58 replies to this topic

[Kdogg788]

For me it's alt-tabbing but I've also had a lot of phantom weapons triggerings in the past, usually when my laptop is getting hot.

-k

[LORD TSARKON]

You can use middle mouse button (mouse wheel click) when going back from Alt Tabbing to the window....

..unless you have mouse wheel click marked as a weapon group... you should be fine (just zoomed in)

[Dulahan]

I’ve got well over 50 mechs, probably close to 100. I play different ones all the time. I sure as heck don’t remember how much heat my Alphas build on any given map with any given mech! Nor am I going to waste time on going to the TG every time I decide to switch mechs, I'd forget by the time I found a map anyways. Heck, by the time I play one or if I’m leveling a new one (I am still a long ways from even getting my initial basics on most of my Resistance Mechs – and those will change builds frequently while I’m trying to find the ideal play for each mech for me), there’s good odds I’ve never even been to whatever map it is with the current build. And even those maps I’ve been on, unless it’s the same one as last match, I don’t usually remember anyways, I don’t have an eidetic memory. And knowing how much heat I use is super important, especially since I’m an energy heavy build player.

That said, I never do right away, I do try to find a wall, face it, and shoot.

[CDLord HHGD]

LordBraxton, on 26 May 2015 - 06:06 AM, said:

alt-tabbing back into the game is a big culperate for some (one time my window was all black, and I alpha'ed someones ass when I clicked the window)

This is a legitimate excuse....

LordBraxton, on 26 May 2015 - 06:06 AM, said:

also, this game can be oh-so-tedious. after the long searching\loading wait, people want to click all the buttons!

This is not.

[Shatara]

Paigan, on 26 May 2015 - 06:14 AM, said:

Sorry but if people return into the game by that more than one time, they are just stupid.
There are multiple proper ways to do that without triggering a shot:
- alt-tab back in
- click on the MWO Icon in the task bar.
- if you are not intellectually capable of doing those two, then bring up the map before tabbing out

It's less a matter of intellect and more a matter of suppressing 30 years of 'click the window to activate it' instinct.

[Ronan]

There's wanting to hear "pew pew dakka dakka" right away, there's "how much heat does THIS mech with THESE weapons on THIS map generate" and there's "I alt-tabbed and need to get back". We all do one or more of these all the time.

But it takes a very special someone to do these things over and over and KNOW that these actions generate weapons fire right at SPAWN, and STILL do it again and again into a teammate's back. Its completely easy to NOT shoot teammates, doing it repeatedly is doing it intentionally.

That (probably overemphatically) said, I more often see the "zoomed all the way in can't see what's next to me or actually in front of me and shooting anyway" trick. Those folks shoot teammates, hills, buildings... anything next to them, blocking their weapons, but they can't tell with the zoom on. Those sorts of folks are also likely to walk into active firelanes... why they seem to want to take the bullet for the red team boggles the mind.

[MilesTeg1982]

Gethlaen, on 26 May 2015 - 06:04 AM, said:

Am I the only one who is sick to the back teeth of "All systems nominal" followed by some idiot shooting my leg as he "tests his weapons" ???

THEY WORK FFS LEAVE ME ALONE.

WHYWHYWHY?

Rant over kthx

its pretty simple in the end - people who do that are just really bad teamplayers and give a crap about their teammates.

There is not a single valid reason to fire weapons at the start.

- Alt+Tab? >> lol, as if that problem is not known for years(!) now, therefore: lame excuse
- test heat? >> go to testing grounds
- setup weapons groups? >> go to testing grounds

Also in my personal experience: there are some people who do it just to annoy other people and then complain when they get shot. Those people are beyond bad teamplayers cause they don't realize how bad those lightshows are for several reasons:

1. no one is able to predict lags and rubberbanding - therefore every time someone does a lightshow near a teammate he/she risks to hit that teammate

2. how should anyone know that the "friendly" mech who shots in his/her direction is not just a TK aiming badly? (remember: lags and rubberbanding works both ways!) - so you have 3 choices: ignore it and risk to get hit with the next stike, ask to stop (that usually ends with even more lightshows by more apes) or shot back

3. those lightshows do distract people - you know the kind of people who look out for enemies in their flanks ... and yes that it a real problem. And yes - it does not really help the team when you turn around only to find out that the mech firing in your direction is a "friendly" - in the worst case that happens right in the moment when the enemie approaches ...

4. those lightshows tell the enemie where you are - ok, does not really matter at the start - but it does matter when you flank the enemie and some idiot near you thinks its funny to shot in air before you are in the position to strike ... funny thing - the very same people often complain why matches are lost ...

5. did I mention that "teammates" who overheat in front of a fast approaching enemie cause they need to do their lightshows first are pretty much useless?

Edited by MilesTeg1982, 26 May 2015 - 08:16 AM.

[Almond Brown]

Novakaine, on 26 May 2015 - 07:13 AM, said:

Knuckle Draggers.
That is all.

Mushroom level IQ based Knuckle Draggers.

With 1 minute (maybe more time) before first direct enemy contact there is NO reason to shoot a teammate in the Drop zone. None. Well other than being a complete moronic douche'.

P.S. If you Test your Gauss Rifle for Heat level? Please, ffs, please go play on the other team... pretty please...

Edited by Almond Brown, 26 May 2015 - 08:21 AM.

[Shae Starfyre]

I thought people tested their weapons at the beginning of the match to see who will freak out the most.

Must just be me.

[Mister Blastman]

Because it is fun making pretty colors!

[Madcap72]

Trolls who know eventually someone will boo hoo about it on the forum.


So OP, what do suggest to fix it?

[Felio]

Setting up weapon groups (yes, you can do this in mechlab or testing grounds) or seeing how much heat a weapon group generates.

I take great care to avoid FF, though once my son grabbed the mouse and put 30 points into someone's leg. Sorry.

[WrathOfDeadguy]

Suggestion: implement a weapon safety switch that can be enabled or disabled via the options menu. That way, if you're in the habit of alt+tabbing the game while waiting and then clicking back in, you can have your game set up to require you to press a specific key before your weapons will fire at the start of the round.

Option enabled by default on new install, with a gigantic red splash warning on the HUD like the override toggle has when the safety is on. Have it read: WEAPONS SAFE PRESS (KEY) TO ARM. Add in an audio cue if you try to fire while the safety's on. To make it idiot-resistant (to prevent people from accidentally re-engaging it during combat), make it so that the safety cannot be re-engaged after it's been disengaged- and when making CW drops, have it enabled for the first drop but disabled automatically for subsequent drops in the same round.

If at that point there's anybody left who can't figure out how to arm their weapons, they're likely the sort of people who can't be trusted with them to begin with.

Edited by PS WrathOfDeadguy, 26 May 2015 - 10:01 AM.

[Dulahan]

MilesTeg1982, on 26 May 2015 - 08:14 AM, said:

There is not a single valid reason to fire weapons at the start.
- test heat? >> go to testing grounds
- setup weapons groups? >> go to testing grounds

You are objectively wrong on those two.

The previous is, as stated, NOT something many of us could ever do. I’m not going to remember X mech generates 34 Heat on Y Map. Not when I have 75 mechs I could be playing! And that’s before taking into account changing up builds. I’m not going to waste the time to get into every TG map and test out how much heat I generate (let alone be able to REMEMBER such!) just because I want to play a different mech every drop. I often only have time for 2-3 drops, and just as often use a different mech each time. And I’d forget the numbers for most of the maps by the time I got to them to begin with even if I did do so. So, no. the Testing Grounds is NOT a valid answer to this for most people.

Likewise, weapon groups? You do realize sometimes the client resets them, and mechs you had set up are suddenly not set up. That can catch you by surprise and entail a frantic attempt to get them set up before combat begins. Or the very human foible of making a change and forgetting to set groups because your friends are waiting for you to start a drop. I can’t count the number of times I’ve logged on and chose a mech I played a week or two ago, and somehow it didn’t have its groups set up anymore. Again, no way to predict this. And like heck will I remember to check the groups every time I change mechs when it’s one I had set up already. Easy thing to forget, and not hard to fix in play.

No one’s arguing it’s ok to alpha someone at the spawn – because that’s a **** move. We are saying that there are plenty of legitimate reasons to not have gone to the training grounds to test heat or set up groups. And most of us are polite enough to hurry to face a wall point blank so no one can run in front of us or aim straight up so we don’t hit someone.

[Bishop Steiner]

LordBraxton, on 26 May 2015 - 06:06 AM, said:

alt-tabbing back into the game is a big culperate for some (one time my window was all black, and I alpha'ed someones ass when I clicked the window)

also, this game can be oh-so-tedious. after the long searching\loading wait, people want to click all the buttons!

or..if they use their icons on the task bar...no FF incidence.

Lugh, on 26 May 2015 - 06:08 AM, said:

It happens every time you click in from alt tabbing.

so don't alt tab back.

LordBraxton, on 26 May 2015 - 06:19 AM, said:

@Paigan, it isnt that simple. Somtimes I will maximize MWO(usn a multitude of methods), and I'll get audio with no video, or some other weird glitch, like floating cursors, or strange window borders. Clicking on the program (even if I cant see) fixes it.

then be prepared to have an angry person alpha you back. Or wait about 20 seconds then do what you got to do.

[Almond Brown]

Dulahan, on 26 May 2015 - 10:18 AM, said:

stuff

No one’s arguing it’s ok to alpha someone at the spawn – because that’s a **** move. We are saying that there are plenty of legitimate reasons to not have gone to the training grounds to test heat or set up groups. And most of us are polite enough to hurry to face a wall point blank so no one can run in front of us or aim straight up so we don’t hit someone.

And just to be clear. No one is complaining about anyone who does that as that dose not strip much needed armor from a Freshly dropped Allied Mech.

Alt Tab in? ffs, I know 5 year olds that play and don't shoot other players in the Drop zone. What's your excuse again there grandpa?

P.S. You can fire your weapons and waste ammo all you want. Fill your boots even. But please, can we just have 25-30s to get the **** away from your dumb ass.

Edited by Almond Brown, 26 May 2015 - 10:31 AM.

[Bishop Steiner]

Water Bear, on 26 May 2015 - 07:36 AM, said:

Another time someone behind me shot an atlas in front of me, and the Atlas turned around and shot me. I was like bro...wut.

I find that the people who get the most annoyed by these incidents tend to have the most hypocritical reactions to them.

Heh.

I got a 3 way TK going that way on the enemy team. Saw an enemy VTR blocking the entrance to the volcano on Terra Therma, a couple of grognards sitting behind him. Lined up my Gauss from about 1200 and laid one in the VTRs kidneys. Guy turns. Looks around at his teammates, then turns back to poke at the volcano entrance. So I lay another GR shot in his kidneys. He turns, alpha strikes one of the guys, insta-killing him. Other dude starts shooting back and they tear each other up for a bit, long enough for me to close and kill the Victor right after he finished his other teammate.

Funny part was the VTR was being driven by a pretty well known, extremely vocal, self proclaimed Comp Guy, back when the poptart Meta reigned supreme. So getting him to TK his own guys, then tell him how it happened on chat, THEN kill him? Was one of the most enjoyable things I have ever done in this game.

Edited by Bishop Steiner, 26 May 2015 - 10:38 AM.

[Xetelian]

Testing your heat out isn't a crime unless you test it on someones back or legs.

ALT Tabbing and clicking the screen when you come back is unfortunate.

Still, I've taken maybe at best 10-20 damage from someone in the beginning of a round and that isn't enough to sway the match.

[masCh]

Paigan, on 26 May 2015 - 06:29 AM, said:

I don't think that this is the explanation for the majority of weapon firing at the beginning.
Also, I fail to see why you absolutely must maximize and click the application when the mech is running with weapons ready to fire.
Maximize the game once before and leave it maximized (or do you mean restore the window? Maximizing means telling the application to span the whole screen, not restoring it to gain full focus).
Or tab out and in again, that also fixes such things quite often. And if not, you can still press the map button to safely click around in the application.
I'm 99% sure that even in your case you can solve the problems in a convenient way without annoying/damaging your team mates.


Read what I wrote in my first post.

If you run MWO full-windowed, you can have your browser on the left side of the screen, while MWO is in the background (instead of your desktop wallpaper). So when you glance to your desktop background with the browser in forefront, and you notice the match has started, it is only natural to move your mouse over to the MWO window and click it to activate it.. Unfortunately clicking on this window also shoots your primary weapons.
Many people do it only one time and have since learned to just alt-tab into the game or something else, but most times people just forget and take it for granted and click on the window anyway and regret later (especially after accidentally expending precious AC20 rounds on a rock).

[MilesTeg1982]

Dulahan, on 26 May 2015 - 10:18 AM, said:

You are objectively wrong on those two.

The previous is, as stated, NOT something many of us could ever do. I’m not going to remember X mech generates 34 Heat on Y Map. Not when I have 75 mechs I could be playing! And that’s before taking into account changing up builds. I’m not going to waste the time to get into every TG map and test out how much heat I generate (let alone be able to REMEMBER such!) just because I want to play a different mech every drop. I often only have time for 2-3 drops, and just as often use a different mech each time. And I’d forget the numbers for most of the maps by the time I got to them to begin with even if I did do so. So, no. the Testing Grounds is NOT a valid answer to this for most people.

Actually I think you underestimate what the human brain is capable of ... my personal experience (I do have about 80 mechs too) tells me it is not really hard to remember the heat of weapons and therefore estimate how hot certain builds get on certain maps. You might really not be able to do that (in that case I feel sad for you) - however most people who come up with that argument are just lazy and don't want to spend 30 secones in testing ground and rather risk to hit a teammate.

Therefore I'll consider them bad teamplayers (even if they are not capable of estimating heat they are bad teammates cause they consider their 30 seconds for testing grounds worth than the risk of killing or ruining the game for a teammate who might had spend much longer in the queue time)

Dulahan, on 26 May 2015 - 10:18 AM, said:

Likewise, weapon groups? You do realize sometimes the client resets them, and mechs you had set up are suddenly not set up. That can catch you by surprise and entail a frantic attempt to get them set up before combat begins. Or the very human foible of making a change and forgetting to set groups because your friends are waiting for you to start a drop. I can’t count the number of times I’ve logged on and chose a mech I played a week or two ago, and somehow it didn’t have its groups set up anymore. Again, no way to predict this. And like heck will I remember to check the groups every time I change mechs when it’s one I had set up already. Easy thing to forget, and not hard to fix in play.

Known problem with a easy solution - just check the forum (little tip: you need to delete some XML-Files once to solve it). Once again a lame excuse for being lazy.