17 replies to this topic

[Zepheran]

Hey guys, so I only have 3 games left until I finish my first 25 and I was hoping to get some advice on what mech to build first. I enjoy 2 different play style, fast a mobile medium to long range mechs. Or just extremely long range sniper type mechs. Any advice?

[GroxGlitch]

It sounds like, on the Clan end of things, the Stormcrow is your bird. It's a 55 ton medium, it moves fast and can pack in a very respectable combination of firepower and armor. Of course, with the Clan ER weaponry you have an extended engagement range, but you really do have to be mindful of your heat, especially if you're running laser-heavy; the SCR can have up to 13 energy weapon hardpoints but there is NO WAY you can stuff enough heat sinks in to effectively use all of them so don't fall prey to 'fill the hardpoints syndrome'.

In the IS category, the Cicadas can fulfil a mobile med-long range mech, they're just a touch squishy (think of them as an oversized Jenner in a way). Blackjacks, as I recall, are not EXTREMELY fast but a few mount jump jets and can bring notable mid-long firepower to the field. Centurions, built correctly, can be surprisingly fast and pack a respectable punch, especially if you run an XL engine in them, though their survivability suffers for that.

Otherwise, not much I can tell you; I'm primarily a Clan player so I have limited knowledge on the IS side; I'm currently expanding my IS roster myself, so I'm working with somewhat dated knowledge from pre-Clans.

If you'd like some help with builds just hit me up and I'll throw a few your way! See you on the battlefield.

EDIT: I should mention all of these are Medium mechs, for the record.

Edited by GroxGlitch, 31 July 2015 - 09:26 AM.

[Anunknownlurker]

For long range sniping it's still hard to beat a Raven 3L with ECM and 2 ERLLs. If you played the trial Raven 3L(C) then any experience you got on that will carry over if you buy the normal Raven 3L. Alternatively, I enjoy the Cicada 3M armed with 1 ERL and 3MLs and ECM.

Both those suggestions rely on speed so you'll need to spend your C-bills on big engines (XL295 for the Raven, XL330 for Cicada).

Another alternative would be the Hunchback (yes, EVERYONE will say that!) but all the chassis give you experience in different weapons and playstyles.

On the Horde...sorry...Clan side I am not so good as my favourites are Wave III which you can only get for real money at the moment, or the Nova which is a hard mech to get good results in (in my opinion). But...

Adders do well at long range with ERPPCs, a bit slow for my tastes but I've seen good results with them. The Stormcrow is the fast medium of choice for most Clan players and cannot be recommended enough (again if you played the trial SCR then the exp will carry over); but it is very "meta" and that comes with drawbacks such as a massive target over its head!

I am sure others will make their suggestions and you should listen to them, check out youtube and Twitch to see other mechs at play, also, were there any particular mechs you met in your first 25 games that seemed either hard-hitting, tough or looked fun to play? That may be something to look at too.

Good hunting and welcome to MWO!

[stealthraccoon]

Hunchback or Raven - clan-tech is for city folk who don't know how to drive a clutch!

[happy mech]

hello, i think the 3 ravens are a very solid choice to try all roles a fast mech can do, but require xl engines (though the one coming with 3L can be used)

for more firepower, blackjacks are good, can use a standard 200 engine too, or high xl (235, 275, 280, 295) for speed if you use energy weapons

and hunchback offers everything, with std engines (200, 245, 250), twisting like no other mech, but a little less range

and definitely play the trial mechs to test , also observe the matches

[Rear Admiral Tier 6]

+ 1 for hunchbacks

start with 4P,move on to 4G and 4J later.

HBK-4P

this is a solid starter build

[Elizander]

This might be rough, but you can keep grinding with the Trials and spot for a clan mech like a Stormcrow or Timberwolf. They are pricey but they are more flexible if you are unsure of what you want.

If you still have some patience left, keep playing until 12-15m c-bills then decide.

[Rogue Jedi]

what is your idea of fast, if 80 kph is OK any Medium Mech can do that sort of speed, as can all the Clan heavies, if you want 100+ that would narrow down your choices a bit.

I would usualy recommend IS Mediums, all the 50/55 tonners can be made to fit your criteria, and I agree with many of the other posters that the Hunchback is probably the best choice, being relatively inexpensive to purchase and upgrade, including Double Heat Sinks, and Endo Steel Internals on all with a standard 250 engine for the first, which can be swopped between all later Hunchbacks (figure needing an extra 3.5 million on top of initial purchase to upgrade the first, then 2 million for upgrades on subsequent Hunchbacks)

you buy this
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...79cb1883e8f7bdd
then perform upgrades ^{(Double Heat Sinks, Endo Steel and if enough space is left also Fero Fibrus armor)}, change engine, ^{(and with the 4G upgrade the small laser in the head to a Medium)} and add more ammo to get this
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...b213095a363de17
I used my favorite the 4G but it works more or less the same with all Hunchback variants, the Hunchbacks have great quirks for there stock primary weapons so do not need much tweaking, of course as you get used to the Mech you may want to make more changes to get them to fit your preferred play style.

Mechs I would steer clear of as your first Mech include any assault ^{(most are far too reliant on teamwork)}, the Timber Wolf and Stormcrow ^{(because being 2 of the best available Mechs they will not teach you good habits, and are high priority targets)}, and most lights ^{(because they will die to 1 good hit, it may prove rather frustrating learning on them, but when you have a bit more experience Lights are the most fun Mechs, but also the hardest to do well in)}

if you want a sniper of long range fire support platform the best are:
the Jagermech, an IS 65tonner with high mounted balistic hardpoints and enough tonnage to take 2 big ballistics, provided you use an XL engine, which means if you loose 1 side torso you loose the Mech
the Blackjack, 45 ton IS Mech, the Jagermechs little brother, only tonnage for 1 large ballistic, and almost enough tonnage to take 2 small ballistics, provided you are willing to make some compromises elsewhere
tie Dire Wolf, able to mount overwhelming long range firepower but the slowest and least maneuverable Mech in the game, so not a good idea unless you know you will have friends to protect you.

visit http://mwo.smurfy-net.de/mechlab and look at a variety of Mechs, see if you can put together something which looks good, that will let you know exactly how much something will cost, that site has a lot of information available and it is taken directly from the games files, and updated after every patch ^{(usualy within an hour)}

Edited by Rogue Jedi, 31 July 2015 - 02:15 PM.

[Koniving]

Welcome to MWO.

Koniving here, naturally I would suggest any of the following mechs and remember you can change their engines: Note that they are in the order of recommendation (with many considerations including ease of use and overall expenses necessary to get it off the ground and competitive).

Hunchback, Griffin / Wolverine, Centurion, Kintaro, Shadowhawk, Trebuchet.

If the Enforcer is available for cbills as well, it'd be below Centurion but above Kintaro.

For Griffin, 3M. For Wolverine, 7K. For Kintaro, KTO 20. Shadowhawk, 5M.

Hunchback, any. Centurion, any. Treb; the 7K is my personal favorite.

Whatever you choose, expect the road to be interesting.

(Edit: Fixed a typo there is no 7M).

Edited by Koniving, 01 August 2015 - 03:52 AM.

[Bruce13F4O]

+1 for hunchbacks, or if you need something with jumpjets the shadowhawk would be a good choice, regardless of what you buy you will still need money for upgrades. That includes armor, structure, and engines. I would suggest you buy one xl engine and rotate them through your three inner sphere chasis if thats the route you want to take. I would suggest that you pick one or two aspects that you are comfortable with and stick with it. Otherwise you'll end up buying and selling mechs which will cost you playtime and Cbills.

[bar10jim]

If I had it to do over again, I'd go with the Hunchie. Most people recommend the -G (AC20, 3x mLas), but I recommend the -H (AC10, 4x mLas). More ammo + better quirks for the mLas. Check out MechSpecs for build ideas, and practice your own builds on Smurfy.

[Leone]

My suggestion would be to get on smurfy and check out build options on each of the above mentioned chassis up there. Just run through Konivings list of mechs and see if anything pops out. Then, once you think you know what you want, you can come back, post your build, and we can discus whether or not another mech could do it better. For instance, I'm a fan of the shadowhawk, but Koniving has it low on the list because while they make excellent AC platforms, the wolverine has one variant that's got great quirks for Ac 5s (which are decent ranged weapons in my book, which is why I bring it up. If your thinking about building a snipey medium you could do worse. It's no gauss, but I still love IS ac 5s and uac 5s.)

At least, I think it's why the Shadowhawks lower, could also be hardpoints. As for the Hunchbacks, they are a great mech, and on sale, but I'm not sure they'd be the best option for ya. I don't exactly consider them the best snipers, or the most mobile mediums. Honestly, I'd take Koniving's word over mine here though.

Now that's IS side of things. In CW I play alotta clan mechs, and for a begginer, I'd hafta say you could do worse than starting with the Ryoken (Stormcrow). The nice thing about that mech is the sheer build options you have by swapping omni-pods. Inner Sphere mechs generally do one thing better. Clan mechs just have a huge variety of options available to them.

~Leone

Edited by Leone, 31 July 2015 - 03:31 PM.

[Koniving]

Leone, on 31 July 2015 - 03:28 PM, said:

For instance, I'm a fan of the shadowhawk, but Koniving has it low on the list because while they make excellent AC platforms, the wolverine has one variant that's got great quirks for Ac 5s (which are decent ranged weapons in my book, which is why I bring it up. If your thinking about building a snipey medium you could do worse. It's no gauss, but I still love IS ac 5s and uac 5s.)

At least, I think it's why the Shadowhawks lower, could also be hardpoints.

Actually it isn't the quirks that got the Wolverines bumped up, its the size (shortest 55 tonner in MWO) combined with hitboxes, peripheral vision, lower focus on expensive ballistic weaponry for most of its variants makes it much cheaper to outfit. This, and in general the Wolverine is often (foolishly) ignored, where a Shadowhawk will get everyone's attention much akin to Dug the dog to squirrels.



The Shadowhawk lacks peripheral vision which robs a newer player of any hints of being flanked (not an issue with seismic sensors but what new player can afford 6 mil for one sensor?). It is the tallest mech, and while its hit boxes are tight the arms are not as capable of (deliberately) absorbing the impacts as well as a Griffin or Wolverine's arms. Lowest torso twist range of ~All~ medium mechs. Also, poor jump capability, I have trouble hitting light mechs at point blank range (due to not being able to aim down enough with the ballistics) and I've always had an issue with losing legs.

Wolverines favor firing rates, shorter beam times, reduced heat and sometimes extended range. Wolverine right arms can tank an additional 18 damage after the armor is gone (that is compared to any other 55 tonner). Griffins feature increased energy-based ballistic (PPC) velocity and faster firing rates as well as faster turns.

That isn't to say the Shadowhawks are without merit. In general I've noticed their quirks favor range. For example increased ballistic velocity on all Shadowhawks allows them to be better suited for longer range engagements. They can turn faster than Wolverines (5% faster) but are actually 5% slower than Griffins. Shadowhawks have high mounted primary weapon hardpoints akin to the Hunchback, (though they lack the Hunchback's ability to shoot almost behind itself).

Now against the Griffin and Wolverine: The right-side focus of both the Griffin and Wolverine were weighed against them. This focus which general has most of their weapons on a single side makes them susceptible to being neutered (having all main weapons removed). Wolverine cannot see anything within 20 meters of its front torso if the target is shorter than 11 meters, but it can still attack it. Griffin has no visual hindrances but unlike the Wolverine it cannot aim as far down. The Wolverine cannot aim as far horizontally as the Griffin can. Both get equal numbers of jumpjets -- though this is a merit rather than a flaw as they get so many. Both have useless left arms in ALL non-hero variants; something which I consider to be a flaw compared to the Shadowhawks which at least get some left arm use.

Shadowhawk definitely makes a superior long range mech. I just feel that Griffins / Wolverines make better new player mechs (and definitely better brawlers; more on the Wolverine. Griffin's kinda the in-between).

(Kintaro scored low because of the additional costs it often has to get it started such as removing ferro before putting on endo, and the advanced player knowledge necessary such as Missile Door controls [closed = 10% more torso armor, open removes this but allows missiles to fire right away instead of with a delay] and the somewhat obstructed view). Kintaro is actually my favorite 55 tonner. It just sadly is ~not~ new player friendly.

Quote

Honestly, I'd take Koniving's word over mine here though.

Thanks for the awesome praise. But never devalue your own word, after all you do often have good ideas and I've never seen you steer someone wrong.

Edited by Koniving, 31 July 2015 - 04:26 PM.

[Leone]

Oh, don't worry, it's not that I devalue my opinions, it's just that, in this case, I figured you'd put more thought into/had a larger pool of mech experience to pull from. As shown by the above post. I might've signed up for this game back in beta, but I only got a computer to run it this year. Of medium IS mechs, I only have the Wolverine, Hunchback and Shadowhawk. And, despite initial frustrations with the Shadowhawk hardpoints, it ended up being my favourite of the three. But then, I love my IS ACs.

So, I offered my opinion, with caveat. Thanks for the vote of confidence though. And Zepheran, good luck, hope which ever you choose works for ya.

~Leone.

Edited by Leone, 31 July 2015 - 06:15 PM.

[dragnier1]

Koniving, on 31 July 2015 - 02:03 PM, said:

Welcome to MWO.

Koniving here, naturally I would suggest any of the following mechs and remember you can change their engines: Note that they are in the order of recommendation (with many considerations including ease of use and overall expenses necessary to get it off the ground and competitive).

Hunchback, Griffin / Wolverine, Centurion, Kintaro, Shadowhawk, Trebuchet.

If the Enforcer is available for cbills as well, it'd be below Centurion but above Kintaro.

For Griffin, 3M. For Wolverine, 7M. For Kintaro, KTO 20. Shadowhawk, 5M.

Hunchback, any. Centurion, any. Treb; the 7K is my personal favorite.

Whatever you choose, expect the road to be interesting.

I suggest setting aside about 1.5 mil cbills (or save up that amount) for endo-steel and double heat sink upgrades. Medium mechs don't have that much weight to mount many weapons and heat sinks at the same time, so the extra performance from double heat sinks would help. The additional weight savings from endo-steel would come in handy too.

Do note that endo takes up 14 internal space which means less space for weapons/ammo/heat sinks. DHS (double heat sinks) performs at 1.4 cooling (1.68 with expert tier skills completed), not @ double despite the name description.

[Rhavin]

Hunchback is probably the best choice, it would be a shame if you missed the sale that ended on them today, if so still not an insurmountable cost to grab and elite 3 of them. While not really the fastest of mechs, across its many variations there is not a role you can't make a build to fill. Of the original 4 mechs this game started with it is still a beast and an AC 20 round to the face will make even the best assault pilot think about where you are. It Doesn't need an xl engine, just needs some double heat sinks. Really straight up the easiest mech to build and learn on. PROTECT YOUR HUNCH!! I put that in caps because it is the thing I see most new pilots who choose this mech fail to do. Good luck man.

[Koniving]

dragnier1, on 31 July 2015 - 07:13 PM, said:

I suggest setting aside about 1.5 mil cbills (or save up that amount) for endo-steel and double heat sink upgrades. Medium mechs don't have that much weight to mount many weapons and heat sinks at the same time, so the extra performance from double heat sinks would help. The additional weight savings from endo-steel would come in handy too.

Do note that endo takes up 14 internal space which means less space for weapons/ammo/heat sinks. DHS (double heat sinks) performs at 1.4 cooling (1.68 with expert tier skills completed), not @ double despite the name description.

With the specified Wolverine 7k, Griffin 3M, Shadowhawk 5M, and Kintaro 20, the double heatsink part is already solved. (Such is part of why they scored so high on the list; but even that couldn't outdo how well the HBK performs for new and even clueless players). Most of those also come with XL engines (kintaro doesn't) at a reasonable discount, too, at a size that is compatible with the Hunchbacks (275).

On the heatsinks: DHS manually added to the mech cools at a rate of 1.4 per second per sink (no unlocks). DHS that come with the engine (example 8 for a 200 engine, 10 for a 250 engine, 6 for a 150 engine) are 2.0. More interestingly, after elite unlocks 17 DHS comes out to 3.43 heat/sec. (Straight 2.0 DHS would be 17*2/10 = 3.4 heat/sec). After 18 DHS you're just overdoing it rather than min/maxing it.
--------------
And here's how to wreck someone's day as a Hunchback.
4P

4G

External 4G view (filmed by a commando)

^The very first time I made this build, I went into this fight and wrecked this many faces with the "2nd, 4th, and 5th ~worst weapons~ in the game" according to many 'meta competition players'. To them I say Pffft! Meta means nothing.

[Narcissistic Martyr]

Hunchback 4G. Hunchback 4P. Huchback 4J.

These 3 allow you to try dakka, laser vomit, and LRM/SRM spam while not making you a massive target.

Alternatively Shadowhawks are pretty baller.