54 replies to this topic

[Agent 0 Fortune]

PGI prosed an ELO reset, and a segregation of ELO group and ELO solo metrics. This came as a surprise to me, since I didn’t believe ELO was used or modified in the group queue (learn something new every day).

But apparently after a hard day of reaping PUGs the groups have complained that their solo matches don’t represent their actual ELO skill level, and they are experiencing the same match quality of the PUG groups they pillage in the group queue.

What do you think? Should group queue differ from solo queue, or does the company you keep the make the measure of the man.

*** for those of you who get hung up on ELO capitalized... get over it, it is simply an emphasis of the designation of the scoring process for matchmaking, not intended as a an acronym.

[Goose]

I can't think of a bad reason to have moar Elos per player, so do it.

May as well reset the stats, to go with an Elo Reset, too …

[Nothing Whatsoever]

I'd love to see more separate Elo scores!

If we can get a Solo / Group separation, then great!

It's a start!

---

And ELO...

Spoiler

[One Medic Army]

I'd like this as well. I tend to group (if I group) with the same group of guys, and lets just say that we're probably nowhere near having a similar Elo score as individuals. When we group up, it's generally so bad that we just almost never play together, which in turn makes us play less.

Now if My group Elo could be representative of the group of friends I run with, while still letting me play solo in my proper Elo there, I'd be a happy player.

[Rat of the Legion Vega]

The ELO in this game is such a cr**shoot most of the time I doubt a reset or separate scores will make much difference to people's experience. It might be nice for a couple of weeks, then the matchmaker will fall back into its usual stupidity of creating pre-rigged matches and then gambling your ELO on the sick little torture porn games it sets up for its own twisted amusement.

.

Edited by Rat of the Legion Vega, 17 April 2015 - 08:30 PM.

[Mystere]

PGI is about to embark on another futile and time wasting effort just because some players cannot handle the fact that other people are just simply better than they are in playing the game.

[Levi Porphyrogenitus]

I'd like to see a rework of the Elo system entirely.

Turn the current Elo rating of each player into their Generic Elo rating.

Once they have 25 matches in a specific weight class, copy those specific matches from the Generic Elo rating and make them the new Weight Class Elo for that specific weight class.

Once they have 25 matches in a specific chassis, copy those matches from the Weight Class Elo for the appropriate weight class and make them the new Chassis Elo for that specific chassis.

Once they have 25 matches in a specific variant, copy those matches from the Chassis Elo for the appropriate chassis and make them the new Variant Elo for that specific variant.

The whole thing becomes a tiered Elo system. When you hop into a new weight class that you have fewer than 25 games in, you get your Generic Elo rating for those matches. When you hop into a new chassis that you have fewer than 25 games in, you get your Weight Class Elo for those matches. When you hop into a new variant that you have fewer than 25 games in, you get your Chassis Elo for those matches. And when you're driving that meta variant with 1k+ games in it, you use the Variant Elo for those matches.

As for groups, I'd be inclined to bump the average Elo of the group up a bit, prorated by group size. For instance, +5% for 2s, +8% for 3s, +10% for 4s, +12% for 5s, +15% for 6s, +18% for 7s, +20% for 8s, +22% for 9s, +25% for 10s, and +30% for 12s. Have this simply be added to the group average Elo ad hoc.

[Goose]

Rat of the Legion Vega, on 17 April 2015 - 08:28 PM, said:

The ELO in this game is such a cr**shoot most of the time I doubt a reset or separate scores will make much difference to people's experience. It might be nice for a couple of weeks, then the matchmaker will fall back into its usual stupidity of creating pre-rigged matches and then gambling your ELO on the sick little torture porn games it sets up for its own twisted amusement.

I'm afraid you've confused Elo with Matchmaker … Which, in turn, is chuck full of Release Valves.

Conversely, if it wern't for TeamStack Mode, I wouldn't believe in Elo, ether …

Edited by Goose, 19 April 2015 - 11:57 AM.

[Agent 0 Fortune]

Mystere, on 17 April 2015 - 08:34 PM, said:

PGI is about to embark on another futile and time wasting effort just because some players cannot handle the fact that other people are just simply better than they are in playing the game.

And therein lies the rub.
The "master race" of MWO players are the ones complaining. They find themselves underwater when presented with a pool of their peers.
Personally I am on the fence on this issue. I established my elo brackets through group play in the mixed queue, but now primary play solo, so I understand that, in the interest of maintaining the player base, it is is PGIs best interest in keeping a separate accounting of war crimes (group) and individual rankings.
Instead I feel Elo should be kept on a per variant basis rather than group segregation. I feel that if you can pull 'bull's' with your ThunderWolf in group queue shouldn't the same standard be expected in solo? however when you solo in your QuillDraw which you just purchased, it should start with a fresh Elo, or an Elo aggregate across all mechs.

Edited by Agent 0 Fortune, 17 April 2015 - 09:22 PM.

[Mystere]

Agent 0 Fortune, on 17 April 2015 - 08:47 PM, said:

And therein lies the rub.
The "master race" of MWO players are the ones complaining. They find themselves underwater when presented with a pool of their piers.
Personally I am on the fence on this issue. I established my elo brackets through group play in the mixed queue, but now primary play solo, so I understand that, in the interest of maintaining the player base, it is is PGIs best interest in keeping a separate accounting of war crimes (group) and individual rankings.
Instead I feel Elo should be kept on a per variant basis rather than group segregation. I feel that if you can pull 'bull's' with your ThunderWolf in group queue shouldn't the same standard be expected in solo? however when you solo in your QuillDraw which you just purchased, it should start with a fresh Elo, or an Elo aggregate across all mechs.

Matchmaking just gets even more complicated by having Elo per variant.

What percentage of players actually think the Elo-based matchmaker we have now is much better than the random "matchmaking" we had before?

And considering we now have a truly solo queue, why not try random matchmaking again? It's much simpler and works much faster.

And finally, which so-called "master race" in history did not eventually get put down by their "lessers"?

Edited by Mystere, 17 April 2015 - 08:55 PM.

[Zolaz]

Goose, on 17 April 2015 - 08:00 PM, said:

I can't think of a bad reason to have moar Elos per player, so do it.

May as well reset the stats, to go with an Elo Reset, too …

Why do you want to reset everything ... I hate having to use math to figure my long term stats.

[Nothing Whatsoever]

Mystere, on 17 April 2015 - 08:53 PM, said:

Matchmaking just gets even more complicated by having Elo per variant.

I'm not sure how this may be the case though.

The matchmaker is only using one of my potential scores at any one time for a match.


This way, I personally can continue to do poorly in my Awesomes (one of my favs by the way, if we could one day see chassis specific or even variant specific Elo scores), do average in my few Atlas, but kick tons of standard (and ferro) armor in my Stalker, Dires or Battlemaster.

Than having these scores separate from grouping up, would allow me to derp around with more of my mechs more often with confidence that I'm not going to hurt the teams I'm grouping with, when Elo is used heavily as in solo.

[Goose]

Zolaz, on 17 April 2015 - 09:06 PM, said:

Why do you want to reset everything ... I hate having to use math to figure my long term stats.

Do you even Excel, Bro?

[Nothing Whatsoever]

Goose, on 17 April 2015 - 09:41 PM, said:

Do you even Excel, Bro?

I whatever OpenOffice calls excel!
(Being space poor does that to a person!)

[ShinVector]

It should and the ELO for SOLO at least should be reset.

[CptGier]

They should reset everything, then give us 100 games to play, then after 100 games, it uses our average everything, dmg, assists, kills, wins, losses, deaths, survivals, role bonuses, blah blah, to give us our average ELO....

[xMintaka]

Having separate ELO scores for group and solo queue sounds like a great idea.

I'm all for a reset (stat reset would be nice too), could make the games more fun.

[Gagis]

KiIl the Elo system with fire.

The Random Number Generator is fair and impartial.

[Appogee]

The way the matchmaker uses the average Elo of 12 people to try to create two equal teams is just ********. Do what you want with Elo, the matchmaking methodology is the real issue.

[STEF_]

Elo MM, as PGI has conceived it, should not even be proposed.
So, a reset won't have a sense at all, because such a elo MM will still suck.