30 replies to this topic

[Triordinant]

Kiriesani, on 13 May 2015 - 01:24 PM, said:

I have a lot of ideas on ways to fix it and I could go on all day about them. Honestly though? I don't see a good way to keep CW running without 2-4 times the population.

This is the real reason for low CW population.

[Lyoto Machida]

Gas Guzzler, on 14 May 2015 - 12:58 PM, said:

I like the group queue, but I was just saying if you are itching for the CW game mode, we can probably try to organize CW matches.

This is what its come down to? Players having to organize CW matches due to low population?

Maybe PGI could...you know...make CW more attractive for people to play. Is it really that hard to bump up c-bill/XP/etc earnings for a short period and see what happens? Wait times are a huge factor and the problem keeps feeding itself. People don't want long wait times, so they avoid CW...making the wait times even longer.

[jaxjace]

Sjorpha, on 13 May 2015 - 02:09 AM, said:

The first and foremost thing that is missing in CW is the actual simulation of war.

Owning planets need to give significant advantages, both in terms of resources of some kind and for the purpose of strategic progress. And for the unit as well as the faction.

And there needs to be a macro scale end game, a way to actually win the war, in which the aquiring of planets is a means of progression not limited to colouring the blips.

PGI seems afraid of the prospect that a faction could actually beat another, but that is the whole point of war. If taking over more and more planets does not convey an increasing advantage but instead, as now, actually punishes you for success, then there is no point. Resets or the galactic map should ultimately be driven by the extermination or otherwise determined victory of one side in the conflict.

A good start would be to reverse the system of reward adjusments to reward success rather than failure, the more planets you take the more your faction should pay you, because the will have more money to do so with. This could be balanced by dividing payouts by population, so that players of overpopulated factions gets paid less, which makes sense does it not? This way the number of planets owned by a faction determines indirectly the limits of that factions population.

Rewarding success should also go for individual success in terms of rank and loyalty. Simply pay a player more per match the higher rank he has within a faction, this way you encourage faction loyalty continuously as well as through specific rewards.

Last but not least the tools for organisation and strategic impact of units must be vastly increased and improved. Loyalist players (permanent contracts) might for example be able to elect leaders for their factions, who can then issue merc contracts to be taken by units. This right to vote for leadership or otherwise faction related issues could be the defining difference between loyalists and mercenaries.

Also allow units to do something with their money, why not upgrade defences on planets they control, or even buy mechs owned by the unit to be borrowed in dropdecks of unit members, with appropriate downsides as compared to owning private mechs for balance sake. Perhaps attach a maintenace cost for dropping in them, cut them out of the skill tree and so forth, but still a way to gear up your unit members for a given mission. Why not allow units to upgrade their dropships to be more lethal etc. Perhaps access to airstrike consumables in CW could be determined by if and how many aircraft bombers the unit has bought. Perhaps UAV, or why not all modules, is usable only if the unit has invested in the appropriate technology, and perhaps there is a maintenance cost to include that technology in a given drop. Bottom line is that units and their resources must be given real impact.

[Eboli]

For me I am sick of playing against TBRs and SCRs. I am also so tired of reading about the back and forth forum IS/Clan op and quirk accusations (going both ways) which makes me don't want to even play against Clans either.

Have to admit that it would be nice to see more IS vs IS CW action occurring but since I am Steiner that is not going to happen much. Long waiting times don't help when it comes to CBill generation.

PGI and players need to make CW more interesting and rewarding...

At the moment I am just apathetic to CW in general although I really like the concept of it all.

Cheers Eboli.

[Helbrecht]

the easiest and fastest way to fix cw is 2 Fold.

1: no dropship mode also played on regular maps using a non-skirmish game mode.

Attack and Defend is the biggest problem with CW. it promotes turtling and slow gameplay which really annoys alot of people
i understand why it was put in. some people wanted a respawn type game. problem with the current system is that is really only makes certain mechs viable from a cw standpoint. Clans use nothing but twolves, scrows, hellbringer, mystlynx.
IS uses stalker thunderbolt/jagermech wolverine firestarter/raven.

2: is wait times
waiting 15-20 minutes for a game is boring and frustrating. with less mechs to kill the games will kick off faster thus more people will be prompted to play.

[Khereg]

Gas Guzzler, on 14 May 2015 - 08:27 AM, said:

There are instances where groups are having trouble finding fights over on the HK server. If you guys have a 12 man and want to battle hop over and let us know.

We mainly just want to shoot people, so if we know there is a CSJ 12 man waiting to go I'm sure most of the time we will be glad to oblige.

This is my thinking. The whole point of the game is shooting robots, so get to shooting. I know it takes effort to gather a group and go drop, and for the more casual players the risk of getting stomped is always hanging out there, but the solution is more players in CW.

There's only so many stompy groups to go around. The more casual folks who jump in across all factions, the less likely you are to run into one.

But this is akin to leading the push in a match - no one wants to go first. So, we all sit and wait.

PGI sanctioned events seem to draw people out, but they can't do a Tukkayid every week. Some other incentive has to get our collective attention.

Edited to add: I appreciate the ideas for enhancing the game mode, but anything that takes coding takes time, and the problem is CW is dead right now. I try to stay focused on ideas that will bring the population up *right now* and give PGI the time to implement more enriched gameplay ideas.

The irony is that if population jumps, PGI could conclude CW is fine as-is and not do the enrichments. I guess in a sense this current state of affairs is at least sending them the message that all is not well. It's a start.

Edited by Khereg, 15 May 2015 - 07:12 AM.

[Apnu]

Planets flip too fast, and when momentum swings against a faction, half its population leaves, making the steam rolling even worse.

We've seen it here a few times and just about every other BT/MW game I've played (other MW4 leagues, MegaMek campaigns). Nobody's figured out how to solve the problem.

Solutions could be:

* Bonuses for players aligned to factions that are under 50% original planet occupation to attract players.

* Making planets flip slower, maybe 48 hour cycles?

* Giving attacking factions issues with supply lines as they take over a lot of territory, or allow conquered factions attack any planet, regardless of distance from the capital wold. Think of this like a "rebellion" against the occupying force.

[Apnu]

Helbrecht, on 15 May 2015 - 04:11 AM, said:

the easiest and fastest way to fix cw is 2 Fold.

1: no dropship mode also played on regular maps using a non-skirmish game mode.

Attack and Defend is the biggest problem with CW. it promotes turtling and slow gameplay which really annoys alot of people
i understand why it was put in. some people wanted a respawn type game. problem with the current system is that is really only makes certain mechs viable from a cw standpoint. Clans use nothing but twolves, scrows, hellbringer, mystlynx.
IS uses stalker thunderbolt/jagermech wolverine firestarter/raven.

2: is wait times
waiting 15-20 minutes for a game is boring and frustrating. with less mechs to kill the games will kick off faster thus more people will be prompted to play.

This is sort of close to my idea of moving the PQ games into CW. Make those games matter to the IS map. Then players can go back and forth between Invasion/Counter Attack and the other three. Still let Invasion mode flip planets, but have other game modes to deepen CW and give casuals, solos, and small groups something to do and feel like they're doing something about the IS map.

Looking and being invested in the map is key here. The more players who give a hoot about the map, the better the game and CW will be.

CW won't work if its just "hardcore" mode. If it stays like that we'll see what we see now. About 100-150 MWO players invested in it, and the other couple of thousand ignoring it.

[Eboli]

How about Drop in CW # times per week and gain X amount of CBills as a reward?

PGI can even set up a Challenge wheel so you know how many CW matches you have dropped in.

Cheers!
Eboli

[Targetloc]

Eboli, on 15 May 2015 - 03:17 PM, said:

How about Drop in CW # times per week and gain X amount of CBills as a reward?

PGI can even set up a Challenge wheel so you know how many CW matches you have dropped in.

Cheers!
Eboli

That would work for bringing more lone wolves into CW. Warcraft proved that worked with it's weekly battlegrounds. A lot of players who weren't very invested in PvP still put in their time (providing opponents for those that wanted to play constantly).

I think the biggest problem for units is the opposite. I know for most of JFP we just burned out after a couple months of pressure to play 7 days a week, 3 times per day to avoid losing ground.

Sure, no one forces you to play that much, but it's an inevitable race to the bottom when anyone can just take your stuff by simply playing more often.

Again, look back at WoW as (probably) the most successful MMO of all time, there were lots of rewards if you wanted to play constantly, but it also kept a lot of players healthy, sane and interested by limiting serious progression content to once or twice per week.


I'm just not sure how exactly they could implement a mechanic (contracts maybe?) where you only need to commit to 1 or 2 big fights per week, but still be rewarded enough to keep 50-60% of the population playing on their 'off' nights so the people who have different schedules still have invested opponents.

[Revis Volek]

Gas Guzzler, on 14 May 2015 - 12:58 PM, said:

I like the group queue, but I was just saying if you are itching for the CW game mode, we can probably try to organize CW matches.

I will certainly pass this along....but there is a whisper of a certain unit going IS for a while.

Either way, IF not in CW we are always down for scrimms as well! Pvt Matches FTW!