90 replies to this topic

[Sjorpha]

I agree completely with the OP, all these things are true. There is no meaningful macro level strategy, no actual war, and ghost defence is a ridiculous mechanic.

I still play CW for the real matches themselves, I like the game mode and the new maps enough to prefer it over pug drops.

The way I see it, we are playtesting a feature incomplete CW alpha. Those who do not like to playtest incomplete products should not play CW at this time.

Sad but true, I will keep playing for now. Still having fun.

Edited by Sjorpha, 18 May 2015 - 11:27 AM.

[Grendel408]

I'll just boil this down to a few things that keep me away from CW despite my want to alter the map.

Not enough rewards overall (I'm not talking about CW achievements).

Losses don't pay nearly enough when you are likely to use 2 consumables per Mech purchased with C-bills... (40k each) 80k x 4 and get dealt a loss... you lose money playing CW in that case. Winning, all depends on your performance (as it should) but there should be much more incentive for playing CW win or lose despite the chance of getting enough LP to unlock a faction achievement. Before CW was altered, planets were easy to capture, then too hard to capture during a single night after some tweaking (given time to get into matches in CW assuming you don't field a 12man group).

All in all... there's only about 5-8 people in my unit (70+ members) who still have interest in CW. Since the Tukayyid event... queues have been dead in CW. It's not a matter of the game modes in my opinion, but the reward system and capture algorithms being implemented. All my folks would rather play Public Queue because getting into a match is faster, grinding XP/GXP and cbills is also faster.

Do the math, Devs... waste time waiting to get into CW... or playing Public Queue which is all of 2-3 minutes at most of searching for a match.

[GrizzlyViking]

Cleaver404, on 18 May 2015 - 05:21 AM, said:

Late to the party, was nice to see you in a PUB drop this weekend, Grizz, but to the above: population is the answer. You take equal pilots, equal tonnage, similar coordination, and you get similar results: clanners & IS trading wins & losses about like you'd expect. Tukayyid was about 40% clanners, 60% IS players (so at any given time when I played it was about 3 IS players to every 2 clan players queued). Clans were *on average* better organized and experienced players at least in CW. So 400 people who generally know what they're doing in CW vs. 600 players who 400 generally know what they're doing in CW leaves 200 other IS players who had no clue what they were doing (shooting wrong side of Omega, not listening to instructions, all our favorite PUB player habits). So 2/3rds of the fights were "fair" and 1/3rd were slaughters when taken as a whole, which leads to a margin by which clanners could and did win.

If CW's queue went from "# of people on one side queued into 12 mans vs. 12 mans on the other side, or ghost drops if none are available" to "each side gets X people who can queue, X is the # of players on the side with the least people," it'd always be X vs. X in CW for a planet, not X vs. X + 12 (or + 60 or more) where the excess start ghost dropping for free pie-slice wins.

The "hold territory" on your own pie-slices half the time is ridiculous & I thought would only be there as a hack for Tukayyid, but it makes the bad go worse. I don't think it's a coincidence they just ran 2 non-CW events in a row while they buy time to figure this out (I hope that's what they're doing anyway).

So yeah, other than that, agreed on all your other points, I'm not burnt out on CW at all, I'm just not at all inspired to play it right now, especially when I have challenges to earn free stuff to bang out.

The question remains as to whether this is intentional on PGI's part or not. Does PGI intend to let CW go quietly into the night? I really can't tell at this point.

[Lyoto Machida]

GrizzlyViking, on 18 May 2015 - 04:18 PM, said:

The question remains as to whether this is intentional on PGI's part or not. Does PGI intend to let CW go quietly into the night? I really can't tell at this point.

You know...they could raise C-bill rewards to encourage more players to drop in CW. But they don't...

Either they don't know how to do that or they like the status quo (ie: CW ghost town).

[Monkey Lover]

GRIZZLY! We want you back playing with us in cw!!!!! Some group in liao attacked us last night how can anyone stand for that?

Edited by Monkey Lover, 19 May 2015 - 10:26 AM.

[ztac]

Considering CW was promised way back in beta .. 3 years on it is at this stage , and did not even exist until late last year says it all.

CW is like a panic mode and thus very little thought actually went into it. You would think that at least they could make an instanced rolling battleground where the fighting spills over onto new maps or something? Instead we have queues , same type of objective maps and tactics or meta mechs that can make a game pretty boring!

On rolling maps you could start in a centre region for instance that is tropical and then push the other side through a series of maps that would be reminiscent of crossing various continents ...arid, desert , mountainous , plains, steppes , forest , city's .. etc. etc. If a player were not active for say 5 mins they could be swopped out and a new one bought in.Or immediately if a player quit!

[Davers]

NanookoftheNorth, on 14 May 2015 - 08:50 AM, said:

Guys, it's called CW beta for a reason.
This is not the end game for CW, it's just a means to keep us occupied until they get everything right, as well as to test their CW system.

Overall, the event was a lot of fun, it was fun to band together against the clans.
I'm not saying things couldn't be better, but rather to be patient with PGI.

Die clanner.

I remember MWO Beta. One day they just dropped the 'Beta' and went live.

What you see now is the core of CW. Sure, some additional systems may be put in (one day), but what we have right now is not a placeholder for CW.

[MahKraah]

clan are losing in cw beacause they simply dont play it.
the reason they won tuk was the lack of waiting times for the 12man clan premades:
no waiting more matches per h -> more wins .
nerfing the timber and the crow was unnecesary as there is a verry good balance atm.
look at the tuk stats. my unit is average skilled and talented casuals and still we won 2/3 of our matches, stop nerving the clans....!!!!!
i s would have won if 1000 pugs stayed at home on is side:
no exess IS queue --->no exess IS waiting times
is 12 man could have played as many matches as the clan premades did in the given time.
also the attacker role favored the clans as IS could not counter it with the infamous light rush,
IS had no generators to kill...
clans JUST won, without the factors stacked against the defender it would have been reversed.
by the way , a well executed stormcrow rush by a half competent 12 man will take all gens and omega down in the first wave as well, or even better, as the IS can do it with lights.

2/3 of the reason why CW sucks is that not enough ppl playing it....
a self reinforcing factor.

by the way, to me, those dots do matter! without the map there is no difference to the public queue and therefor no reason to take on the hardships of the current cw incarnation.
holding those planets against the invaders is the main motivational factor, followed by the more intense and nervewrecking battles.

to everyone complaining about cw as solo players: you are absolut right, as a soloplayer cw is hell.
it is functioning only in a coordinated 12 man group, as anounced.
witch would be no problem if ppl got rid of there teamspeak phobie and more ppl playing the game.

separating the 8+ siced groups from the smallers and solos is also no longer a option because ...... not enough ppl playing cw.

what ever is needed to make cw a success, more balancing tweaks and nerving is not part of it.

[Gremlich Johns]

Mhuur, on 14 May 2015 - 11:41 AM, said:

Shouldn't they be tapping into the great resource that is their player base for insights, opinions and suggestions for CW? There is a certain percentage of their player base that plays CW nearly exclusively, should that percentage not be catered to and looked after?

You are new here, eh?

Founders tried to help them during closed beta - all for naught. Their (the Founders) continued interest in MW:O is reflected in the number of presumed Founders who responded to a poll regarding which map to renovate after the Founder's event weekend.

The number?

about 2,000 out of almost 70,000

Edited by Gremlich Johns, 19 May 2015 - 03:08 PM.

[Vandril]

GrizzlyViking, on 13 May 2015 - 04:43 PM, said:

3. Forced ghost-defend mode, yet another idea to help save the Clans from getting stomped by IS numbers in The Battle of Tukayyid. Ghost-defend mode has resulted in the unintended consequence of making daily CW planet attacking even more meaninglessness than the planets not being connected to the end game. Who wants kill enemy beacons in zones that they already own?!?! Ghost-defend mode is currently the pinnacle of CW meaninglessness!!!

I agree a thousand times. The ghost defend mode simply HURT players in smaller factions. I feel this is one of the major reasons CW population has dropped. Really disappointed.

[Cleaver404]

Quote

The question remains as to whether this is intentional on PGI's part or not. Does PGI intend to let CW go quietly into the night? I really can't tell at this point.

My guess, Grizz, is they're gonna try to focus on this "scouting" thing for 4v4, and *hopefully* roll out a fix for the queuing and population mismatch being all you need to "win" soon (i.e. 160 Steiners dropping a planet means you always lose, period).

Also, I can also only assume if they're putting a big % of resources on to Steam deployment to try to get populations up, all it's gonna do is throw off the faction pop. mis-matches even worse, making CW even less appealing. Hope they have a plan!

[Couchwarrior]

If I were to give them the benefit of the doubt I'd say that the reason there havent been many updates is because they are concentrating on the new mech lab. This is needed but also suggests that the timing for the reset was off.

Before the announcement of the reset, though cw was maybe stalling a bit, it was still ticking along. Resetting the map before there was anything new to test but the terrible ghost defense was I think a mistake and now they theyll really need to make some significant changes to bring people back.

[Igorius]

Gremlich Johns, on 19 May 2015 - 03:08 PM, said:

Founders tried to help them during closed beta - all for naught.

The handful of non-Founder closed beta players who are still around will tell you the same thing. Long before the Founder's program was ever announced, beta players were trying to point out numerous problems. For a while, things were progressing. Then the PPC hit registration error reared its head, the Founder's program came into effect, and those who listened to us... well, they stopped listening.

Couchwarrior, on 20 May 2015 - 09:43 AM, said:

If I were to give them the benefit of the doubt I'd say that the reason there havent been many updates is because they are concentrating on the new mech lab. This is needed but also suggests that the timing for the reset was off.

Before the announcement of the reset, though cw was maybe stalling a bit, it was still ticking along. Resetting the map before there was anything new to test but the terrible ghost defense was I think a mistake and now they theyll really need to make some significant changes to bring people back.

Indeed. Even with the ROFLstomp of the Clans that was going on pre-Tukayyid, there was still enough strange hilarity to the situation to keep people coming back for more. The fact that Tukayyid basically burned out a lot of players, combined with the map reset and slow down of updates, really closed the lid on the whole thing in a strange way.

[NUJRSYDEVIL]

CW just doesn't have that fun found in the randomness of regular drops.

For me, CW is just a long range laser slug fest. To make matters worse the maps are just so boring, there's no randomness, it's all very by the numbers and going through the motions.

I will agree with the OP that the planet attack/defend makes no sense at all, it seems like nothing ever moves.

I like my AC/20s and my SRM brawlers, and to be honest I enjoy a good LRMer every 10 games or so. CW is just laser sniping and camping.

[Yokaiko]

NUJRSYDEVIL, on 20 May 2015 - 11:44 AM, said:

CW just doesn't have that fun found in the randomness of regular drops.

For me, CW is just a long range laser slug fest. To make matters worse the maps are just so boring, there's no randomness, it's all very by the numbers and going through the motions.

I will agree with the OP that the planet attack/defend makes no sense at all, it seems like nothing ever moves.

I like my AC/20s and my SRM brawlers, and to be honest I enjoy a good LRMer every 10 games or so. CW is just laser sniping and camping.

Do you only pug?

Because I've been known to drop with three out of four mechs with a 270m range at most and done just fine.

[Frank Burns]

to me the CW is good only for the rank2 reward as there is free mechbay.

but still to get is extreme pain and boring process.
playing for clans - takes long time to find game and when it does its usuallyt vs IS 9-12man stack and it always end in spawncamping orgy.

cant they just put those premades only against themselfs? it aint that hard to do



laser stalker fires 2 shots from their LRG to every 1 of mine at timber......
sooo cool

Edited by LilShlomo, 20 May 2015 - 12:06 PM.

[BigBenn]

To beeee.... or nawt to beeee.

THAT is deh question.

Sounds to me like the OP thinks too much about the meaning of life while he plays mwo.

I do think PGI should be able to devise a system in which there is more of a round robin approach and still follow the BT storyline.

[S204STi]

I'd have to agree with the consensus here, I've dropped many times with Grizz over the past few months, and pretty much as a whole, we've lost collective interest in CW. The personal rewards suck, and ghost drops suck, and owning planets sucks. It just sucks, and PGI needs to fix it.

[multisoul]

Ph30nix, on 14 May 2015 - 11:41 AM, said:

At this point i would rather they just add the 4 mech drop mode as a game mode and get rid of CW all together. AT least that way i could get relatively fast matches without jumping thru hoops. I do like the game mode for it though its just a shame the wait times kills it.

for me the story is just as important as gameplay. this game has no story and no real global objective. the story is made up in the minds of those who know Battletech, its now just another version of Counterstrike
i still play CW because of the loyalty points, but players generally do not know that they have to play differently on CW maps where there is seldom tactical movement as the path to the objective is straight forward.

Edited by multisoul, 24 June 2015 - 07:09 AM.

[Lugh]

Quote

2. Clans get the attack mode advantage in The Battle of Tukayyid to make up for their lack of numbers and, as a result, the Clans win The Battle of Tukayyid in spite of the IS having a 10 ton drop-deck advantage. Many say that attack mode wasn't the difference maker, but it clearly was the difference as evidence by PGI now having to reduce the 10 ton drop-deck advantage because the "Clan winners of The Battle of Tukayyid" are not able to take any planets now. If attack mode wasn't the difference in The Battle of Tukayyid, then what is the reason the Clans can't win planets now?

You may want to look at the map again, as Clan wolf is driving to Terra currently.

We can't be bothered to defend the planets behind the drive because there is no supply line mechanic.

Our goal is Terra.

Edited by Lugh, 24 June 2015 - 07:51 AM.