25 replies to this topic

[Koniving]

VinJade, on 17 March 2015 - 04:52 AM, said:

people hate LRMs so they find ways to make them a useless weapon by making sure none of them can hit them.

As a vivid LRM user, the only thing I hate about LRMs is their insane firing rates and the missile blur.
I've pitched ideas to double their damage but cut their firing rates in half while also increasing their speed beyond what it is now, ideas about ECM going both for and against missiles... lots of stuff. I'm especially fond of the unguided "artillery" style use with the BattleGrid as how you set your missile destination.

But back on this. If manual interception becomes possible, the obvious response from missiles is to be faster, fast enough to actually do something. It could even be feasible for them to attack from higher angles, adding a higher tactical value to missiles.

"Don't want the enemy to look at you when you come around the corner? Shoot some missiles, while he's looking up to shoot them, come around the corner and blast him!" "Think fast!"

Their tactical value would actually increase as a result to things that would enhance missiles in response to adding the ability to manually shoot down missiles. It'd also give lights loaded with MGs and other weapons a bit more to do, as well as a reward for being a point-missile-defense.

At least, that's my opinion as a missile user and someone who has to deal with them on a daily basis.

Of course, we'd need to get these missiles back.


With this speed.


(Still believe in a reduction of firing rate.)

Edited by Koniving, 17 March 2015 - 08:32 AM.

[Bloodweaver]

VinJade, on 17 March 2015 - 04:52 AM, said:

I say if you want to be able to hit them then they should become 90% faster and deal 60% more damage to make up for the fact that none may actually make it in and those that do should deal more damage to make up for it.

...I am getting tired of people trying to make LRMs pointless if they can be easily taken out.

I agree completely. Well, almost - those percentages are pretty high But I agree with the gist of what you're saying. Those changes alone would be magnificent - just slow down the reload times so that they become less spammable and more useful in a face-to-face confrontation, and you're golden.

Edited by Bloodweaver, 17 March 2015 - 10:36 AM.

[Bloodweaver]

Koniving, on 17 March 2015 - 08:30 AM, said:

But back on this. If manual interception becomes possible, the obvious response from missiles is to be faster, fast enough to actually do something. It could even be feasible for them to attack from higher angles, adding a higher tactical value to missiles.

"Don't want the enemy to look at you when you come around the corner? Shoot some missiles, while he's looking up to shoot them, come around the corner and blast him!" "Think fast!"

such tactics
so cool
much nerdgasm

Seriously, just THINKING about this system has already opened up at least one currently-impossible tactic, as you showed above. I've always avoided using LRMs. But not because I felt they were easy mode. It is because, as I mentioned in my first post in this thread, they are not a self-sufficient primary weapon system. You either rely on your teammates to use them to full effect, OR you become an artillery piece - LRM boats are no good at anything but launching LRMs. Crap. Not fun. The only other way to use LRMs currently is as a supplement to other, stronger weapons such as ACs or ERLLs. Which is fine, but it's not a primary system. It's auxiliary.

Make them FAST, make them STRONG, but make them fire SLOW(either with long reloads or requiring new target acquisition with each reload), and you've got something worth carrying as your primary that will actually give you good direct fire capability at most ranges. A loadout of 1 x LRM-20 and 3 x MLs should be equivalent to something carrying an AC10 or a couple of PPCs - but in MWO, it's not. All it's good for is supporting other players.

As for being able to shoot missiles down, it would be awesome - so long as the aforementioned LRM changes are brought in along with that ability. And AMS would need to modified a bit too, to still make it a better choice than simply strapping on three more SLs.

Edited by Bloodweaver, 17 March 2015 - 10:45 AM.

[VinJade]

missile cycling is slow already and to cut them in half would make sure the enemy can move out of missile lock faster before you can get off a second or so shot.

if anything missile fire should be sped up a little.

as to 'face to face' fire that would only work for s/srms not LRMs since LRMs have min range and the short range ones do not.

Also because of 'face to face' fire the enemy only has to get in close to make the LRMs useless since it takes so long to even get a lock on to begin with.

I don't like the idea of using my LRMs as a distraction as that removes the point behind LRMs.

not all LRM mechs can move fast enough to 'exploit' that tiny window to get in close.

not to mention that LRM boats tend to not carry any energy weapons or ones that have very short range.

My mech carries a Long Range weapon to back up my LRMs so I run out of ammo.

still to hamper LRMs to making them pointless, might as well remove all Missile systems as they are a waste of space because of this.

remember all enemies can target the missiles which means ZERO will make it to the enemy mech.

or did none of you think about that?

and I don't think my numbers are high infact I think they are a bit low, the launcher speed should recycle by 90% faster to make it harder for them to shoot them all down while reducing they weight by 50% to make up for the fact that they need more ammo to try and make use of the weapon while also adding 90% more ammo per ton.

Edited by VinJade, 18 March 2015 - 01:28 AM.

[Striker2237]

So I just had 5 games today where the enemy had two ECM, NARC and an Insane amount of LRMs, we got wiped out and couldn't even use cover due to the fast most of the LRM boats had Artemis. Just died without even seeing who killed us or being able to do anything.........just because we had no ECM.....

[VinJade]

@Striker2237
That would be the over powered ECMs that are the real problem.
after all I came across the same problem but it was against AC 2s @ Gauss Rifles that was the main problem besides ECMs.

I remember going four matches in a row and had no ECMs while the enemy team had four.

a few mechs with a bunch of AC 2s, one or two with gauss rifles, a handful of LRM mechs, and a SSRM storm crow.

my machine was shaking so bad from AC 2 hits that I am surprised that my mech didn't end up on its rear torso because of how over powered the AC 2s are because of their shaking.

got hit by three GRs at the same time and didn't even rock as bad as I did from AC 2 hits.

the point is LRMs are weak in comparison to all other weapons & the LRMs don't even recycle fast compared to other weapons.

so don't rework the LRMs rework the ECMs as from every argument behind anti-LRMs are the ECMs.

LRMs already have so many counters its not even funny.

MM could also be seen as a problem as it doesn't place ECM mechs equally among both teams.