50 replies to this topic

[Alistair Winter]

I want a shadowcat, on 02 May 2015 - 09:40 PM, said:

Catapult problems:
1) weapons that spread dmg
2) giant CT

Thunders on the other hand:
1) very tanky (of course ST engine all day long)
2) a lot of pinpoint dmg

These 2 condition on both side even before the quirk system.
After the quirk system: Thunder ""OP.""

edit: I mean OQ. Over Quirked

Your argument doesn't explain why the Thunderbolt was a fairly unpopular mech when it was first released. The CPLT was always second to the CTF and the Jager, but it was still around when the Thunderbolt was released. The Thunderbolt didn't make the CPLT obsolete in any way.

[Karen Supreme]

lsp, on 02 May 2015 - 09:02 PM, said:

The Stormcrow and Thunderbolt is comparing apples to oranges. Not even close, the Stormcrow is so ridiculously op it's not funny. The hitboxes might as well not even exist, they're so godly. The Thunderbolt is a barn door, easy to take off ST's and turn into a walking stick. In fac tthe Thunderbolt was one of the worst mechs in the game until the quirks came out.

I'm sorry but my thunders eat any crow for breakfast.... thanks to dat 7mpl pinpoint dmg and dps....

Alistair Winter, on 02 May 2015 - 09:43 PM, said:

Your argument doesn't explain why the Thunderbolt was a fairly unpopular mech when it was first released. The CPLT was always second to the CTF and the Jager, but it was still around when the Thunderbolt was released. The Thunderbolt didn't make the CPLT obsolete in any way.

It does explain.
It is uberquirked, now. That's why now is popular.
I don't remember to having see thunders in the battlefield berofe quirk system. They were very rare.
Before quirks, it was impossible to have such a weaponry, and make it works. That's why, even if they tank better, player preferred Jag or even catapult.

Edited by I want a shadowcat, 02 May 2015 - 09:54 PM.

[Duke Nedo]

Alastair explained it nicely in the first post, the thunder was good before quirks, a bit underestimated and not very popular, but pretty good. Tier 5 quirks made them the best IS mechs per tonnage together with fs9. Not OP by my definition because the other side has stormcrows and timbers who are even better.

The intra clan and intra IS balance are not good though. We need a new quirk pass IMO with less coin toss. Clans are getting 3 new really good chassi soon, the two resistance packs probably do not bring anything at all to cw...

[Juodas Varnas]

I, for one, wish they were nerfed.

Just because i love them so much and i wish it was less popular, because i'm a special snowflake.

Before you say anything, the Thunderbolt i use, is LRM15, LL, 3xML. 2XMG, stock engine one, i basically just removed the srm2, added endosteel, double heatsinks and slapped more armor+ammo.

Edited by Juodas Varnas, 02 May 2015 - 10:33 PM.

[GoatHILL]

Do you use that in CW?

[Juodas Varnas]

GoatHILL, on 02 May 2015 - 10:22 PM, said:

Do you use that in CW?

Not really?
I do... have some more meta builds like the ERPPC 9S and LPL 9SE, but only because i don't want to be a burden.
I really don't enjoy using them.

The 5S is for Pub'ing and actually has the best stats of all my Thunderbolts.

[Appogee]

E Rommel, on 02 May 2015 - 05:15 PM, said:

Honestly, if quirks were removed I'd take a Hunchback over a Thunderbolt.

I want to play the opponents you're playing!

I'm levelling Hunchbacks at the moment. The hunch RT is targeted relentlessly and despite my best peekaboo tactics it's usually removed before I can rack up a decent amount of damage. Then I get to wander around pew-pewing with one or two backup lasers until someone puts me out of my misery.

I believe that, even without quirks, Thuds are far tankier and less vulnerable to the removal of 80% of their weapons by high alpha long range Clan mechs..

Edited by Appogee, 03 May 2015 - 12:00 AM.

[MrMadguy]

While Awesome is oversized Heavy, Thunderbolt is undersized Assault.

[zagibu]

Alistair Winter, on 02 May 2015 - 09:43 PM, said:

Your argument doesn't explain why the Thunderbolt was a fairly unpopular mech when it was first released.

Indeed. You basically never saw them, because everyone played Jagers instead.

It's just sad that the quirks promote such very un-Thunderboltlike loadouts.

[H I A S]

lsp, on 02 May 2015 - 09:02 PM, said:

The Stormcrow and Thunderbolt is comparing apples to oranges. Not even close, the Stormcrow is so ridiculously op it's not funny. The hitboxes might as well not even exist, they're so godly. The Thunderbolt is a barn door, easy to take off ST's and turn into a walking stick. In fac tthe Thunderbolt was one of the worst mechs in the game until the quirks came out.

Hitboxes are fine.
Aim for the CT, or the Legs.

[Molossian Dog]

This thread is a misnomer.

We are not talking Thunderbolts. We are talking Thunderwubs. One specific TDR-5SS build.
Not the whole chassis, which, that one build excluded, isn´t very impressive since the -9S got nerfed.

To this day I have seen nobody exclaim "oh sh!t, it is a TDR-5S!"

Edited by Molossian Dog, 03 May 2015 - 04:28 AM.

[Mar-X-maN]

Escef, on 02 May 2015 - 05:59 PM, said:

Pre-quirk, yes, the T-bolt was nothing but a nostalgia mech.

It still is for me. I just bought it first of all the nostalgia mechs because of its usefullness in a 3x TDR CW dropdeck. Otherwise I would have bought the Shadow Hawk first which I favour over it because Grayson Death Carlyle.

[Steve Pryde]

Juodas Varnas, on 02 May 2015 - 10:15 PM, said:

Before you say anything, the Thunderbolt i use, is LRM15, LL, 3xML. 2XMG, stock engine one

I used the same config before quirks. But now its unplayable cause of this overquirked **** that other mechs have. And with that much ECM on the battlefield and how i works LRMs are nearly unplayable, specially if u try it not to boat them.

[Escef]

Steve Pryde, on 03 May 2015 - 05:16 AM, said:

I used the same config before quirks. But now its unplayable cause of this overquirked **** that other mechs have. And with that much ECM on the battlefield and how i works LRMs are nearly unplayable, specially if u try it not to boat them.

My 5S(P)'s config has been unchanged since the first time I used it. 275 standard engine (scavenged out of one of my Shadowhawks), Endo, 394 Ferro armor (46 per leg, otherwise maxed), LL, 3xML, 2xAC5 w/3 tons ammo, +2 double sink. The heat and the ammo are both a little tight, but it is a decent workhorse configuration.

[TyphonCh]

GoatHILL, on 02 May 2015 - 04:54 PM, said:

Do people really think the TDR is OP?

Are they good mechs without a doubt but I would not say they are OP. What makes them used so much in CW is they are the best 65 ton mech even without quirks.

The best? Hardly... Before quirks, you NEVER saw thunderbolts. They were just your ordinary, run of the mill 65 tonner.

The only thing making it so godly right is the current laser vomit meta, (reinforced by quirks) and it fits nicely into a CW deck. Otherwise... it's completely meh

[Yokaiko]

Appogee, on 02 May 2015 - 11:59 PM, said:

I want to play the opponents you're playing!

I'm levelling Hunchbacks at the moment. The hunch RT is targeted relentlessly and despite my best peekaboo tactics it's usually removed before I can rack up a decent amount of damage. Then I get to wander around pew-pewing with one or two backup lasers until someone puts me out of my misery.

I believe that, even without quirks, Thuds are far tankier and less vulnerable to the removal of 80% of their weapons by high alpha long range Clan mechs..

That is a matter of tactic.

Truly you should never really be exposed to long range alpha, I'll usually hide behind something big and scary on my team till things get close THEN I come out and tear into people.

That being said I haven't putzed around with my GI, all of my Hunchies are straight brawlers, -4G, -4SP, -4P, during the hero challenge the -4G(F) was my best mech I averaged 67 points a game with it, better than my Stormcrow(I) by far, my second best was a Flame, which is essentially a bigger -4G, four mlas AC20 and an attitude.

Some of that is play style, I don't play peek-a-boo well, I like to get into people's grill and run them over.

[zagibu]

Escef, on 03 May 2015 - 06:41 AM, said:

My 5S(P)'s config has been unchanged since the first time I used it. 275 standard engine (scavenged out of one of my Shadowhawks), Endo, 394 Ferro armor (46 per leg, otherwise maxed), LL, 3xML, 2xAC5 w/3 tons ammo, +2 double sink. The heat and the ammo are both a little tight, but it is a decent workhorse configuration.

I have a similar loadout, but instead of the LL, I use a SRM6. I also have 1 more ton AC/5 ammo.

[Black Ivan]

The quirk system of PGI is more the problem. I liked the TBolts before the überquirking and creating the actual Laser Meta.

[CrushLibs]

The 9S after nerfs can still shoot 14 erppc shots vs 8 for a TW on tourmaline. 25% heat gen is HUGE much less the stupid 50% which gave the 9S 21 shots.

The 15% heat gen quirk gives the TDR-5SS an extra 8 secs before overheating 19 sec vs 27 secs which is huge considering a TW with 2 LPL and 4 Meds overheats in 15 secs. 135 dmg vs 83 dmg before overheating

[Yokaiko]

CrushLibs, on 03 May 2015 - 08:18 AM, said:

The 9S after nerfs can still shoot 14 erppc shots vs 8 for a TW on tourmaline. 25% heat gen is HUGE much less the stupid 50% which gave the 9S 21 shots.

The 15% heat gen quirk gives the TDR-5SS an extra 8 secs before overheating 19 sec vs 27 secs which is huge considering a TW with 2 LPL and 4 Meds overheats in 15 secs. 135 dmg vs 83 dmg before overheating

But but its a Timbergod, the unstoppable, unshootable engine of destruction.