71 replies to this topic

[Escef]

Alienized, on 12 May 2015 - 12:57 PM, said:

just that a myst lynx is not that much better than a kit fox as the timber is to gargoyle :S

The general consensus is that the Mist Lynx and Gargoyle are the 2 worst clan mechs currently available.

[Bishop Steiner]

Stefka Kerensky, on 12 May 2015 - 11:39 AM, said:

I know it's already been discussed...but still.


Maybe, PGI should consider adding a "patch" to MM. (and I'm not talking about elo)

But you are MercStar with other guys...should be unstoppable, yes?

[STEF_]

Escef, on 12 May 2015 - 12:51 PM, said:

Because a Mist Lynx and a Gargoyle is perfectly balanced against a Kit Fox and a Timber Wolf.

The average "dmg that have to be done" is the same, indeed.
Players are free to choose the mechs they prefer, and I like the so called "sub-par" or "doa" mechs.
But, if the tonnage difference is so huge, it's very hard to have a chance.

Bishop Steiner, on 12 May 2015 - 01:00 PM, said:

But you are MercStar with other guys...should be unstoppable, yes?

well...maybe other -MS- pilots.
I assure you that I am very stoppable

[Brody319]

Escef, on 12 May 2015 - 01:00 PM, said:

The general consensus is that the Mist Lynx and Gargoyle are the 2 worst clan mechs currently available.

I would say the Lynx and the Fridge are the 2 worst.

[Deathlike]

Jman5, on 12 May 2015 - 12:14 PM, said:

This is a good example of how tonnage imbalance can screw over a team. You actually out damaged the other team in total team damage, but they beat you because they had about +1000 hitpoints more than you.

The best solution is to change the requirements so smaller teams bring more balanced drop decks. So a 2-4 man has to fit into 1/1/1/1. A 5-8 man gets 2/2/2/2. And a 9-12 man is restricted to 3/3/3/3 (current default). It would help the group queue significantly, but there is pushback from certain vocal people in the community.

It's never going to happen. I don't care either way (enforcing it or not enforcing it - they don't change the way how I play).

You can already imagine the complaining..

"My friend and I can't take the same mechs"

"Noone is willing to take a Light"

"Large Premades still OP"

There's no way to please everyone outside of even attempting to bribe them with a C-bill bonus to even attempt to make this work.

Edited by Deathlike, 12 May 2015 - 01:05 PM.

[Kain Demos]

Stefka Kerensky, on 12 May 2015 - 11:39 AM, said:

I know it's already been discussed...but still.


Maybe, PGI should consider adding a "patch" to MM. (and I'm not talking about elo)

Ahh, the old "5 assaults to zero" routine. I had one of during Tukayyid when the regular queue was abysmally empty. I remember saying "this is conquest and we are all fast, maybe for once let's play for caps" and teh reply was "no, they will be the same as us let's fight" and low and behold, they had several King Crabs and Dire WOlves.

[KharnZor]

Madcap72, on 12 May 2015 - 12:12 PM, said:

The other team outplayed you and won? How is MM going to fix that?


Or are you talking about how everyone you dropped with could have made better mech selections to carry harder just in case the pugs you dropped with sucked?


Looks more like a teamwork and coordination problem, not a MM problem.

Before you post its a good idea to examine an OP to try to get an understanding of just what exactly the OP is posting about.
Example, a team of ants with perfect tactical coordination is still going to get stomped by that elephant they are attacking.

[STEF_]

Deathlike, on 12 May 2015 - 01:04 PM, said:

It's never going to happen. I don't care either way (enforcing it or not enforcing it - they don't change the way how I play).

You can already imagine the complaining..

"My friend and I can't take the same mechs"

"Noone is willing to take a Light"

"Large Premades still OP"

There's no way to please everyone outside of even attempting to bribe them with a C-bill bonus to even attempt to make this work.

Yea, I can undestand that these situations you describe can happen.
Imo, it would be fine if MM form 2 team with the more similar tonnage possible.

[Escef]

Stefka Kerensky, on 12 May 2015 - 01:03 PM, said:

The average "dmg that have to be done" is the same, indeed.
Players are free to choose the mechs they prefer, and I like the so called "sub-par" or "doa" mechs.
But, if the tonnage difference is so huge, it's very hard to have a chance.

While tonnage is a factor, he idea that balancing by tonnage is the answer is patently laughable. But I'm pretty sure we both know that. Also, the match maker does take weight classes into account, but when so few people in the group queue want to play lights you are going to end up with top-heavy teams.

And I don't think the answer is tonnage balancing. ELO isn't the answer. Some kind of Battle Value system isn't the answer, either. There needs to be some kind of system that incentivizes diversity in the group queue.

[Alienized]

Escef, on 12 May 2015 - 01:00 PM, said:

The general consensus is that the Mist Lynx and Gargoyle are the 2 worst clan mechs currently available.

i dont really give 2 cents about the general consensus. the myst lynx is one of the most underrated mechs in here.
why?
The general consensus cant play it. dont care about learning to play it. just playing overquirked meta crap.

[Escef]

Brody319, on 12 May 2015 - 01:04 PM, said:

I would say the Lynx and the Fridge are the 2 worst.

Ice Ferret really isn't bad. It just fails to be exciting. In the regular queues it takes a medium slot, and clan side the Stormcrow's better hitboxes, higher durability, min-maxed structural options, and better hardpoints more than make it a better option. In CW you can save 10 tons and get something with ECM.

[Kain Demos]

Alienized, on 12 May 2015 - 01:12 PM, said:

i dont really give 2 cents about the general consensus. the myst lynx is one of the most underrated mechs in here.
why?
The general consensus cant play it. dont care about learning to play it. just playing overquirked meta crap.

It may not be as bad as some people say (I have fun in my 4 x CSPLAS build) but make no mistake, it is one of the worst lights in the game.

The Gargoyle though.....to me it is "average", not bad. It allows fast, aggressive play due to not being saddled by any slow assaults and can boat small lasers for the brawl but being limited to pretty much just that and nothing else is why I say its average.

[Deathlike]

Stefka Kerensky, on 12 May 2015 - 01:10 PM, said:

Yea, I can undestand that these situations you describe can happen.
Imo, it would be fine if MM form 2 team with the more similar tonnage possible.

It doesn't really work when the release valves are in play.

In most lopsided tonnage imbalance, one of the teams most likely is waiting its full allotted time of 5 minutes (whether it be some large competitive group or not - it can happen to others depending on the circumstances).

Ultimately, the issue is a playerbase size in queue issue, and much less anything else.

What would be nice is proper mech balancing, but that is not PGI's forte either, so it doesn't make a difference unfortunately.

[KharnZor]

Alienized, on 12 May 2015 - 01:12 PM, said:

i dont really give 2 cents about the general consensus. the myst lynx is one of the most underrated mechs in here.
why?
The general consensus cant play it. dont care about learning to play it. just playing overquirked meta crap.

There's a reason why its under rated. its terrible.

[Escef]

Alienized, on 12 May 2015 - 01:12 PM, said:

i dont really give 2 cents about the general consensus. the myst lynx is one of the most underrated mechs in here.
why?
The general consensus cant play it. dont care about learning to play it. just playing overquirked meta crap.

While I've seen a small number of people get great results out of the Mist Lynx, it still has bad hitboxes, poor durability, bad hardpoint layout, and low payload. I do better in a Commando than I do with a Mist Lynx.

Your anti-meta rant is understandable, but utterly irrelevant.

[Apnu]

Stefka Kerensky, on 12 May 2015 - 11:39 AM, said:

I know it's already been discussed...but still.


Maybe, PGI should consider adding a "patch" to MM. (and I'm not talking about elo)

I see the problem, Kitfox shoulda carried harder.

[C E Dwyer]

Stefka Kerensky, on 12 May 2015 - 11:39 AM, said:

I know it's already been discussed...but still.


Maybe, PGI should consider adding a "patch" to MM. (and I'm not talking about elo)

I looked at that and thought what the hell is Stefka on about then I looked again, and thought hmm, then I looked some more and though oh wow ouch!

[Madcap72]

KharnZor, on 12 May 2015 - 01:10 PM, said:

Before you post its a good idea to examine an OP to try to get an understanding of just what exactly the OP is posting about.
Example, a team of ants with perfect tactical coordination is still going to get stomped by that elephant they are attacking.

I have, I've also seen other posts, and dropped in game with a few times on random maps here and there with them.

Your analogy is weak and non-sense. GDecent players in decent lights can get more kills in games than a lot of people in heavies and assaults. One could make the argument that the reason OP lost is mot enough medium LRM boats. Or falure to focus fire on the one obviously good player that wiped half thier team.

I bet if OP's team had more firestarters, spiders, or urbies it would be a differnt tune. Heck look at who came in second for matchscore and damage... a Panther.

[Madcap72]

So what tactics did you use? Rush to the center, NASCAR around, Do the annoying combat blob hide and seek thing around one edge of the crater and play by attrition, super flank one edge and snipe thier slow mechs fix them in place then retreat while another part of the team does the same then shift positions around to more advantageous areas of the map to utalize the strengths of your units composition, in this case lighter faster mechs which means you could use the size of the map for manouver warefare?

[bad arcade kitty]

Stefka Kerensky, on 12 May 2015 - 11:39 AM, said:

I know it's already been discussed...but still.


Maybe, PGI should consider adding a "patch" to MM. (and I'm not talking about elo)

that's some council of warhawks there...