53 replies to this topic

[TheArisen]

Most people I know consider is heavy mechs to be a little underwhelming. I'm not saying they suck, just that they generally aren't all that great. This is made even more apparent due to the Twolf, which is arguably the best mech in the game.

My question is as the title suggests, which IS heavy mechs would you like to see added to the game?
I'd like the Hammerhands, 75t, ballistic arms, closest thing we'll get to a warhammer. I'd also like the Blacknight, 75t, energy boat, ecm capable.

[LT. HARDCASE]

Give me a Black Knight with ECM.

I also want the Lancelot.

Edited by Kevjack, 11 March 2015 - 02:14 PM.

[Mirumoto Izanami]

Black Knight would be cool, but the ECM variant is WAAAAAAAAAY outside the timeline MWO , kinda sorta...exists in.

The Grasshopper is nearly upon us. Let s see how that does first.

[LordKnightFandragon]

Meh, IS heavies dont suck, they all laser vomit the same as clans....they all chew through 93 CT armor in 2 shots....not UP at all.

[Simbacca]

Hammerhands-6E with ECM. Give us this mech!

[Brody319]

TheArisen, on 11 March 2015 - 02:12 PM, said:

Most people I know consider is heavy mechs to be a little underwhelming. I'm not saying they suck, just that they generally aren't all that great.

WAT?!

Heavies are the best weight class in the game if not the best.

I mean IS still has the Jeager, and Cataphract, possibly the Grasshopper.
They might not be "Timberwolf" level, but they are extremely good mechs. Before the Clans hit the Jeager and Cataphract dominated the field.

[Onmyoudo]

Brody319, on 11 March 2015 - 02:21 PM, said:

WAT?!

Heavies are the best weight class in the game if not the best.

I mean IS still has the Jeager, and Cataphract, possibly the Grasshopper.
They might not be "Timberwolf" level, but they are extremely good mechs. Before the Clans hit the Jeager and Cataphract dominated the field.

The Cataphract chassis has not dominated the field for a long time - what dominated were potarts, which the CTF-3D happened to be good at. Jagermechs have always been easy to kill, if annoying at close range, and both of these mechs are now mid-tier at best (despite how well I can do in my Muromets).

However due to quirks, the Thunderbolt is currently very good and probably one of the best mechs in the IS. Yet with quirks PGI giveth and PGI taketh away, so that's not guaranteed forever. For example, the quirks on the Grasshopper mean that it's going to be mediocre if it's lucky. At least it probably won't be Quickdraw or Catapult tier.

[Reitrix]

Onmyoudo, on 11 March 2015 - 02:34 PM, said:

At least it probably won't be Quickdraw or Catapult tier.

I can't talk much about the QD as i don't play them, but whats wrong with the Catapults?
My K2 is still one of my most successful 'Mechs and the A1 is still my best IS Missile Boat.

Or are they "bad" because they can't conform to the Laser Vomit//Ballistic Meta?

[TheArisen]

Let's stay on topic, I only said that IS heavies are underwhelming, not that they're bad.

I'd also add the Flashmen, 75t laser boat, high engine cap. And the Falconer, even if its out of the timeline ATM.

[Helsbane]

Hammerhands, with a PGI created 3rd timeline variant with ERPPCs in the arms, and a Hero Version with quad UAC5s.

[Onmyoudo]

Reitrix, on 11 March 2015 - 02:38 PM, said:

I can't talk much about the QD as i don't play them, but whats wrong with the Catapults?
My K2 is still one of my most successful 'Mechs and the A1 is still my best IS Missile Boat.

Or are they "bad" because they can't conform to the Laser Vomit//Ballistic Meta?

One of the reasons is power creep, pure and simple. They didn't get the quirks to keep up.

Another is the astoundingly awful hitboxes compared to newer mechs. HUGE CT, arms that are basically not worth taking (and carry all your weapons) due to how easy they are to hit, and probably the largest cockpit in the game.

A third reason is that heavy JJs are terrible now, which affects all variants except the K2. The K2's PPCs are awful though, so it won't feel left out.

Although it's not all about meta conformity, the meta does highlight that missiles, on the whole, are in a bad place right now. And the catapult happens to be a missile chassis, which is unfortunate. If they weren't all stored in super easy to hit, poking above the ridgeline 30 years before your cockpit clears the top box arms, though, it might not be as much of an issue.

In answer to the OP's request to stay on topic: I don't think it's about adding more mechs. I think it would be more productive, through quirks or otherwise, to rebalance the mechs already in the game so that they're on a more even footing. Introducing more powerful mechs just means that the ones we have currently are abandoned.

Edited by Onmyoudo, 11 March 2015 - 02:51 PM.

[zagibu]

Reitrix, on 11 March 2015 - 02:38 PM, said:

I can't talk much about the QD as i don't play them, but whats wrong with the Catapults?
My K2 is still one of my most successful 'Mechs and the A1 is still my best IS Missile Boat.

Or are they "bad" because they can't conform to the Laser Vomit//Ballistic Meta?

The Quickdraw is pretty good for a slow light mech, and the CPLT can do a lot of damage, if you don't get fired at.

[TheArisen]

Fair enough Onmy, however, there are still mechs that'd add to the game. Wtb Hammer hands!

[zagibu]

According to lore, the Hammerhands was obsoleted by the Warhammer, which is probably why only 2 variants exist at the current point in time. But this is probably a case where lore should be left aside, because the Hammerhands would be a nice replacement for the Warhammer, which we probably can't ever get.

[GeneralArmchair]

Chiming to the catapults defense,  it's side torso hit boxes are superb and it is probably one of the safest is heavies for equipping an Xl engine.
The missiles problem is an issue,  but they will improve once pgi finally faces the music and takes another look at ecm mechanics in our increasingly ecm saturated world.
Until then,  the placement of the ballistic hard points on the k2 are superb.  They are tight enough to essentially be one gun and are right up by the cockpit.
The jester  also makes a good  high mobility laser boat.   The main bad thing you can say about it is that the mad cat vomits lasers better due to its clan tech.   However the jester can outrun a mad cat and it can slot onto a dropship easier with its lower tonnage.

Edited by GeneralArmchair, 11 March 2015 - 03:34 PM.

[Ultimax]

Mirumoto Izanami, on 11 March 2015 - 02:16 PM, said:

The Grasshopper is nearly upon us. Let s see how that does first.

My guess is that it if it has amazing hitboxes that it will be on par with a Summoner, a few builds will be better and a few builds will be worse.

[Fate 6]

GeneralArmchair, on 11 March 2015 - 03:32 PM, said:

Chiming to the catapults defense, it's side torso hit boxes are superb and it is probably one of the safest is heavies for equipping an Xl engine.
The missiles problem is an issue, but they will improve once pgi finally faces the music and takes another look at ecm mechanics in our increasingly ecm saturated world.
Until then, the placement of the ballistic hard points on the k2 are superb. They are tight enough to essentially be one gun and are right up by the cockpit.
The jester also makes a good high mobility laser boat. The main bad thing you can say about it is that the mad cat vomits lasers better due to its clan tech. However the jester can outrun a mad cat and it can slot onto a dropship easier with its lower tonnage.

Thunderbolt is a better Jester than the Jester is. The 9SE even gets JJs.

[Molossian Dog]

zagibu, on 11 March 2015 - 03:13 PM, said:

..., and the CPLT can do a lot of damage, if you don't get fired at.

That particular line has bothered me for a long time.

Which Mech can´t do a lot of damage, if it gets ignored?

Edited by Molossian Dog, 11 March 2015 - 04:19 PM.

[BARBAR0SSA]

Brody319, on 11 March 2015 - 02:21 PM, said:

WAT?!

Heavies are the best weight class in the game if not the best.

I mean IS still has the Jeager, and Cataphract, possibly the Grasshopper.
They might not be "Timberwolf" level, but they are extremely good mechs. Before the Clans hit the Jeager and Cataphract dominated the field.

DUDE
You left Thunderbolts off that list

*SMACK*

zagibu, on 11 March 2015 - 03:13 PM, said:

The Quickdraw is pretty good for a slow light mech, and the CPLT can do a lot of damage, if you don't get fired at.

5K is pretty nice if you LL stack it, %25 beam duration with the added on range and heat gen quirks.

that's faster than the Clan MPLs, with more range, more damage, less heat

Edited by shad0w4life, 11 March 2015 - 04:25 PM.

[Escef]

The Catapult does better if you rig it as an all'rounder instead of a dedicated IDF or PPC platform. The C1 does really well with endo, a 300XL, 16 DHS, 2xLL, 2xML, 2xLRM10, 4 tons ammo, 2xJJ; just provide IDF early in the match, plenty of speed to reposition, late match you can shred face with your lasers, and getting a missile box shot off is not as big a deal as it might otherwise be. Similarly with the A1, I run it with an "Improved Trial Load Out" with Artemis, XL engine, and jump jets. No, you don't want to brawl in a CPLT, you want to be a heavy skirmisher if you can... Ok, I play damn near everything as a skirmisher if I can get away with it, that's not the point.