43 replies to this topic

[Koniving]

IraqiWalker, on 06 May 2015 - 03:50 PM, said:

For my forum profile?

I see you had success in fixing it. And yes, gotta fix it in game to show on the profile.

[IraqiWalker]

Koniving, on 06 May 2015 - 06:03 PM, said:

I see you had success in fixing it. And yes, gotta fix it in game to show on the profile.

Thanks to you and ST XD

[Soul Tribunal]

IraqiWalker, on 06 May 2015 - 06:08 PM, said:

Thanks to you and ST XD

Good to see you back IW, you've missed lots of Urbanmech Fun

-ST

[Breidr]

Love the additional input. I'm definitely going to grab a Stalker as they pique my interest in the heavier 'Mech department.

In regards to Thunderbolts, what is different between them and Hunchbacks? How do they compare?

In the end, would it be viable to take a Stalker and 3 mediums? Say a 4N or Misery and some Hunchbacks? If that is the case, which ones would you recommend?

Edited by Breidr Breidsson, 06 May 2015 - 07:23 PM.

[Leone]

I'd suggest leaving the thunderbolts for now myself, if only because you've already got three mediums. (The hunchback trio.)
Since you've 100 tons left in a drop deck, you can pretty much bring whatever. I don't own any stalkers myself, so I'll let others suggest their preferred builds.

I just wanted to point out a bit o math.
Two hunchbacks an a stalker, 50+50+85 tons, leaves 65 left to fill out a drop deck. Well, look at that, looks like you could grab a Jagermech and a stalker.

Have Fun!

~Leone.

[Void Angel]

Breidr Breidsson, on 06 May 2015 - 06:50 PM, said:

Love the additional input. I'm definitely going to grab a Stalker as they pique my interest in the heavier 'Mech department.

In regards to Thunderbolts, what is different between them and Hunchbacks? How do they compare?

In the end, would it be viable to take a Stalker and 3 mediums? Say a 4N or Misery and some Hunchbacks? If that is the case, which ones would you recommend?

The difference between Hunchbacks and Thunderbolts is scale and little bit of focus. A Hunchback is generally focused on one thing; you can use it for other things - such as a Gauss Rifle on a 4G - but its intended role is pretty well defined. A Thunderbolt, on the other hand, can be more versatile. The 5SS, for example, is clearly focused on Medium Pulses, but because of its amazing range buffs, the chassis can get so much range on an ER Large Laser build that the Clans have to spend (I think) six tons on a targeting computer to beat it. Thunderbolts are still pretty well defined, and if you build your Thunderbuddy around its quirks, you can find a workable build pretty easily.

The main difference, then is scale and toughness. The Hunchback can be faster for less proportional weight than any Thunderbolt, and has a smaller profile - it's faster, and it's lighter on its feet. The Thunderbolt, on the other hand, is tougher than any chassis I've piloted short of an Assault. It's blocky, and pretty big; it draws fire, and it can take a lot of damage if you practice good torso twisting. The thunderbolt can pack on more effective firepower than the Hunchback, even considering focused builds like 4P - while maintaining a fair amount of versatility for the range. Consider This Thunderbolt as opposed to This Hunchback. The Hunch has almost equal firepower, but at a heavy cost of efficiency (and AMS.) The Thunderbuddy has good firepower for its size, the ability to reach out pretty far for a Large Laser (quriks,) and is slower than its smaller friend.

As for a Community Warfare drop deck, you can very easily and effectively bring a Stalker - that was the second most popular Tukayyid chassis in the Inner Sphere. However, from the standpoint of pure effectiveness, you'd want to bring two Thunderbolts and a Light: either a Firestarter or an ECM scout.

PS: the SE variant of the Thunderbolt can also jump; It's my least favorite of my owned variants of the chassis, but I haven't spent a lot of time getting used to the new quirks on it yet either. Since no Hunchback has jump jets, this bears mentioning.

[juxstapo]

In the "Somewhat familiar but learning something new camp", despite the balances shifts I can still wholeheartedly recommend the BoomJack (Blackjack BJ-1 packing an AC/20). The Champion BJ is setup very very close to the community designed BoomJack build. (Slight grumbling from those of us who ran Boomjacks since they patched in and who still get accused of copying the Champion).

You use a Boomjack for the exact same purpose as your Hunchback, delivering heavy autocannon rounds when and where the big boys need them. Close - medium range direct fire support. However you are doing in a very different chassis.

CONS:
The Blackjack is considerably more fragile than the Hunchback.
The Blackjack's torso twist range and rate do not compare to the HBK's

PROS:
The Blackjack's AC/20 is arm mounted, which is actually a really really big deal, especially in a brawl.
Since the Blackjack's cannon is arm mounted it has sufficient space to mount an XL engine.
The Jack's miniscule side torsi make that XL very practical.
The Boomjack is faster than most Boomback builds. Lighter mech that can take an XL, aside from straight top-speed numbers you also get the difficult-to-define but easy-to-feel improved acceleration, braking and turning.
Finally....
jump jets man!. Aside from the obvious benefit of getting places, jets help you spread damage, seriously affect your turning and twisting and mesh with that arm mounted cannon to make a kung-fu brawler from hell. Many times you'll find yourself sailing up and over a heavier chassis while delivering a sucker-punch almost straight down.

...at any rate, I love my 'Jacks. (Don't get me wrong, they are much more fragile than Hunchbacks now, but that forces you to become a better player )

[Breidr]

I like the idea of a Stalker-4N, Grid Iron, 4G and a JM-6S with more Gauss goodness. How does that deck stack up?

If it works I'll start building it because it covers chassis I'm interested in, seems durable, and combines laser vomit with fire support, two things I like.

[Surn]

Thunderbolts... 5ss, 9se...must have mechs.

[IraqiWalker]

Breidr Breidsson, on 06 May 2015 - 09:12 PM, said:

I like the idea of a Stalker-4N, Grid Iron, 4G and a JM-6S with more Gauss goodness. How does that deck stack up?

If it works I'll start building it because it covers chassis I'm interested in, seems durable, and combines laser vomit with fire support, two things I like.

That sounds like a very solid drop deck. For the record, the Jagermech, and the Thunderbolt are both 65 tons. So you can swap them whenever, without disturbing your deck.

[Jody Von Jedi]

Breidr Breidsson, on 06 May 2015 - 09:12 PM, said:

I like the idea of a Stalker-4N, Grid Iron, 4G and a JM-6S with more Gauss goodness. How does that deck stack up?

If it works I'll start building it because it covers chassis I'm interested in, seems durable, and combines laser vomit with fire support, two things I like.

Nice drop deck. I've never piloted a 4N, but I probably need to make it my next mech.

[Soul Tribunal]

Breidr Breidsson, on 06 May 2015 - 06:50 PM, said:

Love the additional input. I'm definitely going to grab a Stalker as they pique my interest in the heavier 'Mech department.

In regards to Thunderbolts, what is different between them and Hunchbacks? How do they compare?

In the end, would it be viable to take a Stalker and 3 mediums? Say a 4N or Misery and some Hunchbacks? If that is the case, which ones would you recommend?

The 4N while I don't have it, is a Lazer Vomit Pro. Everytime I see a 4N its a stream of Blue coming out and ruining my day. So that is a good start for a chassis, you can sit back and play fire support (try not to brawl in a stalker, they don't have the best range of motion and can be flanked easily enough).
Misery is another great option. Mount a STD315 in it, AC20, 2ER, 2LM and Blow stuff up. Stalkers have great Hitboxes, and are Ultra Durable for their weight. It still feels to me at least, like it takes more fire to drop my stalker than my Atlas.

-ST

[JC Daxion]

the 4SP is a beast, i'd say work on your brawling skills. personally i run mine with SRM 4's over the quirked 6's.. the refire about the same speed anyway, and you can haul more ammo which is a very good thing. dual SRM4's, and 4 ML's i find work best for me. Use your speed to preposition, fight with the assaults, and try to attack form the sides or behind for best results..

the 4J, my guess is you are just playing it wrong, don't think of it as a long range mech, it really is a medium range skirmish brawler.. Fight at 250-350m, again stay with the pack, and lob LRM's over the front lines, and position for your direct fire Medium lasers when the opportunity hits.


If you are liking mediums, you can't go wrong with cicada's, they are a great stepping stone to getting into lights, and play different enough to warrant a place in your mech bay. Thunder bolts are great mechs post quirk, but i was loving them since last winter when they where considered so-so.. but now they really are beasts, the 5SS is one of my favor mechs for boating lasers.. Don't bother with the HBK-4p when you have that option. (btw, the 4p is my least favorite energy boat i own, so maybe i am biased, but the 4SP, and 4G are a couple of my favorite mechs.

For a bit heavier mech, with JJ"s, you could try the wolverines too, the 7K, is like a fat 4SP with JJ's, and the other 2 are pretty decent as well.

[JC Daxion]

Breidr Breidsson, on 06 May 2015 - 09:12 PM, said:

I like the idea of a Stalker-4N, Grid Iron, 4G and a JM-6S with more Gauss goodness. How does that deck stack up?

If it works I'll start building it because it covers chassis I'm interested in, seems durable, and combines laser vomit with fire support, two things I like.

I don't really play CW often, so my experience is limited, but i did drop in my HBK-4g and i would advise against the those 2 HBK's in it, the 4G just doesn't not hold anywhere near enough ammo to be effective, and i would have to say the GI would have that same issue. Those mechs barely hold enough ammo for a typical 12 man drop, the CW you would be out way to soon.

a mech like the cicada 3m, or one of the jagers would be a better option, and i would toss in another energy boat, which is one of the main reasons i think the thunder bolts are so popular for cw. Now if they had a ammo reload station in your start points, that would change my thinking, but till then, skip the HBK's that need ammo, they just can't carry enough for cw, which sucks cause they are some of my favorite mechs

Edited by JC Daxion, 09 May 2015 - 04:40 AM.

[Leone]

Breidr Breidsson, on 06 May 2015 - 09:12 PM, said:

I like the idea of a Stalker-4N, Grid Iron, 4G and a JM-6S with more Gauss goodness. How does that deck stack up?

Solid. This coming from someone who mostly plays CW, and also likew the two Mediums, Heavy and Assault load out. You get two soliders who bunch up with the team pulling their wieght (In your case, the hunchbacks,) an assualt to lead the team in pushes, and one heavy for to take advantage of the chaos and to bring the hurt.

Honestly, my Heavy is another push leader and general tank, but I tend to trade scoring high for helping the team by drawing fire, and I think at first you'll only wanna have one mech for leading the charge until you figure out your best role. I'm aggressive and impatient, so I like having two different mechs to lead pushes, but everyone should have at least one. You tend to score less cuz the first mech into the fray tends to get focused, but someone's gotta do it, and if everyone brings at least one, you can rotate out three folk going in first every match.

I have a blast with it, so good luck, and hit me up in game if'n you want any advice or to group up in the normal queues.

~Leone.

Edited by Leone, 07 May 2015 - 03:32 PM.

[Spleenslitta]

If you want to stay in the medium weight class concider the Vindicator. It can torso and arm twist like you wouldn't believe. Both sideways and down/up.
You can shoot straight backwards with your armweapons while retreating.
All variants have JJ's and all but the Hero variant has PPC quirks.
If you like boating then you should go for another mech since they got more tonnage to play with.

The 1AA is fast and has lot's of JJ's for jumping on top of buildings then shoot down into the brawl below.
I think the Vindicator 1AA is the king medium weight jack of all trades and ranges mech.

The 1R is a average medium i think and the 1X is an either or mech - Either you go with PPC or a ballistic mainweapon.
St.Ives is and average medium too.

Edited by Spleenslitta, 08 May 2015 - 08:05 AM.

[purplewasabi]

Breidr Breidsson, on 06 May 2015 - 09:12 PM, said:

I like the idea of a Stalker-4N, Grid Iron, 4G and a JM-6S with more Gauss goodness. How does that deck stack up?

If it works I'll start building it because it covers chassis I'm interested in, seems durable, and combines laser vomit with fire support, two things I like.

For long range, I run a similar deck; Grid Iron, 4SP, JM6-S and BLR-1S. Lots of fun for me, reasonable damage output compared to meta mechs. The gauss on the grid iron and jager does wonders. ERLLs in the battlemaster with energy range quirks allows me touch even Clan mechs from a distance. The 4Sp has high dps and high top speed for emergency purposes.

For brawling; 4G, 4SP, 4SP, DDC (still working on this, might just combine both brawling and long range deck and see how it goes)

As mentioned above, there will be times where you run out of ammo because these mechs are ammo dependent. So you should always keep that in mind when engaging the enemy.

Regarding the OP, i second what others had mentioned about getting the stalkers. Great all rounder, easy to use and hard to kill. Basically get mechs that complement your playstyle. ie I like brawling, i started with hunchbacks. Ultimately I got myself some atlases and it has been fun ever since. Progress, but within your comfort zone that sort of thing.

And i like your approach to MWO, keep up the good work!!

[JC Daxion]

Leone, on 07 May 2015 - 03:30 PM, said:

Solid. This coming from someone who mostly plays CW, and also like the two Mediums, Heavy and Assault load out. You get two soliders who bunch up with the team pulling their weight (In your case, the hunchbacks,) an assault to lead the team in pushes, and one heavy for to take advantage of the chaos and to bring the hurt.

~Leone.

I am curious how a mech that only carries 21 shots would be considered a good idea for CW, i supose you could squeeze in 28, but even still, that seems like barely any ammo to have to kill 48 mechs, or just run around shooting mechs in a overwieght light with 3 ML's for a good portion of the match, being woefully under powered.

I suppose you could eject at that point, but then you are loosing that advantage jumping out of a working mech, just because of ammo issues. If i was gonna put a HBK in my drop deck, the 4P to me would be a way better option.

4P http://mwo.smurfy-ne...2fa8a56f845c4b7
Classic 4P build

4P, http://mwo.smurfy-ne...f25f1afdd16366b

longer range+brawling.. Use the large for range, and small for up-close and higher DPS, it also boasts a larger engine for keeping up the brawl on faster mechs or repostioning. It works pretty well, though i must say i have also run a similar build with 4 small pulse in the hunch, with STD260 with good results.

4G http://mwo.smurfy-ne...521c2271c1925f0

The 4P has a larger alpha, and no ammo, at the expense of a bit of DPS, though if you just fire with the hunch for a bit, the DPS is about the same. For my 50 tons, it just seems like a much better option and for me, it is my least favorite HBK. I just enjoy other mechs for boating energy, but the numbers just make it hard for me to think it is not the better option.

the 4G shines in it's ambush,getting in behind mechs and unloading on weak spots, or back armor. Since the quirks though, even 28 shots is chewed through quick and you need a lot of trigger control even in 12 mans, and make sure every shot lands on it's mark to make this mech really effective. I just don't see how this mech is a good idea in cw..

If my rational is not correct, feel free to give me some tips on how to use a 4G effectively in cw as it really is one of my favorite mechs. But for my thinking, i'd rather have lighter mechs going on the no ammo route, and save the ammo for mechs that can stand to hold a few extra tons.

Edited by JC Daxion, 09 May 2015 - 04:43 AM.

[purplewasabi]

Well, the reason why I use the hunchbacks, is because I have fun with them... that's it. The goal is to win the game, not to get 48 kills...tho that would be cool.

Due of the lack of firepower, setting up for ambush is not a good idea as TTK (time it takes to kill an opponent) would be high, and that's bad. There are better mechs with 60-90 point alphas that are better at ambushing. Unless you have proper team support.

Disclaimer: My hunchies has Master efficiency unlocked and are fully kitted with modules which are selected to complement my play-style, main modules are Seismic Sensor, Radar Dep and UAV. Might not work for everybody. Was using 4G, 4SP, Firebrand (Gauss-2xPPC) and BLR-1G (6 LLaser) in a 12-man drop. The hunchies did great, especially towards the end.



The way I play the Hunchback 4G and 4SP is not as an ambush mech, but as a skirmisher, constantly harassing the enemy. Best time to drop in these hunchies is middle to late game when enemy encounters are more close range. However it may differ depending on the situation/strategy.

Also, spend some time in testing grounds to explore the CW maps. Just like any other sport, pre-game prep is important.

Once I'm out of ammo, I do what I call a suicide scout. Once I find the enemy, I'll air/arty strike them, launch UAV or relay what I saw to my team mates.

Hope this helps.

[JC Daxion]

I think you got the wrong idea when i said ambushing though i can see how you might of thought that. For me, pretty much any medium/light falls into this. You don't push out huge DPS, or alpha's so your best bet is to pick your points of attack and go all out before you disengage, My main form of "ambush" is wait for a mech to engage another mech, and then attack back armor, or do a strafing run on a weakened target.

Dodge/wade through the battle field taking some pot shots hoping you can distract mechs, mostly in the case of lights, before you run being cover hoping you distract enough, or get someone to chase even for 20 secs, which in this game 20 secs can = death.. Or where the 4G shines i tend to try to sneak in from behind and wreck an assault, before you disappear as he turns because his back armor just went from no damage to bright red with cockpit reading "critical hit", Hopefully, either he doesn't turn and you finish him, or he does turn because he is dead if he doesn't and your buddies get shots of a freshly opened backside and he is dead anyway.

The other option is finish off a medium/heavy that has got an open torso, or take out a dangerous weaponsystem stuffed in a side torso or arm. Of course I'm targeting mechs, that other teamates are working on but that should be a given outside of points of opportunity. . Often they can be wrecked enough that just a couple well placed AC-20 shots can take it down. But even still, it takes 6 shots from an AC-20 to take down an assault outside of the rear and that is if they hit the same spot all 6 times Or even 3-5+ shots to take off a dangerous arm for example say for example a dragon 1N and it's dual AC-5's you basically destroyed their damage capability... you are just using to much of your total % of ammo for my tastes is all especially when the 4p, Can alpha higher and basically put out the exact same DPS as the 4G. the one place the 4G does out shine is it is pin-point. But as far as Decks goes i just can't help think in CW, When i do drop with the 4G in one slot, typically a middle slot, and it just ran out of ammo too fast..

For me, if i wan't an AC-20 in cw, id run a misery, or a cataphract, as then can hold 35-42 shots.. verse what i run in my 4G, of 21. Like i was saying, i love the 4G in fact way more than the 4P. which is my least favorite energy boat that i own so is kind of ironic that i am saying take the 4P over the 4G but yet hear i am. Typically in a game i get between 250-400 damage and 2-4 kills and 3-6 assists. In fact, my kill to damage ratio on this mech is higher than any other mech i own, though my t-bolt 5SS has a higher KDR and over all average damage but as a short range murder machine, it is hard to beat a 4G.


If i want an ac-20 in my drop deck which for me, is Yes i do! this is the one i am working on getting the extra modules to run all 4-- (i got enough modules to swap around so i know what they all have, i just need a few more extra so i can keep the deck ready while i play my other mechs)


Deck,
1, Misery, ac-20+srm 6 + a pair of LL's
2, Dragon 5N, Gauss+2 ERLL's
3, cicada, Ac-5 + 4 ML's and ecm
4, TDR-5SS, 5 MPL's+ 2 ERLL's


But hey, if the 4G and 4SP are working for you, right on. It is nice to know a little in-site on how it can work as you are talking about a couple of my favorite mechs, and 2 of which are the first mechs i played after i did 100 drops in a trail dragon 1N