71 replies to this topic

[XX Sulla XX]

Ok so in the town hall Russ said they are redoing all of the mech balancing and will be testing in probably a couple of weeks. This will be based on an internal system where they look at things like hard point location, number of hard points, agility, etc etc.

They are also redoing/replacing Elo depending on how you want to say it. It will not longer be based on just winning or loosing but in your performance. If you loose but do top damage you will not loose points but might gain them. If you win but do nothing you might not gain any points.

Also players will be put in Elo buckets and top players will not be playing against lower tier and new players. This new system should make it easier for players to get outof Elo Hell even if they are not playing in a good group.

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Over all I like the sound of these two changes. It also explains the lack of quirk changes to mechs. I think every one should install the test client and help them test it out before it goes live.

Does any one have any thoughts?

[Shadow Magnet]

So we will have new top meta mechs soon? It's all good, I like changes, makes the game more interesting.

I pitty those who sold mechs after mastering the chassis. I bet some people will regret that when the new balance goes online.

[FupDup]

Big Things In July™ all over again?

We'll see, my hand actuators are crossed.

[TyphonCh]

Loose.

Lose?

I can't even.

[N0MAD]

SC will be here before end of year, like 1/2 the soon coming changes, just thought i would mention that..

[XX Sulla XX]

Seems like they are trying to be more rational on how they do it. I hope it works. Also they said they are not going to make it live unless the community thinks its working or something along those lines. So better get the test client and get ready to test

[Elizander]

Quirks were a test to begin with.

Grid Iron owners should brace themselves. The end is near.

[Sarlic]

Who's in my ELO bucket?

Please don't leave me, don't make my eyes water. Don't leave the poor Atlas behind.

Wash it with water and parfumed soap please. Especially that big long gun. What a barrel, eh?

[TheCharlatan]

I welcome the balance changes, but I tremble at the idea of a test server balance evaluation... we never came to any conclusion about balance on 90% of the mechs (almost everyone can agree that a few mechs need help. that's it. I'm not even sure we agree on which ones).

The forums will go ablaze with people complaining about mechs that got nerfed to the ground/buffed to high heavens and vice versa.
Example:
Player 1: "The Dire Wolf now sucks!"
Player 2: "No it dosen't. L2P"
Player 3: "Actually, it got nerfed pretty hard, look at my spreadsheet."
Player 4: "It's ok, look at these screenies that show me get 1000+ damage in it!"
Player 1: "Go away you elitist bittervets! I am awesome at the game and the Dire Wolf now sucks. Period."
Player 5: "At least it didn't get nerfed as hard as the Dragon..."
Player 6: "It's the pilot, not the mech."

Now multiply this for every single mech in the game.
The Forum Warrioring will be the stuff of f******* legends.
Then PGI will probably facepalm since we can not make up our minds and ignore us, making some horrible choices like 50% cooldown quirks all over again.

Edited by TheCharlatan, 25 June 2015 - 10:49 PM.

[Sarlic]

Quote

Player 3: "Actually, it got nerfed pretty hard, look at my spreadsheet."

I don't know why, but i LOL'ed so hard about this one. Because it's true!

[Darlith]

I like the idea of the changes, I eagerly await to see if they make the game better or objectively worse.

Not really liking the idea of possibly modifying the builds on all my mechs, but will if I need to. Some of them I'm pretty sure just won't work without quirks, or I may decide I like a different build better without quirks.

[PhoenixFire55]

XX Sulla XX, on 25 June 2015 - 09:41 PM, said:

Ok so in the town hall Russ said they are redoing all of the mech balancing and will be testing in probably a couple of weeks. This will be based on an internal system where they look at things like hard point location, number of hard points, agility, etc etc.

So much for "no major changes to quirks and balance". Clan mechs hardpoints nerf incoming I guess ...

XX Sulla XX, on 25 June 2015 - 09:41 PM, said:

They are also redoing/replacing Elo depending on how you want to say it. It will not longer be based on just winning or loosing but in your performance.

Ooooook ... so what they kept telling us about the current MM, like that Elo was a proper representation of player skill was what? Lies?

XX Sulla XX, on 25 June 2015 - 09:41 PM, said:

If you loose but do top damage you will not loose points but might gain them. If you win but do nothing you might not gain any points.

Ok, so I got a bad team, did all I could but still needed to carry harder and then my Elo will still go up, so I'll get an even worse team next time and will need to carry harder even harder?

XX Sulla XX, on 25 June 2015 - 09:41 PM, said:

Also players will be put in Elo buckets and top players will not be playing against lower tier and new players. This new system should make it easier for players to get outof Elo Hell even if they are not playing in a good group.

I'll say it again, all players were supposed to be in different Elo buckets already. At least PGI said so. What was it again, lies or their position at the time or what?


Thoughts are as follows ...

1. Until hit reg is 100% reliable for all weapons, all and any weapon/mech balancing changes are meaningless.

2. With reliable hit reg AND a proper MM that takes into account more than just Elo score for an entire mech class (i.e. Elo for each variant of each chassis etc.) we won't need any "balancing" and "rebalancing" of mechs, hardpoints and alike.

[Sjorpha]

PhoenixFire55, on 26 June 2015 - 12:25 AM, said:

1. Until hit reg is 100% reliable for all weapons, all and any weapon/mech balancing changes are meaningless.

In other words all balancing changes in any online shooter ever is meaningless, because 100% reliable hitreg has never happened, for any weapon, and never will happen. Nice hyperbole

I like stricter division of players by ELO, but I'm not sure I like basing it on anything else than winning. Winning over time captures all aspects of performance as well, that is the whole point of the ELO formula. This new system might boost the elo of players who do lots of ineffective damage but are bad at winning matches, and it might punish players who win matches primarily by taking effective leadership. And so on.

So I hope that winning or losing is still the major factor in the calculation, because it is the most important one.

I also think dividing ELO by chassis and queue would do much more good than complicating the formula itself.

Rebalancing all mechs? All mechs? Really? Wow, that's gonna be...interesting. Probably frustrating as hell given all the mechs people bought for quirks. Hopefully they do it so well that those mechs remain useful choices...Happily many of my CW mechs aren't quirk based, only the thuds really. The others are just good chassis, so I'm probably not in for a disaster there. And many mechs might be improved too, fingers crossed for my beloved grasshoppers and cataphracts.

Edited by Sjorpha, 26 June 2015 - 12:52 AM.

[Love in an Annihilator]

PhoenixFire55, on 26 June 2015 - 12:25 AM, said:

- snip -

Ok, so I got a bad team, did all I could but still needed to carry harder and then my Elo will still go up, so I'll get an even worse team next time and will need to carry harder even harder?

- snip -

This. Really bad Idea.

Leave MM alone if you can't put Players with equal skill together.

Edited by Rick Sanchez 1895, 26 June 2015 - 12:52 AM.

[TexAce]

Team Chevy86, on 25 June 2015 - 10:00 PM, said:

Loose. Lose? I can't even.

You can't even what? Finish a sentence?

[PhoenixFire55]

Sjorpha, on 26 June 2015 - 12:46 AM, said:

In other words all balancing changes in any online shooter ever is meaningless, because 100% reliable hitreg has never happened, for any weapon, and never will happen. Nice hyperbole

MW4 had reliable hit reg. MWLL had reliable hit reg. 10 years ago when I was playing CS it had reliable hit reg. Please don't make excuses for inept PGI netcoders with your myths.

Sjorpha, on 26 June 2015 - 12:46 AM, said:

I also think dividing ELO by chassis and queue would do much more good than complicating the formula itself.

I think by queue you meant game modes. If so I agree, assault, conquest, skirmish, counter attack etc. can easily have separate Elo scores.

[TyphonCh]

Big Black Wolf, on 26 June 2015 - 01:16 AM, said:

You can't even what? Finish a sentence?

I can't even take this seriously when I see lose spelled as loose 3 times in one paragraph
Now if only that guy with the Oatmeal comic link in his sig would come along and help me out....

Edited by Team Chevy86, 26 June 2015 - 01:28 AM.

[Joseph Mallan]

XX Sulla XX, on 25 June 2015 - 10:01 PM, said:

Seems like they are trying to be more rational on how they do it. I hope it works. Also they said they are not going to make it live unless the community thinks its working or something along those lines. So better get the test client and get ready to test

Which Community I wonder? I remember we were dead set against 3PV and some other community group really wanted it.

Team Chevy86, on 26 June 2015 - 01:27 AM, said:

I can't even take this seriously when I see lose spelled as loose 3 times in one paragraph
Now if only that guy with the Oatmeal comic link in his sig would come along and help me out....

Then you cannot be taken seriously, cause you are to fixated on little shi...

Sarlic, on 25 June 2015 - 10:02 PM, said:

Who's in my ELO bucket?

I don't know man... that sounds like a Bucket List to me!

[PhoenixFire55]

I'm not sure what's worse, three grammatical mistakes in one post or a native english grammar {Godwin's Law} bigot who derails a perfectly valid discussion.

[Johnny Z]

Both things mentioned sound great. The ELO change sounds fairly simple but the rebalance sounds nearly impossible unless they keep whats in game and make a few changes. They will restart from nothing? Not sure how they will go about it but i wish them luck.

Balance isnt to bad at the moment minus a couple issues, looking forward to trying this all out. I hope it gets balanced then set in stone because like i said before and is well know by everyone as a common player sentiment, FOTM sucks and is cheap and many online games play it to keep players off balance and interested.

Edited by Johnny Z, 26 June 2015 - 01:40 AM.