28 replies to this topic

[Mawai]

Wouldn't alot of these issues be addressed simply by quirking the Jenner CT armor or structure by 10 or 15 points? Maybe that isn't the ideal approach but it might increase the survivability if that is the real issue with the Jenner.

However, I think power creep came into play with the firestarters. They have more hard points, better geometry (or at least apparently more forgiving), essentially the same top speed as the Jenner (the difference between 295 and 300 is negligible in practice), and in many cases better quirks. The SRM4 quirks on the JR7-D are laughable since its primary weapon is usually medium lasers. The quirks on the other Jenners are similar.

Compare:

FS9-H (ML heat generation -7.5%) (Energy Heat generation -7.5%) (Energy Range 10%)
6E and 2B

JR7-F (Energy Range +7.5%)
6E

FS9-H has far better quirks, better hit boxes, two extra ballistic hard points, essentially same top speed ... why would you ever take the Jenner in that situation?

Compare:

FS9-S (Medium Pulse laser heat generation -15%) (Energy heat generation -15%)
7E 2AMS

JR7-K (Medium pulse laser cool down -7.5%) (Energy cooldown -7.5%) (Energy heat generation -10%)
4E 1M

Light mechs always have trouble with heat since energy weapons are often the basis for their firepower. A 30% heat reduction on MPL is huge compared to a 10% plus 15% cooldown ... the JR7-K will not be able to fire lasers as often without overheating. Plus if you fit the mech with anything but MPL ... the FS9-H still gets 15% heat reduction across the board AND it can equip 2 AMS if you are so inclined.

If you want a reason for the dearth of Jenners on the field ... I think it can mostly be attributed to the fact that PGI generally made Firestarters strictly better in terms of hard points and hit boxes AND further exacerbated this by giving them better quirks.

P.S. Just as a reference point ... I have mastered 3 Jenners and 2 of the Firestarters so far

Edited by Mawai, 03 April 2015 - 04:13 AM.

[MonkeyCheese]

Havent consistently driven my founders/sarah jenner or my raven 3L in a long time. I guess more than any form of hitbox problems it was always the constant up and down of missile damage and their registration issues that was the kicker for me. That and there are better options in arm hardpoints (com, spider or fs) or pure speed (com and locust) for my laser vomit light mech needs.

[Nothing Whatsoever]

I wonder if shrinking the CT with bigger Leg, and ST hitboxes would help, then quirks can pick up any slack.

Here's a crude mock up:

[Wildstreak]

At least Abrams did not have loop-de-loop starships pulling maneuvers of WWI biplanes.

[Haji1096]

The only thing the JR7 is better at that the FS9 is being able to engage larger mechs from slightly higher range / peeking.

However, the hitboxes and durability of the FS9 is so good that you could just run in there and do a bunch of dumb **** and come out taking little to no damage. The MPL quirked FS9 is the most versatile light mech currently.

I'm of the opinion that the best way to learn how to play a light mech is to start off with Locusts because your mistakes will be punished. FS9 can encourage bad habits because of its hit boxes and durability.

[Necromonger Commander]

I am surprised that there are not more Jenners. I plan to master them, but do like the heat quirks of the firestarters. Jenner has one better agility level than Firestarters (tiny versus small), they are smaller, they are shorter, their guns can shoot at things that cannot shoot back if they have a small hill (anything a Firestarter can shoot can shoot back)....

So it is pretty obvious why the quirks were given to Firestarters. Jenner takes more skill because it has more agility and ways to use its high weapons to use cover extremely effectively, while the firestarter has a little more firepower (The best firestarter pilots only use 5-6 of their hard points, same as the Jenner) and better damage spreading. Jenner has more internal space because it can mount a 300 engine giving it one more internal heat sink.

I have played a lot of firestaters and 90% of the time I die from side torso or leg damage, so having a bigger center torso hit box would actually make the firestarter better.

Edited by Necromonger Commander, 03 April 2015 - 05:53 AM.

[zagibu]

Come back when you played them extensively. Would be interesting to see your opinion change.

[Y E O N N E]

Haji1096, on 03 April 2015 - 05:27 AM, said:

The only thing the JR7 is better at that the FS9 is being able to engage larger mechs from slightly higher range / peeking.

However, the hitboxes and durability of the FS9 is so good that you could just run in there and do a bunch of dumb **** and come out taking little to no damage. The MPL quirked FS9 is the most versatile light mech currently.

I'm of the opinion that the best way to learn how to play a light mech is to start off with Locusts because your mistakes will be punished. FS9 can encourage bad habits because of its hit boxes and durability.

This is true. I drop in FS9s and I get lazy, because it lets you get lazy.

[topgun505]

If they permitted jump jets (even just one) on the Locust I'd probably dump my Jenners at this point.

Yeonne Greene, on 02 April 2015 - 09:12 PM, said:

There's nothing a Jenner can do that a Locust can't do better...

...wait, what?

Edited by topgun505, 06 April 2015 - 09:39 AM.