203 replies to this topic

[Theodore42]

Animus41, on 07 June 2015 - 12:01 PM, said:

Um, yeah, the DEFINITIVE history of WWII is History of the Second World War by Sir B.H. Liddell Hart. Shirer's book may only the definitive work on the Rise and Fall of the Third Reich. In your opinion of course.

I should have said the definitive work on the Third Reich, starting from H's birth. It covers where Tyranny came from, how it came to power, how it sustained itself, and how it fell. I'm currently rereading it from an ethnographic perspective which is probably why I injected all this "N" and "H" crazyness into the thread. I just got really offended at the posts implying that the OP is partly guilty or deserving of this treatment.

Also I'm pretty sophistic.

Back to the topic at hand,

utontihso,

After reading this thread, it seems like the best thing to do is to just change the name of the Unit. People will hold a grudge against your Unit's name forever, but if you change the name, I bet they will forget so fast.

I gotta go for today.

The only point I'm trying to make is to not discriminate against individuals in groups. The analogy I've been making is hardly analogous to the situation at hand but the human traits I'm seeing are the same.

That is all!

[Mystere]

<smh> People just don't get it. Harassment is harassment.

[Alan Davion]

utontihso, on 07 June 2015 - 12:08 PM, said:

Theodore42

PGI has chosen to handle this unprofessionally and very PUBLIC. They as well as all companies
know you cant just cause public issues without expecting some push back. They need to remove all Public discussions and naming of this, since it causes collateral effects and they know it now.

When it moved from PGI to open twitter etc discussions its now a VERY PUBLIC domain with all the up sides to PGI as well as the INDIVIDUALS. It also opens up all the negatives " reputation, accountability, legal etc".

Actions have reactions / consequences

Supporting Harassment is an easy one to identify / prove, if they don't stop it.

Utontihso

66AH

They also know that cheating disrupts their game and can, in extreme cases, cause people to stop playing altogether.

PGI can not allow this to occur for any number of reasons. The most prominent of which being they've got 2 Mech Packs on pre-order, and if people stop playing all at once, they'll likely demand refunds on those mech packs.

This would essentially ruin PGI, as well as the only Battletech/Mechwarrior game we have for the time being.

Lord Scarlett Johan, on 07 June 2015 - 12:08 PM, said:

It doesn't work that way. ToS forbids cheating. Your leadership cheated. Your leadership was held accountable for their actions by PGI and as such failed you and the rest of your unit.

I doubt you were here or on reddit for the ModPud incident, but her own team suspected her of cheating, gathered the evidence, and turned her in. She was a very high profile player and the reason few people harass the 228th is because they held their own accountable. They were still left stinging from the embarrassment she brought, but they did the right thing by cleaning their own ranks by disassociating themselves from cheating and having no place for it.

Your unit did not do that. And now your unit is suffering the blowback from having to be held accountable by PGI.

Tl;dr:

228 cleaned out the cheaters themselves and turned them over to PGI. 228th suffered no blowback due to their actions.
66AH did not clean out their ranks of cheaters and PGI stepped in to do so. 66AH is suffering blowback due to their inactions.

Scarlett has it pegged.

utontihso, on 07 June 2015 - 12:14 PM, said:

Alan,

I cannot get into specifics due to forum rules, I however have done extensive research about the events up to this.
I chose to disagree based on facts, not on emotion.

if you want to take it off line:
mwo2013@comcast.net

Utontihso

66AH

I will not give you my email, nor even add yours to mine. If you want to 'take this elsewhere' you can do it via a PM here on the forums.

Mudhutwarrior, on 07 June 2015 - 12:16 PM, said:

Sunlight is the best disinfectant. Wanting to drag things in the shadows leaves me with doubt about your intentions here.

And this is exactly why PGI has publicly shamed the cheaters recently, so that people associated with them will feel the shame, and be forced to part company.

Utontihso, you said the 66AH worked to remove cheaters from your group? Clearly they did not work hard enough at it, otherwise we would not be having this discussion.

[Mudhutwarrior]

"The Measure of a man is the Company he keeps"

Your in bad company, What you do about it tells everyone a lot. Fight for them or fight for your honor. We know all about them now.

[oldradagast]

utontihso, on 07 June 2015 - 09:52 AM, said:

What is PGI going to do about players calling all members of a unit that had someone banned "cheaters".

The same day they'll start issuing sanctions against big-name units that spend most of CW matches spewing insults, demeaning the enemy team, and "GGclose" and all those other examples of poor sportsmanship.

I've had to listen to no end of people in big units supporting poor behavior in CW because: "it's real war," "it's not supposed to be fun," and so on. The big units wanted CW to be a miserable cesspool of try-hards pulling whatever lame tactics they wanted for that all-important "a winner is you!" trophy, and they got it, cheaters and all. And now they complain when the general users are calling them on it.

So, as the big units would say, deal with it - it's not supposed to be fun.

Edited by oldradagast, 07 June 2015 - 12:51 PM.

[utontihso]

I cannot reply via personal message, if you read their statement about their decision no form of PGI coms is allowed to challenge their findings. This means in game, Forums or PM's.That said I cannot comment on their findings for fear of having my $1000.00 + spent banned.

Its not some random or "fear of light reason" its been outright stated we cannot use their media to address their banning of players PERIOD. So please don't ask me to do so, you are in effect asking me to cheat on the rules PGI has itself put in place here.

I did not make the rules I am however living within them. I will openly discuss it off PGI's com's.

Again I state this is about the Harassment PGI itself is causing.

Utontihso

66AH

mwo2013@comcast.net

[Alan Davion]

utontihso, on 07 June 2015 - 12:51 PM, said:

I cannot reply via personal message, if you read their statement about their decision no form of PGI coms is allowed to challenge their findings. This means in game, Forums or PM's.That said I cannot comment on their findings for fear of having my $1000.00 + spent banned.

Its not some random or "fear of light reason" its been outright stated we cannot use their media to address their banning of players PERIOD. So please don't ask me to do so, you are in effect asking me to cheat on the rules PGI has itself put in place here.

I did not make the rules I am however living within them. I will openly discuss it off PGI's com's.

Again I state this is about the Harassment PGI itself is causing.

Utontihso

66AH

mwo2013@comcast.net

And yet you are right now doing everything you just said you are not supposed to do.

Good god man, people on your team cheated, they were dealt with, it's time to move on.

[Mystere]

Alan Davion, on 07 June 2015 - 12:59 PM, said:

Good god man, people on your team cheated, they were dealt with, it's time to move on.

Ask that of the people doing the harassing. But those same folks want their pound of flesh, I guess.

[Chuck Jager]

If it really is harassment, and it has had a provable impact on your life, you are welcome to press charges through the proper channels.

Have fun

[Vectoron]

Jman5, on 07 June 2015 - 10:00 AM, said:

We need to insist PGI to creates a "/mute player" command so that we can create a list of players we don't ever want to hear from.

I could easily second this. Good idea, Jman

[utontihso]

Alan,

Actually I am not addressing the issue I am addressing your request to discuss the topic on a PGI coms.

I would love to have a mature open discussion about that, PGI has chosen to not allow that as stated above.

I am totally willing to stand in the brightest light to quote someone else, PGI themselves says this is not an option.

So if you want to fault me for following the rules as forced on me by PGI, not much I can do about that.....

Utontihso

66AH

mwo2013@comcast.net

[Koniving]

Bishop Steiner, on 07 June 2015 - 11:03 AM, said:

hence the ironic name. Does not change the point of the post.

Jman5, on 07 June 2015 - 10:58 AM, said:

magic mute stick?
I've never seen an online game without a player mute feature except this one. It's an industry standard for good reasons that you have mentioned. There are trolls and idiots out there that are best ignored.

It's shocking that PGI never implemented it and we're forced to either mute the entire game, or put up with jerks.

Uh, the game has a Blacklist which ignores all incoming chat from unwanted individuals. Its fluke is it requires you to befriend said person to blacklist them. (Really? Like, seriously?)

The game also features microphone muting options.

The forums on the other hand has the option to prevent instant messages from specific individuals as one player once complained to me about (and it's like "dude you brought it on yourself if the guy says he wants the drop the subject then drop the subject; also what the heck am I supposed to do about it?"). From what I understand a moderator had to set it (meaning that so far as I know you are required to report the incident and contact a moderator for mediation).

I highly believe that access to these tools should be significantly easier for users to access, however. ("...So let me get this straight, I have to befriend the person that won't stop bothering me in order to blacklist that person?")

Edited by Koniving, 07 June 2015 - 03:11 PM.

[utontihso]

Chuck,

In order to move forward you must first show an attempt to fix it ...... That is how the system works. You must also show the parties knew about it and did not stop the in game AND out of game / PUBLIC aspect of their said actions. But I agree with the intent of your statement.

Utontihso

66AH

mwo2013@comcast.net

[PurpleNinja]

Welcome to the world.
You'll see this kind of behavior a lot.
I think the word is prejudice.

[Spleenslitta]

Koniving, on 07 June 2015 - 01:11 PM, said:

Uh, the game has a Blacklist which ignores all incoming chat from unwanted individuals. Its fluke is it requires you to befriend said person to blacklist them. (Really? Like, seriously?)

The game also features microphone muting options.

The forums on the other hand has the option to prevent instant messages from specific individuals as one player once complained to me about (and it's like "dude you brought it on yourself if the guy says he wants the drop the subject then drop the subject; also what the heck am I supposed to do about it?"). From what I understand a moderator had to set it (meaning that so far as I know you are required to report the incident and contact a moderator for mediation).

I highly believe that access to these tools should be significantly easier for users to access, however. ("...So let me get this straight, I have to befriend the person that won't stop bothering me in order to blacklist that person?")

Holy crap that makes no sense. I didn't know PGI had shat themselves on the leg that badly.
We need a proper and easy way of permanently ignoring these pests.

Edited by Spleenslitta, 07 June 2015 - 01:23 PM.

[Creovex]

@OP well come on now, you are telling me you never spectated your old teammate after dying and noticed something off???

Guilt by association, get used to it and I the future of you suspect a teammate of being a cheater, boot them out!

[Mystere]

PurpleNinja, on 07 June 2015 - 01:20 PM, said:

Welcome to the world.
You'll see this kind of behavior a lot.
I think the word is prejudice.

Talking about prejudice ...

[EvangelionUnit]

>mfw people don't know how to shut down the ingame chat and hide posts from unwanted people on the forums ....

[utontihso]

Creovex,

I have personally spectated just about every player we have, and I PERSONALLY addressed an issue with the unit leader. I felt what had been done was wrong, he instantly had a meeting with the individual on our teamspeak. The issue was addressed and never done again. So I have acted in good faith against any bad conduct or potential cheating personally. That gives me the moral right to speak out on this. 2 wrongs don't make a right PERIOD.

That line of thought would result in "they cheated so I get to also" and I never believe in winning over morals.

I live my life as an open book, I don't keep secrets and I value quality feedback in my life. I would openly discuss all aspects of this and get everyones input. However PGI does not allow that.... so if you are looking to call some one in the dark don't look at me. I did not make the PGI com rules related to this, PGI did and no one else. I am just working within the rules as given.

getting trolled here is not hiding in the dark, its discussing what I am allowed to and nothing more. If you want more discussion you need to speak to PGI to open the topic.

Utontihso

66AH

mwo2013@comcast.net

[Mudhutwarrior]

This whole Mike Huckabee /Dugar family thing has gone too far. Now everyone is doing it.