10 replies to this topic

[MadHornet]

Alright, so I've seen how Streak-SRM's were supposedly "nerfed". The damage reduction from 2.5 to 2.0 makes sense, but why the severe accuracy reduction? They hit the target in random areas and are generally useless against anything heavier than 50 tons, not including cheese builds amassing large amounts of Clan SSRM's.

I believe the problem never was about where they hit, but the fact that they ALWAYS DO. I encountered a Timber Wolf yesterday that fired streak SRM's while I was behind them. Instead of firing outwards and making a long arc back to me, they instead took a 180 degree the second they were fired and killed me.

I've performed tests in the testing grounds in which SSRM's that I fired will sometimes endlessly go back and forth between say, the legs or an arm. Sure, maybe it's a bug, but the missile shouldn't be able to instantly reposition itself the other way and loop itself like that, which is the only reason the bug exists.

I don't see any excuse why the missiles should have such perfect turn radius that they perform realistically impossible maneuvers like turning completely around on a dime while still retaining all of it's velocity.

Anyone else have something to share?

[Aiden Skye]

Never noticed this....actually I have noticed the zig zagging missiles buzzing around your mech lookin for something. Would make sense for the missiles to have to launch out of the tubes in the direction your torso is pointing....then make realistic flight adjustments from there.

[MadHornet]

Well, to add on, I've noticed you're able to fire after you've lost lock, and the missiles still track for the salvo you just fired. Personally I think the SSRM's were nerfed in the wrong way.

[Team Chevy86]

I've actually seen this happen to other lights... It's never made sense to me either. The missiles don't 'arc' as they should.
Seen this Mostly on Streakcrows or Streakcats, the light will attempt to do a drive by, but the streaks will gain a lock, even though its 'out of sight', and well beyond it, it'll fire because the magic red orb told him to, The missiles will take a 90 degree turn the second they leave the tubes.
You have a point OP...

Edited by Team Chevy86, 02 March 2015 - 06:58 PM.

[Nothing Whatsoever]

Well, SSRMs are supposed to target weighted bones on an enemy, so that center mass is not favored.

From here.

[FupDup]

I disagree, I think their issue is in their random targeting system. It's the main factor that causes them to be so binary. If you boat a lot of them and/or shoot them at smaller targets, you have a significant advantage. If you don't have very many of them and/or shoot at bigger targets, they are almost worthless. It's an all-or-nothing type of weapon, with little middleground in-between.

The missile cluster should try to home in on the location/hitbox being aimed at when they are fired. This stabilizes their performance across the board against all target types, and gives us a more clear baseline to balance their cooldown/heat/range/damage/spread/etc.

[El Bandito]

FupDup, on 02 March 2015 - 07:43 PM, said:

I disagree, I think their issue is in their random targeting system. It's the main factor that causes them to be so binary. If you boat a lot of them and/or shoot them at smaller targets, you have a significant advantage. If you don't have very many of them and/or shoot at bigger targets, they are almost worthless. It's an all-or-nothing type of weapon, with little middleground in-between.

The missile cluster should try to home in on the location/hitbox being aimed at when they are fired. This stabilizes their performance across the board against all target types, and gives us a more clear baseline to balance their cooldown/heat/range/damage/spread/etc.

PGI just can't get their heads around a good balanced homing weapon, be it SSRMs or LRMs. I shudder to think how they will butcher MRMs and Arrow IV.

Edited by El Bandito, 02 March 2015 - 09:15 PM.

[FupDup]

El Bandito, on 02 March 2015 - 07:46 PM, said:

PGI just can't get their heads around a good balanced homing weapon, be it SSRMs or LRMs. I shudder to think how they will butcher MRMs and Arrow IV.

MRMs will probably just be dumb-fire, those are easy enough. The question is how fast the velocity will be...They might either be super good at midrange or not good at all, depending on how high or low they go.

[Chagatay]

MadHornet, on 02 March 2015 - 06:46 PM, said:

Stuff

I'll share. Relatively, they are weak and very, very slow. A few AMS systems make them all but mute at range. Hell I have killed friendlies long after the guy I shot dead because someone ran into the cloud of death missiles wandering aimlessly. If you want streaks to be "fixed" make cAP/BAP counter all ECM effects in range or do away with ECM stacking mechanics.

The reason that they exist at all is do to very poor registration and the fact that clans have few other ways to deal with lights.

[Nothing Whatsoever]

I might as well share this idea again.

What I'd love to have is missiles track wherever the shooter is aiming with the crosshair / reticle. This way LRMs, SRMs and Streaks can then receive other tweaks to how they work, such as tweaking their missile speed, cooldown and impulse values as necessary. I would also like them to have more of a ripple fire pattern for all systems.

Artemis would modify how fast the missiles respond (course correction until they hit something or reach max range) to moving the crosshair / reticle around, so missile response would be faster with Artemis and that extra responsiveness is cancel-able by ECM and so on.

Then with Streaks, it would retain the Lock-On system with tweaks to be able to fire on any mech in LOS; and if you lose lock, the missiles simply don't fire. And their SSRM bone targeting can remain in place or utilize the Missiles following the crosshair / reticle like non-Streaks based on how best to balance; I'd favor them to follow the crosshair like non-streak missiles though.


More related thoughts:

Spoiler

BAP and ECM accelerating / preventing the Paperdoll update should remain as-is with such changes; and then can be expanded upon for more in-depth Information Warfare.

TAG could then be made to allow targets not in LOS of the shooter to be target-able by missile systems, so aiding LRMs the most. And having LRMs be fire and forget or not, would be a matter of balancing them after other tweaks such as adjusting missile speed cooldown and impulse values for example.

Also I'd give TAG its own unique hardpoint so that it can be made available to any mech that lacks an Energy Hardpoint and would benefit from being able to carry it (without adding an Energy Hardpoint to them), such as the CPLT-A1 or the Huginn for example or say with the Spider 5V it would still have two energy in the CT but could then add a TAG Hardpoint elsewhere on the mech.

With this idea, TAG can also be limited to specific mechs depending on how it would influence LRMs and or other systems that can be added in the future such as Arrow IV as say a different sort of consumable than current Strikes. Either way the main thing I want to explore is improving missile systems and no longer have SRMs be dead-fire.

[Chagatay]

El Bandito, on 02 March 2015 - 07:46 PM, said:

PGI just can't get their heads around a good balanced homing weapon, be it SSRMs or LRMs. I shudder to think how they will butcher MRMs and Arrow IV.

I would love MRMs (note that they are dumbfired and have no guidance)... They probably would need to be faster than SRMs (probably 600m/s and probably a similar max range) but would have an effective range of about 400m. This is a good range as alot of combat happens there.

Edited by Chagatay, 02 March 2015 - 08:38 PM.