35 replies to this topic

[Alienized]

nop.
too many lrm's already on too many mechs that use LRM's way too ineffective (atlas anyone?)
and....
how bout no?
and more no. the game is totally balanced at this point. some mechs are not and they will get a well needed quirk pass (clanmechs that is)

some IS mechs need some re-adjusting i.e NERF! (firestarters most of them)
dont come up with pointless suggestions like this. artemis is not a problem and never been something that needed any change.

[Mystere]

And thus rendering Clan LRMs relatively more useless than they are now?

[Zoid]

LRMs are not where the imbalance lies. Clan launchers weigh less, but they're far easier to avoid, unless you're doing something stupid like sticking an LRM 20 in a 5 tube slot.

There are areas where clans have a significant advantage (such as streaks), but LRMs are fine.

[Burktross]

Just make artemis a one time purchase, but keep all the slot and tonnage penalties. That way you can change it freely without punishment by taxes.

Mystere, on 04 April 2015 - 10:24 AM, said:

And thus rendering Clan LRMs relatively more useless than they are now?

God damn shutterstock.

[Bobzilla]

If you thought IS missiles are weaker, this isn't a good solution. Tweak the missiles/benifit of Artemis, not a straight upgrade with no point to not take it.

[Bulletsponge0]

ACH75, on 03 April 2015 - 09:41 PM, said:

Artemis Free Weight for IS to reduce the gap VS Clan Extralight launchers...

so, you think clan LRMs are superior to IS LRMs?

really?

[Juodas Varnas]

Bulletsponge0, on 04 April 2015 - 10:56 AM, said:

so, you think clan LRMs are superior to IS LRMs?

really?

Well, they weigh two times less.
And the stream of missiles does have much more cockpit shake than the single burst of IS LRMs (unless of course the IS LRMs are 5s and are constantly vomitted out, but that's not common nowadays)
.
.
The only thing i see that's ****** about them, is that they're more prone to be eaten by AMS, but when everyone runs AMS, IS LRMs get destroyed by multiple. AMS too

Edited by Juodas Varnas, 04 April 2015 - 11:02 AM.

[Mystere]

Juodas Varnas, on 04 April 2015 - 11:00 AM, said:

Well, they weigh two times less.
.

I have a question. What would happen if Clan LRMs, and all of their equipment for that matter, weighed just like their IS equivalents?

[Bulletsponge0]

Juodas Varnas, on 04 April 2015 - 11:00 AM, said:

Well, they weigh two times less.
And the stream of missiles does have much more cockpit shake than the single burst of IS LRMs (unless of course the IS LRMs are 5s and are constantly vomitted out, but that's not common nowadays)
.
.
The only thing i see that's ****** about them, is that they're more prone to be eaten by AMS, but when everyone runs AMS, IS LRMs get destroyed by multiple. AMS too

and they are much easier to spread damage or avoid because of that stream fire too

you're hung up on the "weighs less therefore better" without taking into account the actual functionality of the weapon

[Juodas Varnas]

Bulletsponge0, on 04 April 2015 - 11:06 AM, said:

and they are much easier to spread damage or avoid because of that stream fire too

you're hung up on the "weighs less therefore better" without taking into account the actual functionality of the weapon

Well, when it comes to IS LRMs you don't even need to spread damage, because they do it by themselves, since Clan LRMs seem to have much lower spread and actually require you to twist and turn to spread the damage around.

Edited by Juodas Varnas, 04 April 2015 - 11:14 AM.

[Void Angel]

ACH75, on 03 April 2015 - 09:41 PM, said:

Artemis Free Weight for IS to reduce the gap VS Clan Extralight launchers...

FupDup, on 03 April 2015 - 09:44 PM, said:

Artemis needing a little extra weight and slots makes it more of a tradeoff/choice than something you just toggle on and never remove.

Amen.

Juodas Varnas, on 03 April 2015 - 09:46 PM, said:

Not going to happen.

Clans need their special snowflake treatment, because that's canon.

Actually, it's not cannon, a fact which some silly people still whine about.

You're half-right however, Juodas - the Clans do need their advantages in order to compensate for their limitations. The Clans are still difficult opponents in Community Warfare, yet while balance changes should be (and are) in the works, they can still be beaten.

Clan v. Inner Sphere balance is based on many interrelated factors - such as the fact that the Clans can't move the locations of ferro-fibrous armor and endosteel. Suggesting that we should buff just one area of IS technology to compensate for just one equivalent area of Clan technology is simply too simplistic to work

Edited by Void Angel, 04 April 2015 - 11:33 AM.

[Void Angel]

On the subject of Clan LRMs, the frustrating thing about Clanner LRM launchers, from an Inner Sphere standpoint, isn't that they're too powerful per se - it's that a Clanner with LRMs can still mount significant direct-fire armaments, or else rain forever if he specializes as a boat. A couple of Mad Cats and a Mad Dog shakeboat can make life a living hell for anyone trying to face the rest of their team and fight; while the stream of incoming fire is more vulnerable to AMS and does less damage to targets who are just reaching cover, it is actually more effective at blinding the enemy, since the stream of missiles just never seems to stop, while still doing significant damage. Combine it with how many Clan 'mechs like Active Probes, and you have situations where Clanners can deal massive amounts of damage with a spotter, while the Inner Sphere pilot can't even see to fight back.

I'm not arguing that anything needs (or doesn't need) a nerf here. It's just that if you're a Clan player going up against the Inner Sphere, you're not having to experience this from the other end. Food for thought.

Edited by Void Angel, 04 April 2015 - 11:31 AM.

[Johnny Z]

red devil2, on 04 April 2015 - 09:37 AM, said:

Sorry Ach but that's not a good idea. IS has already an advantage due to the clans missiles fired in stream. However, it should make IS SRM a bit (5% - 7%) more narrow. Also, if I remember correctly, IS SRMs deal more damage per missile.

Some of us dont use aim bots and when clan missiles fire in a stream legit players cant aim or even move alot of the time. You say its a disadvantage is wrong or a lie. Which is it?

Edited by Johnny Z, 04 April 2015 - 12:23 PM.

[Koniving]

MechaBattler, on 03 April 2015 - 11:16 PM, said:

ECM makes the weight investment in LRMs for the IS just not worth it. I have to throw on Tag, get in line of sight, take a few hits as I wait for lock? Get the hell out of here.

That's an ECM issue. The canon material for ECM is ECM does not affect LRMs or SRMs or Streaks.
It affects Artemis, affects NARC, affects BAP and depending on which source book you read, may or may not affect TAG. It also stops communication of anything trying to 'spot' within 180 meters. Pretty much it.
(Almost forgot, it denies you detailed information on loadout and damage, so if you saw a Raven 3-L you'd have no trouble targeting it, locking it or hitting it with your LRMs, SRMs or Streaks. You just wouldn't know how damaged it is or what weapons it is using).

Most of the stuff it does in MWO? It isn't supposed to do.

There's also the double armor issue, but meh.

Edited by Koniving, 04 April 2015 - 12:31 PM.

[MechaBattler]

Bulletsponge0, on 04 April 2015 - 09:51 AM, said:

so, what I'm seeing is that you want to shoot, but not be shot at, forcing your teammates to expose themselves to enemy fire for your benefit. Thats kind of a selfish attitude to have.

I'm talking about the fact LRMs in non boating builds are pointless because of ECM. If you have to use tag. You might as well use a different weapon entirely. It'd be nice if I could take an LRM5 as a back up long range weapon and not find it turned into a 2 ton paper weight, plus ammo, because of one ECM mech. Even then, it doesn't deal much damage.

Koniving, on 04 April 2015 - 12:26 PM, said:

That's an ECM issue. The canon material for ECM is ECM does not affect LRMs or SRMs or Streaks.
It affects Artemis, affects NARC, affects BAP and depending on which source book you read, may or may not affect TAG. It also stops communication of anything trying to 'spot' within 180 meters. Pretty much it.
(Almost forgot, it denies you detailed information on loadout and damage, so if you saw a Raven 3-L you'd have no trouble targeting it, locking it or hitting it with your LRMs, SRMs or Streaks. You just wouldn't know how damaged it is or what weapons it is using).

Most of the stuff it does in MWO? It isn't supposed to do.

There's also the double armor issue, but meh.

This. Let's have this instead.

Edited by MechaBattler, 04 April 2015 - 12:33 PM.

[charov]

Johnny Z, on 04 April 2015 - 12:21 PM, said:

Some of us dont use aim bots and when clan missiles fire in a stream legit players cant aim or even move alot of the time. You say its a disadvantage is wrong or a lie. Which is it?

Oh there you are! I thought you were dead, there weren't enough tears around today. Unfortunately I was wrong

Suggestion: write less, play more. You could discover that the environment is indestructible and that lrm can't go through a cover. Also, you could discover that raddep is everything you need to survive almost any lrm in pug. Lastly, that if you switch to thermal you usually can keep firing without almost any problem if you manoeuvre to break the lock meanwhile.

However, I image that you sit in the open crying when targeted by lmrs, as you do every time here on this forum. I feel sorry for you. Can I help you in some manner, perhaps with a hug? It's free for you, I won't charge a poor, sad soul such as yours