64 replies to this topic

[Tim East]

Molossian Dog, on 27 March 2015 - 05:48 PM, said:

You sound a bit like you cramped up recently. The only solution to that is to step away from the game for a day or two. Some days, heck, even some weeks ar just jinxed. Accept it, breathe, try again later. That is all there is to it.

grendeldog, on 27 March 2015 - 08:23 PM, said:

This may sound weird because you'd think that the more time you put into a mech the better you'll get, but I really suggest switching to another mech for a day or two. I find that when I get into a rut with a mech it's best to change to something that has a different role, play that a while, and then return to the initial mech. That's taken me as a new player from sub-100 damage games to 420 damage in a Stormcrow-C today and my new personal best of 617 damage in a Hunchback-4P, having previously been sucky with them and having taken a break of two days or so.

Give it a try, hopefully it'll help!

Actually, for the whole stepping away thing, I find switching chassis class seems to help a lot. Like a lot a lot. If you're in heavies and the MM decides to screw with you, switch to assaults for a little while. You have a separate Elo for each weight class, or so they say, and stepping out of what isn't working for you can often help you reset both the match maker and your brain. At least it's helped me more than a few times. Heck, I got my philanthropist when I needed a reset from my Locusts and drove the trial Kintaro.

[Dino Might]

While chassis doesn't make or break a game, it certainly helps. If you want the perfect PUGing mech to run out on your own solo, go with the Locust. I'm not joking. The mech is built for solo ops. It's terrible in a push because it can't tank.

Locust - 1E
It's benefits: speed, size, high mounted weapons, relatively strong firepower for a light.

Throw on 5 medium lasers, an XL 190, and 11 double heatsinks. Then go through the frustrating learning curve of how to play it. You will be happy in the end running and gunning on your own, swaying the course of the battle with a 20 ton mech. It can scout, it can snipe, it can poke, it can squirrel, it can brawl with lights, it can absolutely cut apart any assault left on its own. It's a fantastic mech that just needs a bit of finesse and a bit of crazy piloting. High risk, high reward. And it does it all completely alone. If you are fixated on solo ops, give it a try and see how you do.

[Tim East]

I use the 6SPL Locust 1E as my go-to serious mech. It overheats slower, has better ability to pinpoint damage, and better overall DPS at the cost of range, which almost doesn't matter at all given how fast you go. If you like to knife-fight, this is the mech and loadout for you.

edit: This thread is helpful if you take an interest in Locusts. http://mwomercs.com/...errated-locust/

Edited by Tim East, 28 March 2015 - 10:05 AM.

[ExoForce]

Ghost Badger, on 27 March 2015 - 10:12 AM, said:

...
Take a shot or two that ISN'T returned by the enemy. Reposition. Rinse repeat. That's why the Timby is so good. Great alphas, good enough heat to alpha 3 times, and enough speed to fade away, cool down, and do it again.
...

This! My damage doubled.since Ive started to do this instead of playing vanguard,

[Void Angel]

Questia, on 27 March 2015 - 09:07 AM, said:

No... this is unforgivable. Questia here, and if you heard of me from The Daily Whine, then you'll know my problem here.

It's simply disheartening to go with the best mech, the best builds, and the most optimal stuff (I have elited two of them, and the third needs only less than 7k XP to complete), and STILL find yourself utterly beaten time and time again. Seriously, here's a short list of the blunders that I have done in a Timber Wolf:

• immediately focused down and relieved of 16% max HP after just one poke
  
• Gotten a barely-above-100 damage game
  
• Gotten no kills at all
  
• Averaging less than 400-500 damage per game
  
• Finding oneself always out of step, firing out with no one to stand by, no one to follow through, [insert common blunder in pugs here]...
  
• Not even getting into good engagement range without being slaughtered
  
• And more...

Mind you, those are on three different chassis: one (TBR-PRIME) with the standard laservomit, another (TBR-S) with a ballistic brawling build, and a third (TBR-C) with MPL spam. And no, lag is not an excuse either: I get 240 - 340 ping, which should be good enough for things.



So... in what is essentially a continuation of my first topic, is there any tips that you experts can give to get those consistent 3-5 kills and 500+ damage that you vets tend to brag about? Er, sorry, that's a bit rude... but seriously though, it's gonna take the sacrifice of both my legs and a lot of livestock just to gain the mad skills that you guys have...

Basically, any hard tips for playing Timber Wolves? I don't want to be shamed as the noob in an OP mech, and I'm really looking for an answer here. I don't want to ever feel that I'm not contributing anything ever again...

EDIT: And the main reason why I'm posting here in this forum is because I still consider myself very new, and because I don't want to see others suffer what I am going through.

Pick an Assault 'mech and follow them around the map - don't try to do anything for yourself, just back them up. Fight what they fight, poke who they poke; if they're behind cover, stand behind the same cover, but a little back - then when they peek and people fire at them, you pop out and shoot while the enemy's weapons are recycling. If some light is trying to backstab your Big, focus your attention on keeping it away. In general, play your Timberwolf totally as a backstop for the assault you chose.

This isn't always the best way to play; you'll still experience bad games and poor teamwork. But it will give you time to get used to what your 'mech can really do without the brutally Darwinian process of getting rofflepwned over and over again until you learn what to do (which in some cases the game isn't really teaching you.) Focus on letting your Assaults pick the fight and back them up - this will get you wins, and it sounds like you may be in fairly low Elo. The reason I think so is that being left out to dry by your team is more common in lower-Elo games where many players are too busy hiding behind their favorite rock and avoiding damage to help teammates out. =) To really combat this problem, join a unit! Many units are willing to take in new players and train them up in the way they should go - go check out This Forum!

Finally, as several people have already noted, nearly all Clan 'mechs are very hot - this is the primary price they pay for their insane mobility, range, and weapons loads. Ignore pulse lasers for now, and try to engage at long range with ER Laser, ERPPCs, and/or LRMs. If you're fighting at ranges most Inner Sphere chassis can't match, your survivability will improve.

Above all, don't give up! The game can be brutal if you're not getting some of the concepts; it's different from other shooters, which is what makes it fun and interesting to play. But that very difference can make what you need to do counterintuitive, so it can seem like you'll never be able to excel and up your game. Don't believe it; skill is primarily a matter of effort and investment - keep on practicing, and picking other players' brains, like in this thread. You will improve, I guarantee it.

[Void Angel]

VoodooLou Kerensky, on 27 March 2015 - 03:30 PM, said:

Consider going solely with Inner Sphere Mechs since the Superior Technology that the Clans have at the moment 1.Cant fire more than 2 Large Lasers without incurring ghost heat (unlike the inferior tech of the Inner Sphere) 2. The ballistic hardpoints in the left and right torso's cant be fully appreciated until you realize that you can only put 1 AC20 on your Timby and then only on 1 arm, because they took away the ability to remove the jump jets so as to open up the Torso's Ballistics Hardpoints to fit another AC20 and 3. The Inner Sphere quirk passes even on the most ignored Inner Sphere Mech beats every Quirk percentage shown for All the Clan mechs. So Inferior Inner Sphere Tech has better heat manageability and only generates ghost heat when more than 3 Large Lasers (including pulse and the ER) are fired at one time, and 2 for the Clans Superior Technology. No Clan heavy mech that can mount 2 AC20's. And dismally low (so low to almost be insulting) quirk percentage numbers to fly in the face of the Inner Sphere's ravaged by War and the losing of information Inferior Tech.

Maybe the balance that the Devs are seeking came in the Clans staunch adherence to Zellbrigen instead of doing what any non-clanner would do and use subterfuge and guile as well as focused fire so to make up for the lack of the Overwhelming stupidity not seen by humanity since before Sun Tsu wrote the Ancient Art of War. Just glad I wasnt one of the people that paid $500 for the Gold Timby, Id be madder than a wet hen if I had since the Clans have been bludgeoned into 'balance' without even a courtesy reach around.

The thread for crying about Clan v. IS balance is over that way. Please be constructive and on-topic. Silly rants, conflating flavor text and game mechanics, about how the most powerful Heavy in the game, bar none, is "underpowered" will not help the player asking for help on how to play her heavy.

[PhoenixHawk OSF]

I've only been at this about 2 months, so I still consider myself somewhat of a newbie. I wrote a thread a while back outlining some of what I found to be expected, and it included some of what you are hitting. Basically, you have to expect to die a LOT in this. I've got 3 chassis to Elite now (Stalker, Thunderbolt, and Hunchback), and a few other random ones. It took me a while to get a handle on the Assaults because they're so slow, and I did what you sound like you're doing: Made bad choices about rounding this corner, or topping that hill, only to find 5+ enemy mechs unloading on me. Then the LRMs pour in if I was able to back out of that situation because a boat in the group locked onto me.

It's frustrating, but understand the underlying message: That's part of the game, and how you learn what not to do. I find myself being considerably more cautious these days, slowing before I make a turn and thinking, "play smart. Don't rush in." I have to tell myself that many times per match, because we all want to be part of the action. Be patient, find the spots to take your shots, then make them count.

I agree wholeheartedly about finding your own play style as well. I am a medium/heavy guy, and have found some ability to play my Stalkers. I'm trying now to learn to pilot a light, and I BLOW at it. I'm not willing to spend the Cbills on upgrading the engine on my FS to make it hyper-fast, so it's like a golf-cart running around with a target on it. I've not broken 200 damage with it yet, in multiple matches. Same goes for the Gauss rifle...I spent an entire day trying to figure out the timing on that dang thing. I HATE IT. I miss more than I hit because I can't time it right. It's an awesome weapon, hits hard, zero heat, LONG range, but that stupid wind-up-shoot thing is awful to me. I finally gave up and put an AC10 back on my HB. At least I can hit with that (I miss the Gauss Rifle from MW4).

My other point is to second what some have said: Join a good unit. I had several invites, including some friends who eventually got me into the unit I'm in. Many of the guys I'm playing with have been at this for a long time, but it helps. Doing CW drops today with 12 man groups from my unit, I had the best experiences I've had in this game. We focused fire, stayed in formation/location, and used actual strategy. You'll NEVER get that in PUGs.

There are a ton of people who whine constantly in PUG matches about "Stupid NOOB teams," or whatever. They're hoping for something it will never be: a well coordinated unit. PUG matches are random people who will run all over the place, step on you, in front of you, shoot you accidentally, block your movement, and get you killed. That's part of the game, and you have to set that expectation. Expecting a group of people who have never played together, aren't using coms, to work well as a unit, is like looking west for a sunrise; you're looking the wrong way.

In those PUG matches, patience is required 10-fold. Also the expectation of getting in that spot where the other team can target you before you know it, because there isn't a combined effort or strategy, is to be expected. Just learn to have fun with it, and blow up as much as you can..then re-launch and do it again.

[Questia]

Thank you so much for all those who gave me advice! I didn't expect the number to hit 20, let alone 40 - stretching to page 3 even! There's just so much to say, comment, and learn upon, so I can't respond to all of you individually, but rest assured your efforts are appreciated!

As a status update to put closure to this thread, I've been playing a lot more careful in the days since. Though I'm far from being in the top tier of players, I find myself surviving more and dealing a good deal of damage, especially when I'm with another 'mech, preferably an assault. Yes, I've been sticking with the group before, but now I'm actually choosing my shots instead of being hyper-aggressive.

I've also learned to slow down and calm myself. There's so much benefit to entering a Zen-like state (disclaimer: I haven't studied or practiced Zen) in this game, funnily enough - in a game like this, one would expect gameplay to be mostly about being as aggressive as possible, but nope.

In hindsight, I think it's my aggressive playstyle, clashing with my current build and the general mechanics of the game, that's causing me to fail before. Maybe it's partly because I'm still recovering from my previous life as an SRM24 Awesome, which I'll be revisiting very soon for comparison.

A small sampling of my personal responses:

Spleenslitta, on 27 March 2015 - 09:43 AM, said:

- snip -

Hmm, fair enough. I've done the opposite side before (insta-gibbed lights who kept popping out of the same location), so it would make sense that I'll be the victim of that, too.
As for the mix-weapon set, I find that the situations that require different types of weapons are too limited and dependent on external factors to justify having something for that situation. But I'll try that anyway - got pretty much everything save C-LRMs and C-ERPPCs, so experimentation is definitely possible.

Tesunie, on 27 March 2015 - 09:54 AM, said:

-snip-

My ping has stabilized at around 240, though at times it skips to 300. I dread the times when it goes above 400, though - especially 1k+, that ruins any usefulness a laser-centered build could have.
And my DPM, rounded to whole numbers, is 359 for TBR-PRIME (54 matches), 308 for TBR-C (372 matches), and 324 for TBR-S (98 matches). 75x5 = 375, so I'm below the cutoff... gotta play better. All of them have above 1.00 K/D ratio, but only one (TBR-PRIME) has above 1 W/L ratio, so... still, play better.
Speaking of fun, though, I'm thinking of trying something else - say, a SCR-Streakcrow, or a DRG-1N, or perhaps even a Hunchback or Centurion. Helps keep the variation going, though I think the Dragon would suffer the most because of the inflated Elo from my TBRs.

sycocys, on 27 March 2015 - 10:19 AM, said:

-snip-

Can't count how many times I've had shutdown screw me over. It's almost a rule for me now to engage override and keep it there, only relying on the heat counter to prevent overheat (I generally set my upper limit for alpha at 45%).

And so on... can't reply to you all (so tiring!), so just this: Thank you so much for all the help! I hope that other newbies also get to read all these - they're going to need all the help that they can get!

And on a lighter note:

Lord Psycho, on 27 March 2015 - 12:50 PM, said:

Hello Questia!
Give my greetings to Celestia when you can.

As much as I want to greet dear Princess, I just can't - somehow I've lost all contact with Equestria. Try contacting her faithful student (and fellow princess) Twilight Sparkle instead... if you can somehow reach her, anyway. Rumor has it that she's off on an investigation of a small town in the northern regions...

I still have some sort of contact with Gensokyo, though...

Edited by Questia, 29 March 2015 - 07:56 AM.

[The Basilisk]

Questia, your account from 4th march 2015....
You took a top tier meta mech wich is hated by every player on the enemy team AND your team for beeing OP. Except the other Timber pilots who will simply try to be better than you and have mostlikely more experience and more knowledge about the game than you.

So:
-- EVERYBODY on enemy team seeing you will most likely shoot you instantly no matter what other enemys are around just because you are piloting a Timberwolf. You already noticed you got focused instantly when you showed even a glimp of your nose.

--In public PuG lots of people on your team just will refuse to help you because you are essentially taking their money/ C-Bills

So you basically took one of the worst starter mechs possible cause you just won't have the time for playing around and trying diffrent taktiks and technics of this game.

[Void Angel]

Wow, you have up to four hundred ping?! Human reaction speed is (very generally) from 150-250ms - so you're playing with latency that may well be twice your own reaction time. Host State Rewind will take the edge off that disadvantage, but HSR and hit registration have been claimed to become "wonky" as ping times climb too high - I don't know what testing has been done on this, however.

If you can upgrade your hardware or internet connection speed, it might help you considerably with the game.

[Old Bones]

As my handle implies I'm one of the more mature (ahem) mech pilots here. One thing life has taught me is that no amount of skill, practice & equipment will ever take the place of pure dumb luck. Sometimes you'll have incredibly great matches, sometimes you'll have incredibly embarrassing matches & the deciding reason is it was/wasn't your day.

That said, the main thing you have to ask yourself, win or lose, is, "Did I have a good time?"

If the answer is "no" then you're probably trying too hard. Ease up on yourself & simplify your play style, this game has a steep learning curve. If you're trying too hard you're probably trying to master too many things at one time & not really getting very good at any of them. Figure out what are the minimum functions needed to have reasonable survivability & get really good at those before you get fancy with things. Master the basics 1st & the rest will follow. Experiment with different loadouts, biased toward energy for a couple of days & biased toward ballistics for a few days after that. You'll soon find that you're better with some weapon systems than others.

Quit worrying about your K/D ratio. It's almost a useless stat. To put previous posts in a different way... In a perfect match where the was just 1 last mech standing it is 100% that there is at least 1 pilot that did not get a kill. Mathematically impossible.

And all of the above advice from everybody else.

2 last things...
Get obsessive about targeting.

AND DON'T CHASE SQUIRRELS!!!

[ShinVector]

Questia, on 27 March 2015 - 09:07 AM, said:

Mind you, those are on three different chassis: one (TBR-PRIME) with the standard laservomit, another (TBR-S) with a ballistic brawling build, and a third (TBR-C) with MPL spam. And no, lag is not an excuse either: I get 240 - 340 ping, which should be good enough for things.

You must asian/oceanic/SA players.... But honestly 240-340 is pretty bad variable ping... MWO netcode apparently doesn't like that especially for lasers.

My suggestion probably is to go Dual gauss MadCat with Advanced Zoom if possible. (Seismic is default though)
Remember your game plan in that thing is not to out right kill people (well you can but its tough).
Primary game plan is to be an asset to your team and be a nuisance to your enemy.
Poking holes in their armour at usually safe distance of 1KM... And killing off heavily damage enemies with a well aimed snipe.
I am recommending ballistics (ballistics work better for high ping) until you get used to scrappy lasers at high ping... Been playing with high ping for long long time.

Edited by ShinVector, 29 March 2015 - 06:50 PM.

[MavRCK]

Learn the basics - watch videos - watch streams

[Surn]

Omni mechs like the tw seem to work best with general builds, not specialty builds like inner sphere mechs. Exception for streak boat tw-s and stormcrow.

Edited by MechregSurn, 29 March 2015 - 07:16 PM.

[HimseIf]

Questia, on 27 March 2015 - 09:07 AM, said:

here's a short list of the blunders that I have done in a Timber Wolf:

• immediately focused down and relieved of 16% max HP after just one poke
  
• Gotten a barely-above-100 damage game
  
• Gotten no kills at all
  
• Averaging less than 400-500 damage per game
  
• Finding oneself always out of step, firing out with no one to stand by, no one to follow through, [insert common blunder in pugs here]...
  
• Not even getting into good engagement range without being slaughtered
  
• And more...

This is normal for most people.

[Scum of the Earth]

VoodooLou Kerensky, on 27 March 2015 - 03:30 PM, said:

Consider going solely with Inner Sphere Mechs since the Superior Technology that the Clans have at the moment 1.Cant fire more than 2 Large Lasers without incurring ghost heat (unlike the inferior tech of the Inner Sphere) 2. The ballistic hardpoints in the left and right torso's cant be fully appreciated until you realize that you can only put 1 AC20 on your Timby and then only on 1 arm, because they took away the ability to remove the jump jets so as to open up the Torso's Ballistics Hardpoints to fit another AC20 and 3. The Inner Sphere quirk passes even on the most ignored Inner Sphere Mech beats every Quirk percentage shown for All the Clan mechs. So Inferior Inner Sphere Tech has better heat manageability and only generates ghost heat when more than 3 Large Lasers (including pulse and the ER) are fired at one time, and 2 for the Clans Superior Technology. No Clan heavy mech that can mount 2 AC20's. And dismally low (so low to almost be insulting) quirk percentage numbers to fly in the face of the Inner Sphere's ravaged by War and the losing of information Inferior Tech.

Maybe the balance that the Devs are seeking came in the Clans staunch adherence to Zellbrigen instead of doing what any non-clanner would do and use subterfuge and guile as well as focused fire so to make up for the lack of the Overwhelming stupidity not seen by humanity since before Sun Tsu wrote the Ancient Art of War. Just glad I wasnt one of the people that paid $500 for the Gold Timby, Id be madder than a wet hen if I had since the Clans have been bludgeoned into 'balance' without even a courtesy reach around.

*finishes crying with laughter*

... Oh my God, oh my God... Did anyone else find it hilarious that he was whining about not having 2 AC 20's on a heavy mech? Especially one that moves as fast as most medium mechs with the armor of nearly an assault? Not to mention having very decent heat efficiency AND mobility? Nah nah... Timber Wolves needs A LOT of help. Being restricted to being a laser boat that can wipe out most IS light mechs in 1 shot isn't nearly powerful enough... XD

[Xaiier]

Questia, on 27 March 2015 - 09:07 AM, said:

It's simply disheartening to go with the best mech, the best builds, and the most optimal stuff (I have elited two of them, and the third needs only less than 7k XP to complete), and STILL find yourself utterly beaten time and time again.

I found the problem.

You rolled in here, saw that the Timber Wolf was by far the "best" mech (as if that has any meaning), and presumed that if you only managed to get one, you would begin dominating like a pro.

Except that isn't how this game works. The pilot makes the mech, not the other way around. Sure, having one of the statistically better mechs helps, but if you are playing it like a noob, and you don't know its strengths and weaknesses, you will get wrecked time and time again by pilots who know their inferior mechs better.

But you might say, "Oh, but the Timber Wolf has no weaknesses, it excels in every way!" and you would be right. Except one thing. Aside from the Dire Wolf, no mech is more feared, and thus primaried, more than the Timber Wolf. Being a new player in a mech that is guaranteed to be target number one is probably the worst thing you can do. In fact, I would suggest honing your skills in a mech that is absolute crap, because everyone will ignore you, and then when you do learn, switching into a more powerful mech will be a fantastic improvement.

[Zordicron]

Never fight the enemy face on. Move at an angle. The biggest armor buff you can give yourself is not to walk directly at the enemy and move, a lot. TBR hitbox will spread the dmg for you if all you do is move a bit. Otherwise people will just gank you in the pointy nose bit.

[AlmightyAeng]

Dulahan, on 27 March 2015 - 12:21 PM, said:

400-500 damage matches consistently?

Seriously, only the top tier players are doing that, I don 't care what mech they're in. I've seen entire matches where no one had that much damage on either side. If you're topping 200 damage as a new player, you're doing great. Hell, I still consider 250 damage to be a good match two years and some change in. Oh, I can massively surpass that at times. But yeeeeah...

I think there's a bit of expectation inflation going on! So don't let that score make you think you're terrible.

... ... ... 400-500 is an average good game. It's not a 'top tier' average. I'd consider 400-600 a "good" game. 600-800 a "great" game, and 800+ to be "top tier."

200-250? Well, new players have to start somewhere.

[AlmightyAeng]

Molossian Dog, on 27 March 2015 - 05:48 PM, said:

When people, however skilled and experienced, act like they always get 500+ dmg and 3+ kills --- then they lie.
Or their selective memory fools them.

No one ALWAYS gets that; everyone has a bad game now and again. But on average? Yeah...if you take my past 2225 games, my average damage per game is 505.9. My average kills over those same games is 1.3 kills.