out of a fight. And its not like it could move its autocannons to its chest for suprise because of the hardpoint system it has limited spots where it can put weapons, so removing its arms reduces 75 precent or more of its firepower.

Tons of Mechs are designed that way. Strip a Hunchback's torso and it has nothing but a few lasers. Strip a Jenner's arms and they may have nothing at all depending on their variant. Strip a Catapult's arms and it loses all missile capabilities (which is the Mech's intended role). Strip a Dragon's arms and it has nothing but LRMs and a MedLas.

Again, I fail to see how the Centurion and Jagermech are any more vulnerable to this than the other chassis.

[Sidra]

Shiinore, on 22 July 2012 - 09:50 PM, said:

Tons of Mechs are designed that way. Strip a Hunchback's torso and it has nothing but a few lasers. Strip a Jenner's arms and they may have nothing at all depending on their variant. Strip a Catapult's arms and it loses all missile capabilities (which is the Mech's intended role). Strip a Dragon's arms and it has nothing but LRMs and a MedLas.

Again, I fail to see how the Centurion and Jagermech are any more vulnerable to this than the other chassis.

Strip and Urbanmech and you get a sexy beast XD

[Bloodweaver]

Shiinore, on 22 July 2012 - 09:41 PM, said:

General rule of thumb, if you want something to die, you won't bother stripping it's arms anyways.

You will if you're able to think tactically. A base-variant Centurion without its right arm is pretty useless at close range. Same goes for the Dragon.

I don't think the Jagermech will suffer much from this sort of approach. First off, it's a long-range fighter; any hits it receives will be less accurate. And second, its arms are identical; you'd have to take them BOTH off to really benefit from the approach.

The advantage of having a heavy weapon in the arm is that it makes that weapon a lot more mobile, and also improves your accuracy because allows you to aim it in more directions. Whether or not that advantage is worth the cost in vulnerability, well... depends on the game mechanics(which we don't know yet) and the particular mech's purpose(which can be changed).

I do, however, think that the "destroy a side torso = arm falls off" mechanic should be eliminated. I believe MW4 did away with it - although that game is hardly a model to which PGI should aspire, this particular element would improve arm survivability, which is necessary due to the presence of targeting accuracy in a game that was originally designed without anything of the sort.

Edited by Bloodweaver, 22 July 2012 - 09:55 PM.

[Elizander]

If you're that accurate you can just focus on the CT and core him with an extra Alpha strike rather than taking out a whole torso and a half worth of armor by shooting off two arms then coring him.

[Bloodweaver]

Sidra, on 22 July 2012 - 09:51 PM, said:

Strip and Urbanmech and you get a sexy beast XD

One-armed Urbie action is too kinky for me.

[Shadowscythe]

Elizander, on 22 July 2012 - 09:54 PM, said:

If you're that accurate you can just focus on the CT and core him with an extra Alpha strike rather than taking out a whole torso and a half worth of armor by shooting off two arms then coring him.

This is pretty much what I was thinking. it would be faster just to core than take off both arms
Especially if they are running XL engines

Unless you are going for the XP of taking components out. There isn't really a reason to go for arms first...Unless you know there is ammo in that locatio somehow.. I plan on moving ammo from where the stock varient's ammo is (assuming I run with any ammo at all )

Edited by Shadowscythe, 22 July 2012 - 10:03 PM.

[Ubertron X]

Although a mechs arms can somehow be targeted easier than the main body, the also aim much faster than the main body. Good luck trying to hit a reasonably fast mech close-up with only torso mounted weapons. I expect my Centurion to blast a lot of scouts to hell with the arm mounted AC/10, a feat that the hunchbacks torso mounted AC/20 might not be able to acomplish easily.

[Brenden]

Elizander, on 22 July 2012 - 09:54 PM, said:

If you're that accurate you can just focus on the CT and core him with an extra Alpha strike rather than taking out a whole torso and a half worth of armor by shooting off two arms then coring him.

Or aim for the head.

[El Death Smurf]

few thoughts
if you're aiming for the torsos and you're off a little you hit... torso... but if you're aiming for the arm and are a little off then, you drop ordinance in the dirt
secondly there are LOTS of mechs that were (and are,) arm loaders, and in mechwarrior 4 people piloted them all teh time (Novacats especially, and tehy were ALL arms)
In mech warrior 3 didn't everyone put all their wepons in their torsos and leave the arms empty, i much prefer the PGI format.

[ManDaisy]

Bloodweaver, on 22 July 2012 - 09:53 PM, said:

I do, however, think that the "destroy a side torso = arm falls off" mechanic should be eliminated. I believe MW4 did away with it - although that game is hardly a model to which PGI should aspire, this particular element would improve arm survivability, which is necessary due to the presence of targeting accuracy in a game that was originally designed without anything of the sort.

http://objection.mrd...o.php?n=5999678

Edited by ManDaisy, 22 July 2012 - 10:11 PM.

[Janius]

I kinda agree with the arms being a little bit more of a easy target on the centurion then the other mechs, it seems to me like the arms are just BIGGER in relation to the rest of the mech, making them a much easier target then something else, and most Centurion variants, you disarm it, and then worry about its big friend that just walked around the corner. Then come back to the now useless Centurion after the remaining threats are gone.

[Brenden]

And who cares really if blowing off the arms is such a bad idea. 90% of all 'mechs have their weapons in their arms, even the Catapult's launchers are considered arms! So wouldn't you think, the first place they would hit, besides the torso, would be the arms to disable the opponite? This is as redudant as the whole legging arguement. Both are viable tactics, and in the heat of battle you don't hold up for honor, you fire your PPCs down range and pray to your god(s) that they hit that Cicada square in the face.

[Skadi]

Shiinore, on 22 July 2012 - 09:41 PM, said:

General rule of thumb, if you want something to die, you won't bother stripping it's arms anyways.

Also, just about any Mech has severely limited performance without arms. I don't see how these two chassis in particular are any more vulnerable than the rest.

Pretty much this, a good player will be able to access (sorry if i spelt that wrong, grammar nazis correct me on that one if so) what hes up against fast, while taking out say a weak arm thats almost gone anyway before the enamy targets you is def a good strategy, you should never just go straight for arms no matter what, for all you know youre enamy may be packing all the lethals in the torso and you just wasted your time :\
Guarntee you come the 7th... were gonna run into THESE kind of Atlas players

Edited by Skadi, 22 July 2012 - 10:12 PM.

[Shiinore]

Bloodweaver, on 22 July 2012 - 09:53 PM, said:

You will if you're able to think tactically. A base-variant Centurion without its right arm is pretty useless at close range. Same goes for the Dragon.

I don't think the Jagermech will suffer much from this sort of approach. First off, it's a long-range fighter; any hits it receives will be less accurate. And second, its arms are identical; you'd have to take them BOTH off to really benefit from the approach.

The advantage of having a heavy weapon in the arm is that it makes that weapon a lot more mobile, and also improves your accuracy because allows you to aim it in more directions. Whether or not that advantage is worth the cost in vulnerability, well... depends on the game mechanics(which we don't know yet) and the particular mech's purpose(which can be changed).

I do, however, think that the "destroy a side torso = arm falls off" mechanic should be eliminated. I believe MW4 did away with it - although that game is hardly a model to which PGI should aspire, this particular element would improve arm survivability, which is necessary due to the presence of targeting accuracy in a game that was originally designed without anything of the sort.

This ain't a 1v1. People are shooting at you. I want my target to die ASAP. I don't care if his arm has a giant cannon of epic proportions, I want his torso cored, so that his Mech will stop functioning entirely.

[Brenden]

Shiinore, on 22 July 2012 - 10:13 PM, said:

This ain't a 1v1. People are shooting at you. I want my target to die ASAP. I don't care if his arm has a giant cannon of epic proportions, I want his torso cored, so that his Mech will stop functioning entirely.

Then aim for the f*cking head, quickest way to kill the poor *******. And, it saves on armour, weapons and other componites you might get as part of salvage. Why waste the whole then when you can kill the Atlas quickly and move on?