43 replies to this topic

[DI3T3R]

Dear PGI

There have been tons of complaints about CW in the forum, there have been tons of suggestions in the forum how to save CW. And yet it seems that CW has no priority for you at all.

Taking into account the horribly outdated state your homepage is in, and taking into account that you sometimes release important news on social media intead of the forum, one might come to the conclusion that you don't actually care about the forum.
One might come to the conclusion that you don't really care about what bothers your playerbase/customers.
One might come to the conclusion that the "Feature Suggestions"-subforum exists solely to keep up the illusion that caring about MWO matters to you.

You seem more focused on adding more and more content instead of getting the game right the content is in.

My questions:
* What are your plans to attract more players to CW?
* What are your plans to lower wait-times in CW? (For example: The wait-time for public matches is 1-2 minutes for a 10-15-minute game. The wait-time for a CW-match is 5-15 minutes for a 25-30-minute game. This is simply unacceptable.)
* In the long term, are there changes planned to the principal mechanism of CW?
* If Yes, in which direction are those changes aimed?

with best regards,
a customer who took a long break from MWO because of CW and who would like to know whether he should bother coming back at all

[Darian DelFord]

DI3T3R, on 15 July 2015 - 03:48 AM, said:

Dear PGI

You seem more focused on adding more and more content instead of getting the game right the content is in.

We have content?

[Sjorpha]

Listen to the last town hall, Russ goes through all the features of CW phase 3 in some detail.

For example he talked about plans for the following:

Different systems for loyalists and mercs where mercs get their own reward ladder and loyalists get to vote for attack lanes and invest unit money into attracting mercs.

4v4 scouting missions fighting for intel dominance, gives abilities to teams in ongoing invasion matches such as radar sweeps and long tom artillery depending on the level of intel superiority. These will use modified public queue maps.

Special pool for lone wolf players with no faction, where thy can answer urgent calls to fill out CW teams on a one match basis.

Upgradable planet defences, starting with the ability to add more zones to the planet.

There was brief speculation about future rewards/advantages to owning planets, but that was quite sketchy.

...

Sadly there was nothing about implementing any sort of macro level strategy or end game, where taking planets are means to some grander end. That IMO is what is really missing in CW now, there isn't really any goal to fight for, as examplified by the current success of clan wolf to reach Terra, it ends with a big "and now what?" where nothing really happens.

Edited by Sjorpha, 15 July 2015 - 04:35 AM.

[Speedy Plysitkos]

they alrdy stated , they DONT care about forum comunity.

[XX Sulla XX]

CW is one of the main things they are working on now.

[Daelen Rottiger]

You better don't expect any huge changes - neither to the gameplay itself nor to CW.

[Johnny Z]

All I have to say is that I hope Mechwarrior Online isnt holding back content like:

- Pilot character creation

- Areas outside the mechbay to go because being stuck in a static 2D mechbay for 3 years as a player is on the edge of becoming abusive. (this may one day be a historical reference to early 2000's game making, what happened between Mechwarrior 2 and now??????????)

- ANY NPCS IN GAME AT ALL, THERE ARE NONE SO FAR

- Pilot eject animation

- ANY STORY WHAT SO EVER, BECAUSE THERE IS NONE YET, NONE. ( had to laugh here although I am trying to be serious.)

- Replacing the super ugly title screen that just says "piss off".

- ANY EXPANSION PACKS, there hasnt been one yet!!!!!!! extra exclamation marks for emphasis!!!!



If all these missing pieces is to make Star Citizen look better then OMG. Unless Star Citizens game design totally changes it going to be a ghost town in like 3 months after launch and games like Mechwarrior holding back for that, I just dont know what to say.

Again, I really really really hope this game isnt holding back content to make other games look better. It wont help and in fact may make everything appear worse because the incompetence becomes unignorable.

Edited by Johnny Z, 15 July 2015 - 05:32 AM.

[Darwins Dog]

The forums are a constant storm of bile and hatred. For every well thought out and reasonable discussion about balance and content suggestions, there are five about OPNERFPLZNAO!!!!11!1!!1!

There are employees who try to comb through them, but that's a full time job.

In short, no they don't care much about the forums, and I can't say I blame them.

[Aim64C]

Sjorpha, on 15 July 2015 - 04:29 AM, said:

Listen to the last town hall, Russ goes through all the features of CW phase 3 in some detail.

There's a reason I classified listening to Russ as an exercise in futility.

Quote

For example he talked about plans for the following:

Different systems for loyalists and mercs where mercs get their own reward ladder and loyalists get to vote for attack lanes and invest unit money into attracting mercs.

What is this "unit money" and where does it come from? The problem with CW is more in relation to the lack of community than it is anything else. Community Warfare is for organized, competitive teams and this doesn't change that. There's little reason for organized units to 'invest' their money in pugs and very little reason for pugs to drop into CW.

Quote

4v4 scouting missions fighting for intel dominance, gives abilities to teams in ongoing invasion matches such as radar sweeps and long tom artillery depending on the level of intel superiority. These will use modified public queue maps.

Another deathmatch. I'm going to piss myself with excitement.

Quote

Special pool for lone wolf players with no faction, where thy can answer urgent calls to fill out CW teams on a one match basis.

The reason why no one joins into the queue is not because they haven't joined a faction. It's because it is more efficient to play the 'standard game' and also less stressful as CW revolves around organized competition.

Quote

Upgradable planet defences, starting with the ability to add more zones to the planet.

Great... just what we were all asking for.... right?

Quote

There was brief speculation about future rewards/advantages to owning planets, but that was quite sketchy.

As was the whole thing.

Quote

...

Sadly there was nothing about implementing any sort of macro level strategy or end game, where taking planets are means to some grander end. That IMO is what is really missing in CW now, there isn't really any goal to fight for, as examplified by the current success of clan wolf to reach Terra, it ends with a big "and now what?" where nothing really happens.

The absolute first priority is a "friend" button.

Without such a basic thing, you simply don't have an "online" game. Even ******* card games on mobile phones have these and 'guild' mechanics where everyone beats up on a stupidly powerful card for rewards, or whatever.

Yet, in a game where I'm supposed to be part of some kind of organized team, I have to... I don't even know how to add someone as a friend. Someone sent me a friend request once, ages ago, and I accepted it. I don't think he/she/it has been online since a year ago, though. And that's just a failure of the gaming interface. We're thrown into games with a bunch of random yahoos and there's no way to say: "Hey, I liked that guy" or "Hey, that guy was new, but I want to drop with him a few times to help him learn."

Call me crazy... but before we do anything else, there needs to be a goddamned "friend" button.

Then we can add a "report" button or a "I experienced a technical issue within this match" button. Again, even phone games have this stuff.

[Bishop Steiner]

Titannium, on 15 July 2015 - 04:48 AM, said:

they alrdy stated , they DONT care about forum comunity.

*yawn* ya know, when you twist what is said, after a certain point, it becomes a lie.

Have they tuned some forum posters out, due to abject negativity on the posters side? Yes. Do they always answer forum posts, or "log in" to check them? No. HAve they said that the forums are not representative of the entire community? Yes. Which is a fact. (Though if the rest of the community can't be bothered to speak up, well, piss on em)

I know for a fact Russ reads them, because he has skewered me pretty hard about a few of my posts.

Hearing doesn't mean the same as Listening, and Listening does not alway involve Answering.

[Kiiyor]

Aim64C, on 15 July 2015 - 05:26 AM, said:

The absolute first priority is a "friend" button.

Call me crazy... but before we do anything else, there needs to be a goddamned "friend" button.

But... there is? You... you click on "add friend" and...

I do it all the time! It's there!

The only issue I have is that you have to friend people before you block them.

[Johnny Z]

Darwins Dog, on 15 July 2015 - 05:25 AM, said:

The forums are a constant storm of bile and hatred. For every well thought out and reasonable discussion about balance and content suggestions, there are five about OPNERFPLZNAO!!!!11!1!!1!

There are employees who try to comb through them, but that's a full time job.

In short, no they don't care much about the forums, and I can't say I blame them.

Troll much? The only one talking bile and hatred here is you.

Oops, i think the troll got me. He did didnt he.

Edited by Johnny Z, 15 July 2015 - 05:54 AM.

[JudgeDeathCZ]

Aim64C, on 15 July 2015 - 05:26 AM, said:

What is this "unit money" and where does it come from? The problem with CW is more in relation to the lack of community than it is anything else. Community Warfare is for organized, competitive teams and this doesn't change that. There's little reason for organized units to 'invest' their money in pugs and vsery little reason for pugs to drop into CW.

The reason why no one joins into the queue is not because they haven't joined a faction. It's because it is more efficient to play the 'standard game' and also less stressful as CW revolves around organized competition.

Now tell me if we rly play same game...ppl do not play cw bcuz it is worthless...and I mean WORTHLESS.
What is advantage of owning planet?None.0.Zero.Nada.Nothing...
Then why should I play CW?Almost no1 play CW and even big units do not give a single **** if they get/lose planet.No1 does except.hardcore BT wannabe fans.You will not gtn anything special for it xcept loayality points which are in the end worthless too bcuz it takes ages to grind...and you can not grind if no1 plays CW.
Most ppl play CW only during events and last event was not even worth playing....for 250/150k cbills,some gxp and few cockpit items LOL wtf?I did not played a single match even if my unit ended 3rd in Kurita leaderboard I think.Just NOT WORTH.

Conclusion is that you get more xp/gxp/cbills in normal games for same time in CW which means no1 play CW...it is not rewarding enough

Edited by JudgeDeathCZ, 15 July 2015 - 06:13 AM.

[Burktross]

They're working on a huge balance update, currently. Don't rush it! Cross your fingers, lads!

JudgeDeathCZ, on 15 July 2015 - 06:13 AM, said:

Now tell me if we rly play same game...ppl do not play cw bcuz it is worthless...and I mean WORTHLESS.
What is advantage of owning planet?None.0.Zero.Nada.Nothing...
Then why should I play CW?Almost no1 play CW and even big units do not give a single **** if they get/lose planet.No1 does except.hardcore BT wannabe fans.You will not gtn anything special for it xcept loayality points which are in the end worthless too bcuz it takes ages to grind...and you can not grind if no1 plays CW.
Most ppl play CW only during events and last event was not even worth playing....for 250/150k cbills,some gxp and few cockpit items LOL wtf?I did not played a single match even if my unit ended 3rd in Kurita leaderboard I think.Just NOT WORTH.

Conclusion is that you get more xp/gxp/cbills in normal games for same time in CW which means no1 play CW...it is not rewarding enough

Jesus.... I hurt from reading that.
I mean I can't disagree.
But Jesus.... please!

[PurpleNinja]

I wonder what would happen if PGI molded MWO following ALL the instructions the player base gave to the then.

[Johnny Z]

PurpleNinja, on 15 July 2015 - 06:17 AM, said:

I wonder what would happen if PGI molded MWO following ALL the instructions the player base gave to the then.

From legit players? Then players would get a Fallout 4 or Cyberpunk 2077, but even better in its own way because of the best large battles and fighting and persistent galaxy in Mechwarrior Online. After saying that I really hope Fallout 4 and Cyberpunk 2077 and Mechwarrior Online for that matter, dont let me down, but it looks good so far.

Fallout 4 includes many of the best mods for Fallout 3 from whats been shown so far.

Edited by Johnny Z, 15 July 2015 - 06:37 AM.

[Sir Wulfrick]

PurpleNinja, on 15 July 2015 - 06:17 AM, said:

I wonder what would happen if PGI molded MWO following ALL the instructions the player base gave to the then.

There would be a quantum fail singularity which would create a black hole, sucking in and destroying the entire solar system!

While I think it's somewhat reprehensible that the official MWO forum is the last place at which any serious announcements are made, I can absolutely understand why more PGI employees don't visit or take part in the forums. This is not a community that is in any way respectful to the dev team. It's interesting for me to juxtapose this forum with the forum for another game that I enjoy playing where the forum community is highly respectful: in that instance the dev team are regular commenters and frequently take part...

[Necromantion]

PurpleNinja, on 15 July 2015 - 06:17 AM, said:

I wonder what would happen if PGI molded MWO following ALL the instructions the player base gave to the then.

We would be left with a top scrolling mini game where you had 1 attack and could only use 5 keys.

[Wronka]

I don't get it, I think the game has come a long way in the last year since I started. Lots of great improvements/additions I heard people asking for have arrived and many more on the way. I seem to like where the game is at and enjoy playing it, for the most part.

Then again, I do not take part in CW, and that seems where a lot of this hatred for this game comes from for most.

Edited by Wronka, 15 July 2015 - 06:45 AM.

[Mawai]

Just a couple of comments

1) Russ has apparently said he ignores the forums due to the attitudes that some players have when posting here and due to the time required to follow them in any detail. Supposedly someone at PGI is (the community manager?) is intended to keep an eye on the forums ... but I can see little or no sign of this except in the "Developer Outreach" forum where they want to gather some additional information. Bottom line ... don't hold your breath that anything typed in the general forum will ever be read and absorbed by anyone at PGI. (Either way ... even if PGI does follow the forums in some way ... the lack of interaction has certainly left the impression that they ignore it).

2) PGI has a microscopic development team as far as these things go ... probably about 6 engineers are responsible for everything from UI to gameplay to features (not art work) which includes CW, pilot trees, PVE, HSR, hit registration, netcode ... anything and everything that might be on their development wish list. What this means is that, even at the best of times, development proceeds at a glacial pace from an external perspective. It isn't their fault ... they just don't have very many people working on it.

3) PGI would not intentional hold any features back to make someone else's product look better ... that is just a mind boggling idea ... they just don't have enough staff to develop all of these in a timely way so they prioritize.

4) For those who love CW ... REMEMBER ... CW does not appeal to everyone. In fact, it may not appeal to all that many people since it appears to prefer large unit membership and group drops, ties you down to a faction, takes longer to play a match, takes longer to queue for a match ... and honestly, has limited additional lasting impact ... except for changing system ownership on a big map. If you don't really care about the lore ... perhaps just like playing MWO .. then CW really offers nothing more than a limited respawn game mode with slightly different victory conditions and different maps. Some folks probably play CW out of sheer boredom with the regular maps and game modes.

If you dropped the CW game mode and maps into the PUG queue ... I am not sure how many CW players would be left who would want to fight specifically for a glowing pixel on a map.

... and this is part of the problem with CW ... it has low populations because it splits the player base and has higher entry requirements. There will always be fewer players in CW than the PUG queues due to the barriers to entry.

There are three ways to increase CW participation:
1) Recruit a vast number of new players who stick with the game, collect mechs and buy modules so that they can properly outfit a full drop deck for CW. (As a side note ... I have been playing since closed beta and I do NOT have enough duplicate modules to outfit a full CW drop deck ... and who wants to play a game mode like that which takes additional time with even a small disadvantage?).
2) Offer very high rewards for playing CW which make it worthwhile even if you lose miserably to a 12 man. This might attract more players to CW by making it worth their time. At the moment, CW rewards fewer cbills on average than the three or four regular matches that can be played in the same time frame.
3) Reduce the barriers to entry in some way. Make the game mode more friendly to the average PUG player. However, I have read posts from CW players insisting that they don't want a bunch of random PUGs "spoiling" CW ... dropping in trials because they don't have a full drop deck, etc. ... though without making the game mode more accessible ... I think the CW population will remain low.


Some things that might make CW more accessible:

- allow multiple copies of modules to be fitted to a CW drop deck ... you need to own one ... but can then fit it to any or all of the CW drop deck mechs. For example, radar derp is 6mill, seismic is 6mill ... for a 4 mech drop deck this is 24 mill which is a substantial barrier for newer players.
- increase CW cbill awards to be consistent with the time required for the matches ... maybe add a queuing bonus so that the longer you are in the queue waiting for a match .. the larger your bonus rewards.
- adjust the CW matchmaker so that it tries to match 12v12 and small group/solo vs small group/solo ... try to avoid the mismatched cases of large groups against random disorganized players ... these are less fun for both sides.

I am sure that there are lots of other ideas out there but no matter what happens CW will always have a lower population than the public queues.

(Note: the introduction of European and Asian servers may result in a significant split in the player base and even longer queue times in both PUG and CW matches (I don't know if they are splitting CW)).