57 replies to this topic

[Revis Volek]

Ghogiel, on 07 June 2015 - 08:24 AM, said:

Unless they run off of magic then charging capaciters, gas cooling of components etc might make some noise yeah.

They run off heated gas, which makes no sounds and are turned to light which makes no sound.

I have 2 c02 powered lasers here in my shop, they make no noise. All you hear is the fans running and the noise it makes when printing is from the bearings sliding on the rail. Laser in MWO dont work like printers so there are no bearing...just a tube with gas and some fans.

Maybe you should look into how LASERS work? DO you hear the air in the vacuum pump when your car is running? Or the warm air being forced through the intake? NO you hear the engine and the exhaust. which is what we hear in these mechs for the most part. Engines and hits taken....

Mercules, on 08 June 2015 - 07:19 AM, said:

If they are powerful enough to do damage to ceramic steel composite armor in less than a second the way they do, just probably not the sounds PGI chose. Basically they should likely crack the way lighting does as it displaces the air and we get a crack as air rushes back in to fill the void.

Of course we probably shouldn't SEE the laser unless in a very dusty or foggy environment which would reduce their efficiency.

Most lasers are in fact Invisible or very slightly, but again, no sounds is involved. My c02 lasers here in the shop hit stuff at over 480 degrees and there is no sound made. If you hit something right, with the correct frequency, speed and power you can turn the material into gas or plasma and there is literally NOTHING left... No dust, no soot, no nothing.

This process is called Laser Ablation and I use it daily....
http://en.wikipedia..../Laser_ablation Some short more then likely incorrect articles on Laser Ablation...

Laser Ablation can also be used to transfer momentum or energy as well, they use it to harden metals much like annealing and hitting with a hammer.

Edited by DarthRevis, 08 June 2015 - 07:48 AM.

[Templar Dane]

Nightmare1, on 08 June 2015 - 07:02 AM, said:

If an Atlas falls in the Forest Colony, and there's no one around to witness it, does it still make a sound?

After going back and checking, it does. It sounds like a feather falling onto a pillow from the height of about a foot and a half.

[Kristov Kerensky]

We really shouldn't be hearing much of anything in our Mechs to be honest. We're sitting in a cockpit that's sealed from the atmosphere for starters, combined with our heads being inside a neurohelmet that actually controls what we do or do not hear via the headphones in them, all in an effort to PROTECT our ears from all the noises of combat in a Mech.

The reason for that is simple, if you damage your ears, you can't drive a Mech again, lore and novels cover this.

Rag doll physics are a bit silly on the face of it, but that is only if you don't actually know how Mechs are built and function..

Mechs don't move the various pieces of their anatomy via pistons, servos and the like, they are moved with muscles, the myomer muscle fiber that is under all that armor plating we see. MWO doesn't show that, which is too bad, as it would really be nice to see muscle fibers whipping around after you blow an arm or leg off, or blow holes in plating on the torso sections. The myomer operates like any other muscle fiber, electric current, so the rag doll physics makes sense when you know how Mechs function. A 'dying' Mech is just as likely as a human or dog or gold fish to just go limp or to have spasms and flop around, depends on the type of damage and what may or may not be functioning and if the pilot is still in there or not(cockpit shots doing 40+ damage means a dead pilot).

So unless your cockpit has taken damage, you shouldn't hear a whole lot, it's a safety feature of the Mech to avoid blowing your eardrums out whenever you fire your PPC or autocannons.

[AntiCitizenJuan]

While we're on the subject of stomping, It would be nice if PGI could get their sound team to change mechs noise factor based on tonnage. My RVN2X shouldnt make the same noise level of stompiness compared to my AWS8Q when they're 45 tons apart

Edited by AntiCitizenJuan, 08 June 2015 - 07:50 AM.

[Narcissistic Martyr]

KiraOnime, on 07 June 2015 - 08:28 AM, said:

I just never understood why they included ragdoll physics in this game.

I think it was part of the knock down mechanics that were in the game during closed beta. Plus seeing dead ravens do somersaults is awesome.

[Joseph Mallan]

El Bandito, on 07 June 2015 - 03:07 AM, said:

FIFY.






TIMBEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEER!

[Almond Brown]

Narcissistic Martyr, on 08 June 2015 - 07:58 AM, said:

I think it was part of the knock down mechanics that were in the game during closed beta. Plus seeing dead ravens do somersaults is awesome.

Or any Mech falling off the steep sides of Alpine. Seen some seriously funny and "ouch" type falls from up there.

[Mercules]

DarthRevis, on 08 June 2015 - 07:37 AM, said:

They run off heated gas, which makes no sounds and are turned to light which makes no sound.

I have 2 c02 powered lasers here in my shop, they make no noise. All you hear is the fans running and the noise it makes when printing is from the bearings sliding on the rail. Laser in MWO dont work like printers so there are no bearing...just a tube with gas and some fans.

Maybe you should look into how LASERS work? DO you hear the air in the vacuum pump when your car is running? Or the warm air being forced through the intake? NO you hear the engine and the exhaust. which is what we hear in these mechs for the most part. Engines and hits taken....



Most lasers are in fact Invisible or very slightly, but again, no sounds is involved. My c02 lasers here in the shop hit stuff at over 480 degrees and there is no sound made. If you hit something right, with the correct frequency, speed and power you can turn the material into gas or plasma and there is literally NOTHING left... No dust, no soot, no nothing.

This process is called Laser Ablation and I use it daily....
http://en.wikipedia..../Laser_ablation Some short more then likely incorrect articles on Laser Ablation...

Laser Ablation can also be used to transfer momentum or energy as well, they use it to harden metals much like annealing and hitting with a hammer.

You need to remember that some of these lasers are stripping off about a 1/4-1/3 of a ton of composite armor designed for protection in about a second. That is far hotter than 480 degrees. Once you got hot enough you will likely ionize the air much like lightning. Along that channel, if the heated air expands fast enough you will get shockwaves, just like lightning, and thus will have a crack. So yes, futuristic laser weaponry designed to cut through 1/4 of futuristic armor would possibly make sounds, just not Zrrrrrrrrrrrrp. More like lightning.

[Revis Volek]

Mercules, on 08 June 2015 - 08:23 AM, said:

You need to remember that some of these lasers are stripping off about a 1/4-1/3 of a ton of composite armor designed for protection in about a second. That is far hotter than 480 degrees. Once you got hot enough you will likely ionize the air much like lightning. Along that channel, if the heated air expands fast enough you will get shockwaves, just like lightning, and thus will have a crack. So yes, futuristic laser weaponry designed to cut through 1/4 of futuristic armor would possibly make sounds, just not Zrrrrrrrrrrrrp. More like lightning.

I agree, future lasers are gonna be more insane then my laser here in the shop. But in a game where everyone cries and whines when things get fun and futuristic i can see why they go more real in sound and other things. I have a feeling the masses would whine hard if we added fun noises to the weapons.

I'm not against more sounds effects...i honestly think the cockpits are too quiet right now. But I see why they are reserved on doing work on something that might not get a good reception once in game.

If we had a *CLAP* sounds though right when the laser turned on...and some lighting noises for PPC's id be giddy.

[Mercules]

DarthRevis, on 08 June 2015 - 08:31 AM, said:

If we had a *CLAP* sounds though right when the laser turned on...and some lighting noises for PPC's id be giddy.

I'm disappointed every time I play a space game and hear engine whines, other ships/items colliding, and weapon fire. I have to admit I got rather giddy when I played HPG for the first time and only heard sounds from MY mech. Lasers should be silent there, except for maybe some hissing gas and humming of capacitors.

[Kristov Kerensky]

Mercules, on 08 June 2015 - 08:23 AM, said:

You need to remember that some of these lasers are stripping off about a 1/4-1/3 of a ton of composite armor designed for protection in about a second. That is far hotter than 480 degrees. Once you got hot enough you will likely ionize the air much like lightning. Along that channel, if the heated air expands fast enough you will get shockwaves, just like lightning, and thus will have a crack. So yes, futuristic laser weaponry designed to cut through 1/4 of futuristic armor would possibly make sounds, just not Zrrrrrrrrrrrrp. More like lightning.

Uhm, no, the LASER isn't hot, it's simply highly excited photons which when they hit something, like armor plating, transfer that energy to the armor plating, THEN things get hot. The actual beam of photons itself, silent, not a whisper at all.

PPCs should sound like thunder, they actually do produce a vacuum and the shockwave of that creation/collapse causes a massive sonic boom, so thunder.

However, again, we're sitting inside the Mechs, our hearing is protected from the sounds, we CAN monitor for sound, but it won't be coming to our ears at the eardrum blowing decibel levels it really is, it'll just be noise that we know means a PPC was just fired or that a Mech of unknown size walked past us, much like it is now.

[Mercules]

Kristov Kerensky, on 08 June 2015 - 08:49 AM, said:

Uhm, no, the LASER isn't hot, it's simply highly excited photons which when they hit something, like armor plating, transfer that energy to the armor plating, THEN things get hot. The actual beam of photons itself, silent, not a whisper at all.

Are you attempting to tell me that photons won't interact with air molecules and impart their energy on it? If photons don't interact with air why is our sky blue instead of black?

If there is any dust or humidity in the air the laser is going to hit that and transfer energy even if it has minimal interaction with air molecules and we all know that 20+ ton machines moving around will not create any dust.

[Kristov Kerensky]

Mercules, on 08 June 2015 - 08:57 AM, said:

Are you attempting to tell me that photons won't interact with air molecules and impart their energy on it? If photons don't interact with air why is our sky blue instead of black?

If there is any dust or humidity in the air the laser is going to hit that and transfer energy even if it has minimal interaction with air molecules and we all know that 20+ ton machines moving around will not create any dust.

No, but I am telling you that you won't hear that beam of photons as it passes through the atmosphere any more than you hear them right now as they pass through the atmosphere. You MIGHT see the occasional sparkle as the photons interact with the atmosphere, but that's unlikely as the energy transfer won't produce visible light usually, and you won't hear those rare odd interactions, single molecules being vaporized aren't really noisy. Lasers are actually bad weapons for atmospheric combat, too many ways to totally negate them, but hey, they LOOK cool..despite the fact that they should actually be invisible to the naked eye!

Might want to look up lasers man, you have some serious misconceptions about them it seems.

[Abisha]

Mercules, on 08 June 2015 - 08:57 AM, said:

Are you attempting to tell me that photons won't interact with air molecules and impart their energy on it? If photons don't interact with air why is our sky blue instead of black?

If there is any dust or humidity in the air the laser is going to hit that and transfer energy even if it has minimal interaction with air molecules and we all know that 20+ ton machines moving around will not create any dust.

of course it interact, but no sound get released by it.
think of it like this, if Photons made sound then we all have been def by the sun core .

[Kristov Kerensky]

Abisha, on 08 June 2015 - 09:20 AM, said:

of course it interact, but no sound get released by it.
think of it like this, if Photons made sound then we all have been def by the sun core .

The Sun doesn't deafen us because sound doesn't travel through a vacuum and the photons hitting the atmosphere that DO exchange enough energy to possibly produce sound do so in essentially a vacuum, since that takes place at the outer edges of the atmosphere and beyond in actual vacuum.

However, generally speaking, you are correct, we would be deafened by the noise of all the photons hitting everything around us all the time, as every single interaction does produce transfers of energy, but they don't produce sound due to the way photons interact with normal matter, since light is both a wave and a particle at the same time, which means the rules are slightly different.

High energy laser beams are silent, the only sounds associated with them are produced by whatever they hit, expansion of the material as it's energy levels are increased. Even the hardware used to produce high energy laser beams tends to be silent, just not a noisy weapon system.

[Mercules]

Kristov Kerensky, on 08 June 2015 - 09:09 AM, said:

Might want to look up lasers man, you have some serious misconceptions about them it seems.

Uh huh....

Abisha, on 08 June 2015 - 09:20 AM, said:

of course it interact, but no sound get released by it.
think of it like this, if Photons made sound then we all have been def by the sun core .

If it ends up creating plasma, it will create sound. High intensity focused lasers can create sound because they can end up creating plasma, just like lightning. You are attempting to tell me that a laser intense enough to burn through 1/4 ton of armor designed to help protect against that very thing is unlikely to produce plasma in an atmosphere?

[Lugh]

KiraOnime, on 07 June 2015 - 08:28 AM, said:

I just never understood why they included ragdoll physics in this game.

I don't understand why they can't get collisions working correctly and make the mechs fall down when overwhelmed. That way we no long have 'l33t' light warriors charging into mech and praying to the collision gods that they warp someplace safe to get beyond the mech they just ran in to....

Back in my day that light mech fell over, with damage taken and then I shot him in the face.

BRING BACK COLLISIONS AND GIVE US DEATH FROM ABOVE!!!

[Athanos Kerensky]

Kristov Kerensky, on 08 June 2015 - 07:47 AM, said:

We really shouldn't be hearing much of anything in our Mechs to be honest. We're sitting in a cockpit that's sealed from the atmosphere for starters, combined with our heads being inside a neurohelmet that actually controls what we do or do not hear via the headphones in them, all in an effort to PROTECT our ears from all the noises of combat in a Mech.

The reason for that is simple, if you damage your ears, you can't drive a Mech again, lore and novels cover this.

Rag doll physics are a bit silly on the face of it, but that is only if you don't actually know how Mechs are built and function..

Mechs don't move the various pieces of their anatomy via pistons, servos and the like, they are moved with muscles, the myomer muscle fiber that is under all that armor plating we see. MWO doesn't show that, which is too bad, as it would really be nice to see muscle fibers whipping around after you blow an arm or leg off, or blow holes in plating on the torso sections. The myomer operates like any other muscle fiber, electric current, so the rag doll physics makes sense when you know how Mechs function. A 'dying' Mech is just as likely as a human or dog or gold fish to just go limp or to have spasms and flop around, depends on the type of damage and what may or may not be functioning and if the pilot is still in there or not(cockpit shots doing 40+ damage means a dead pilot).

So unless your cockpit has taken damage, you shouldn't hear a whole lot, it's a safety feature of the Mech to avoid blowing your eardrums out whenever you fire your PPC or autocannons.

Well put that's what I was thinking.

[Abisha]

Kristov Kerensky, on 08 June 2015 - 09:31 AM, said:

The Sun doesn't deafen us because sound doesn't travel through a vacuum and the photons hitting the atmosphere that DO exchange enough energy to possibly produce sound do so in essentially a vacuum, since that takes place at the outer edges of the atmosphere and beyond in actual vacuum.

However, generally speaking, you are correct, we would be deafened by the noise of all the photons hitting everything around us all the time, as every single interaction does produce transfers of energy, but they don't produce sound due to the way photons interact with normal matter, since light is both a wave and a particle at the same time, which means the rules are slightly different.

High energy laser beams are silent, the only sounds associated with them are produced by whatever they hit, expansion of the material as it's energy levels are increased. Even the hardware used to produce high energy laser beams tends to be silent, just not a noisy weapon system.

aye yes the 80 year old problem. witch likely be still be a problem in at least 200 years from now.

Mercules, on 08 June 2015 - 09:48 AM, said:

Uh huh....










If it ends up creating plasma, it will create sound. High intensity focused lasers can create sound because they can end up creating plasma, just like lightning. You are attempting to tell me that a laser intense enough to burn through 1/4 ton of armor designed to help protect against that very thing is unlikely to produce plasma in an atmosphere?

only the impact will make sound not the "shooting of the laser".
still i guess having no sound while fire a laser in MWO will be looking silly. still i really like HPG manifold when anything is how it suppose to be.

[Kristov Kerensky]

Mercules, on 08 June 2015 - 09:48 AM, said:

Uh huh....










If it ends up creating plasma, it will create sound. High intensity focused lasers can create sound because they can end up creating plasma, just like lightning. You are attempting to tell me that a laser intense enough to burn through 1/4 ton of armor designed to help protect against that very thing is unlikely to produce plasma in an atmosphere?

Again, read up on lasers and how they function and operate, you've done nothing but show exactly what I said, the BEAM is silent, the only noise comes from the expansion of the surface being hit if there's enough energy being transferred. That tat removal laser, it's designed to be noisy, that's NOT the laser, that's the control hardware making noise so people know it's on, a safety feature.

And the sound you hear when you see lightening is impressive, and it is due to the creation and collapse of a vacuum due to ionization of air molecules, that's true. That is NOT how lasers work however, not even remotely the same, you have definitely confused two totally different things. PPCs should look and sound like lightening strikes, that's in the novels and lore because that's how the REAL world versions work. Lasers look like, well, real weapon lasers don't look like anything, they operate at wave lengths the human eye can't actually see. And the hardware for most lasers is actually silent, you have to actually DESIGN the hardware to be noisy to hear them operate, which they do with some medically based lasers so people KNOW they are on, since the beam is invisible, again, that's a safety feature. Weaponized lasers wouldn't need such a safety feature, at least the ones the US Military is currently using don't have them, they are pretty quiet.

LAWS - US Military
ADAM - US Miliary

Please note that in these videos, you do NOT hear the laser firing, you do NOT hear the beam as it passes through the atmosphere and you do NOT hear it as it strikes it's target. You do hear the explosions of the targets. Lasers are silent, you can make the hardware produce noise, but the beam is silent, it's light, that is all, and light is silent.