73 replies to this topic

[Lorian Sunrider]

Comstar was a bunch of douchbags outside of Tukayyid. Even before WoB.

I can't help but feel like if they get put in as a faction IS and Clan will still hate each other, but they both agree "**** Comstar".

[Steinar Bergstol]

Escef, on 01 September 2015 - 05:13 AM, said:

Per lore, PPCs and LRMs do full damage under minimum range, even Inner Sphere LRMs. You just have a to-hit penalty.

And the minimum ranges are a problem in such a "small" enclosed space (particularly for the LRMs which have a minimum range of 6 hexes, or 180 meters). With a cumulative +1 penalty to the to-hit-roll for each hex you were within the minimum range a Griffin would have a penalty of 6 on 2d6 before _any_ other considerations to hit a target in the hex in front of it). The minimum range on the PPC is a slightly more forgiving 3 hexes.

There is also, however, the fact that according to TT rules Big Guns like the PPC were less than optimal for taking out infantry because a blast from a PPC would kill 1 soldier in a 28 man squad. Granted, that 1 soldier would be _REALLY_ effin' dead, but that still leaves his 27 friends (in the theoretical event that a full squad made it into the throneroom) to riddle the Archon with bullets. What you wanted in order to deal with infantry was weapons like machineguns and flamers, which would kill off multiple members of the infantry squad per shot. That's the reason mechs like the Vulcan and Firestarter were classed as anti-infantry mechs.

[jss78]

Lorian Sunrider, on 01 September 2015 - 06:55 AM, said:

Comstar was a bunch of douchbags outside of Tukayyid. Even before WoB.

I can't help but feel like if they get put in as a faction IS and Clan will still hate each other, but they both agree "**** Comstar".

Doesn't ComStar's initial policy make a kind of sense though? Safeguard the HPG Network as the crucial backbone of the interstellar civilization, and guarantee the necessary military superiority to see that task through. One could argue that the later miserable history of the successor states proved ComStar's stance right.

That ComStar, or a faction thereof, later developed into a batsh*t crazy cult, now that's another matter altogether.

It's kind of analogous to how the West is trying to prevent Iran and North Korea from developing nukes, yet we consider it within our rights to have them ourselves. There's an obvious double standard, but we simply don't trust them to not do great harm, should they possess that technology.

[Steinar Bergstol]

Comstar under Jerome Blake was actually an okay organization. It was only when Conrad Toyama succeeded Blake as Primus that they turned into a fanatical bunch of toaster worshippers who mixed mysticism with technology and actively worked to decrease the level of technology in the Inner Sphere through blackmail, espionage, sabotage, assassination and in some cases mass murder (see the actions of a certain Comstar ROM agent in the Gray Death trilogy where he basically murders an entire colony by destroying its atmospheric bubble simply to frame the Gray Death Legion so they'd be out of his way on Helm where a Star League memory core was located).

More or less until Tukayyid and the rise of Anastasius Focht as Precentor Martial which allowed him to force reforms Comstar basically _was_ the Word of Blake.

[Lorian Sunrider]

And how do you defend Comstar actively working for/with the Clans to betray the Inner Sphere until they realized that the Clans wanted Terra and wouldn't back down from that?

Not only did they deliberately slow down information coming from worlds under attack, especially in the first wave, they helped the Clans run the planets after!

[Kubernetes]

Steinar Bergstol, on 01 September 2015 - 12:10 AM, said:

Interesting, really, that the Lyrans chose Griffins, a mech known for carrying only long distance weapons (a PPC and an LRM rack) as the throne room guards when the most likely attacker in a throne room would probably be infantry rather than armor or mechs, and the distances involved in most thronerooms would suggest short range anti infantry weapons would be preferable.

Lol, I was thinking the exact same thing. Maybe the throne room door is exactly 90m from their guard position.

[CycKath]

Lorian Sunrider, on 01 September 2015 - 08:32 AM, said:

And how do you defend Comstar actively working for/with the Clans to betray the Inner Sphere until they realized that the Clans wanted Terra and wouldn't back down from that?

The same way a Combine fan would defend the Kentares Massacre or a Smoke Jaguar would defend Turtle Bay, badly, so I won't.

[Lorian Sunrider]

CycKath, on 01 September 2015 - 01:02 PM, said:

The same way a Combine fan would defend the Kentares Massacre or a Smoke Jaguar would defend Turtle Bay, badly, so I won't.

Seems like there are a lot of douchbags in the Battletech universe. Maybe that's why everyone wants to kill each other lol.

[Tincan Nightmare]

Steinar Bergstol, on 01 September 2015 - 12:10 AM, said:

Interesting, really, that the Lyrans chose Griffins, a mech known for carrying only long distance weapons (a PPC and an LRM rack) as the throne room guards when the most likely attacker in a throne room would probably be infantry rather than armor or mechs, and the distances involved in most thronerooms would suggest short range anti infantry weapons would be preferable.

I Guess the Lyrans og for a "Go Big or Go Home" philosophy for their thronerooms as well for this to make sense.

"Archon! The enemy has breached the entrance door to the throne room! They'll be at the steps to the throne in six hours at the latest!"

If I remember correctly, those Griffins were unique variants that mounted SRM's and lasers, instead of the typical LRM's and PPC's most Griffin variants carried. Still would have been more logical to mount some mg's or flamers (or just have 2 Firestarters or Vulcans as the guards), but they at least had weapons that could be used up close.

[Alex Morgaine]

Maybe unofficial model units with (obviously rare) lpl unit and 3 steak 2s? They were the royal guards after all, nothing says they had to be stock.

[slide]

In one of the Novels (can't remember which, Warrior Trilogy probably) I am sure they described the Archons throne room mechs as being Zeus's.

Also as a qualified mech pilot wouldn't Katrina have been able to use one of the mechs to escape in?

[Steinar Bergstol]

slide, on 01 September 2015 - 09:32 PM, said:

In one of the Novels (can't remember which, Warrior Trilogy probably) I am sure they described the Archons throne room mechs as being Zeus's.

Also as a qualified mech pilot wouldn't Katrina have been able to use one of the mechs to escape in?

I can't remember them ever being described as anything other than Griffins, but it's been a long time since I read the Warrior books. And yes, Katrina (the real one, not the psycho granddaughter) was a qualified mech pilot, so assuming the neurohelmet was tuned to her in the first Place. If it was tuned to another pilot she would take piloting penalties(-4 according to the TT rules I believe, and if you try to pilot a mech without the neurohelmet at all the penalty rises to -8 to piloting and -4 to gunnery. Both of these on a 2d6 roll, which makes them rather significant penalties). Tuning the system to a pilot is, apparently, not something which can be done on the fly.

[Zacharias McLeod]

Steinar Bergstol, on 01 September 2015 - 12:10 AM, said:

Interesting, really, that the Lyrans chose Griffins, a mech known for carrying only long distance weapons (a PPC and an LRM rack) as the throne room guards when the most likely attacker in a throne room would probably be infantry rather than armor or mechs, and the distances involved in most thronerooms would suggest short range anti infantry weapons would be preferable.

I Guess the Lyrans og for a "Go Big or Go Home" philosophy for their thronerooms as well for this to make sense.

"Archon! The enemy has breached the entrance door to the throne room! They'll be at the steps to the throne in six hours at the latest!"

Kubernetes, on 01 September 2015 - 09:05 AM, said:

Lol, I was thinking the exact same thing. Maybe the throne room door is exactly 90m from their guard position.

This are not the GRF-1N this are the GRF-1S.

GRF-1S
The 1S Griffin was for many years the only production variant of the Griffin, built for House Steiner by Defiance Industries starting in 2857. It attempted to rectify the 1N's lack of close range weapons by removing the PPC and in its place mounting a Large Laserand two Medium Lasers. The LRM-10 was also replaced with an LRM-5 and one ton of reloads in the right torso. To further help manage the heat load, the 'Mech also added four additional heat sinks to the design. This new arraignment essentially transformed the long-range support 'Mech into a medium-range brawler.

You can see the LRM-5 on the picture too.

Edited by Zacharias McLeod, 05 September 2015 - 01:49 AM.

[Spr1ggan]

Steinar Bergstol, on 01 September 2015 - 12:10 AM, said:

Interesting, really, that the Lyrans chose Griffins, a mech known for carrying only long distance weapons (a PPC and an LRM rack) as the throne room guards when the most likely attacker in a throne room would probably be infantry rather than armor or mechs, and the distances involved in most thronerooms would suggest short range anti infantry weapons would be preferable.

I Guess the Lyrans og for a "Go Big or Go Home" philosophy for their thronerooms as well for this to make sense.

"Archon! The enemy has breached the entrance door to the throne room! They'll be at the steps to the throne in six hours at the latest!"

Iirc PPC's would do reduced damage at close range but it would still be damage, not the 0 damage we have in MWO. So any people breaking in there would still likely be vaporised by PPC shots. And don't forget melee, those Griffins have hands and feet.

But yeah their purpose looks to be more ceremonial than practical.

Edited by Spr1ggan, 05 September 2015 - 09:31 AM.