127 replies to this topic

[XxXAbsolutZeroXxX]

LordBraxton, on 10 August 2015 - 06:26 AM, said:

I just know that all builds belong in the deathball. Just stick right behind your teammates and deathball to win. Zeratul, you clearly don't know how to play MWO, because nothing is useful 100s of meters away in MWO, much less 1000s... you cant even shoot past 1300 with gauss... and even then a lone mech is always useless. Be ashamed. Don't abandon your deathball. Ever.

Flanking lights that split from their teams and hit LRM boats and other mechs from behind can do some damage.

Light snipers that scout, tag and lock targets for LRM's can be useful and provide enough support to influence the outcome of the game.

I see plenty of deathballing teams lose to split teams. There are advantages and disadvantages to both.

[Alistair Winter]

LordBraxton, on 10 August 2015 - 06:26 AM, said:

Im going to stop using the word sniper because its dirty. 'Precision builds,' like dual gauss are GREAT! This has nothing to do with mech builds. I just know that all builds belong in the deathball. Just stick right behind your teammates and deathball to win. Zeratul, you clearly don't know how to play MWO, because nothing is useful 100s of meters away in MWO, much less 1000s... you cant even shoot past 1300 with gauss... and even then a lone mech is always useless. Be ashamed. Don't abandon your deathball. Ever.

Alright, stop. Bullet time.

• Gauss rifle has 660 meter range. You get a 10% range bonus with modules. You get a 20% range bonus with the JM6-A. You have full damage with dual gauss at 858 meters. So you're right, it's not thousands of meters. It's not 1300 meters. But engaging the enemy at ~900 meters is fine.
  
• Every match is different, not every match leads to an immediate brawl. Sometimes one side is pinned down and unable to close the distance, while the other side maintains a range advantage. In this case, long range firepower is a huge asset and sniping can soften up the enemy before they are either forced to push or too weak to push.
  
• Symbiotic defense is nice, but suppressing fire is better. If you can stop the enemy from daring to reveal themself in numbers, this usually forces them to pop out of cover 1 by 1, which makes them easier targets. Effective long range fire has this effect. I think we've all seen this on Alpine or Canyon network.
  
• Gauss sniping Shadowcats are much more valuable for suppression than being part of some deathball to absorb damage. They don't need to stay close to any deathballs either. Pinning down enemy mechs and forcing them to stay in cover is very valuable. It sets up flanking attacks, for example.

[Rhaythe]

"Your playing style is different from mine, so it's bad and you're bad. It wouldn't be a problem if you played the game exactly like I do."

[Cerberias]

Quote

Back on topic; snipers exist in this game, but not in the capacity some bads try to play them. Every time I see Enhanced Zoom equipped I facepalm, knowing that they could have equipped Radar Dep/Seismic/Target Info instead.

AHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAH

Edited by Cerberias, 10 August 2015 - 07:23 AM.

[Mycrus]

LordBraxton, on 10 August 2015 - 06:37 AM, said:

You can stick within 150m of your team without stopping your roll in a light. After the enemies position has been located, and unless you have serious coordination to go kill any idiots trying to play sniper on the other team, yes you should rejoin the deathball.

you said "ever." and yet you give two exemptions in the above statement... "ever" doesn't work that way...

[Mystere]

LordBraxton, on 10 August 2015 - 05:59 AM, said:

This has become one of the hotter topics of contemporary MWO. Do snipers exist? I strongly believe that , no, they don't. Or shouldn't, anyway. If you are more than 50-100m behind your teammates you are a coward, not a support mech. The irrefutable reason? :The symbiotic shield is bar-none the best defense in MWO. Even organized teams will waste rounds while they coordinate their focus fire, and in 99% of matches where focus fire is mediocre to nonexistent, the symbiotic shield is god mode. In short, be aggressive, and stick right next to your teammates. Anything else is actually playing wrong.

Then what do you call someone sniping behind enemy lines as well as someone sniping above enemy lines?

In any case, you're free to play your one-dimensional style of game play (i.e. deathball and only deathball) for as long as you desire. I, on the other hand, will find more ways of stunting your death ball.

Edited by Mystere, 10 August 2015 - 07:30 AM.

[MeiSooHaityu]

Mystere, on 10 August 2015 - 07:27 AM, said:

Then what do you call someone sniping behind enemy lines as well as someone sniping above enemy lines?

Death From Above?

Edited by MeiSooHaityu, 10 August 2015 - 07:32 AM.

[Cyborne Elemental]

AC-2 used to be pretty good at it, it wasn't any more remarkable than sniping with Gauss, but it was decent.

Then it got hit with ROF and range nerfs, and that was the end of that little niche.

[FupDup]

Mister D, on 10 August 2015 - 07:35 AM, said:

AC-2 used to be pretty good at it, it wasn't any more remarkable than sniping with Gauss, but it was decent.

Then it got hit with ROF and range nerfs, and that was the end of that little niche.

Paul could not stand to allow MWO to be the first game where the AC/2 was viable.

[Deathlike]

FupDup, on 10 August 2015 - 07:36 AM, said:

Paul could not stand to allow MWO to be the first game where the AC/2 was viable.

To be fair, the Paulconomist gave the AC2 two major nerfs in its lifetime, and are still very much enacted to this day.

[Mystere]

MeiSooHaityu, on 10 August 2015 - 07:30 AM, said:

Death From Above?

My very own special version of it.

Edited by Mystere, 10 August 2015 - 07:40 AM.

[FupDup]

Deathlike, on 10 August 2015 - 07:39 AM, said:

To be fair, the Paulconomist gave the AC2 two major nerfs in its lifetime, and are still very much enacted to this day.

I thought there was more than that?

IIRC, the order was:
1. Paranormal Heat
2. Cooldown to 0.52s
3. Removed 3X range, did they also nerf the base range?
4. Cooldown to about 0.69s?
5. Cooldown to 0.8s (thankfully he didn't leave it here for long)

[Deathlike]

FupDup, on 10 August 2015 - 07:41 AM, said:

I thought there was more than that?

IIRC, the order was:
1. Paranormal Heat
2. Cooldown to 0.52s
3. Removed 3X range, did they also nerf the base range?
4. Cooldown to about 0.69s?
5. Cooldown to 0.8s (thankfully he didn't leave it here for long)

Considering that I haven't tracked AC2 progression or used AC2s in any long period of time... I'm pretty sure EVERY NERF MATTERS.

Edited by Deathlike, 10 August 2015 - 07:46 AM.

[FupDup]

Deathlike, on 10 August 2015 - 07:45 AM, said:

Considering that I haven't tracked or used AC2s in any long period of time... I'm pretty sure EVERY NERF MATTERS.

I tried the AC/2 again on an Urbanmech while grinding robots this weekend...it made me pretty sad. Even the +15% ballistic cooldown quirk couldn't make it usable.

[DONTOR]

I dont ever use LRMs but for the sake of the argument, should LRM builds stay in the death ball? I could see a potential problem for LRM boats in this situation.

Mister D, on 10 August 2015 - 07:35 AM, said:

AC-2 used to be pretty good at it, it wasn't any more remarkable than sniping with Gauss, but it was decent.

Then it got hit with ROF and range nerfs, and that was the end of that little niche.

losing its triple range hurt it the most, that was a sad day.

[Pjwned]

Aggressiveness at the cost of dying swiftly is worse than support fire lasting the whole match.

[Joseph Mallan]

I Zeratul I, on 10 August 2015 - 06:16 AM, said:

Snipers exist and can be useful standing a thousand meters away from their team.

PUGs aren't usually a team.

Quote

A team is a group of people or other animals linked in a common purpose. Human teams are especially appropriate for conducting tasks that are high in complexity and have many interdependent subtasks. A group does not necessarily constitute a team.

Or Webster:

Quote

: a group of people who work together

This does not mean they are just on the same side. They must actively work together or they are just a group.

So Having a Sniper on a team can help deal with a problem Mech like a Dire Wolf or Timer Wolf, by adding extra damage to armor My Atlas has weakened/breached.

Edited by Joseph Mallan, 10 August 2015 - 08:12 AM.

[Gas Guzzler]

When you deathball, you are basically rolling the dice as to who get focused and killed first. To some people, that is not acceptable and they would prefer to win another way.

Deathball pushing all the time is the mindless brute force approach when your team isn't effective enough to win trades. There are sometimes where it is the right thing to do, as in when the other team is split or situations like that, but defaulting to that tactic all the time is kind of disappointing..

Edited by Gas Guzzler, 10 August 2015 - 08:12 AM.

[Joseph Mallan]

DONTOR, on 10 August 2015 - 07:52 AM, said:

I dont ever use LRMs but for the sake of the argument, should LRM builds stay in the death ball? I could see a potential problem for LRM boats in this situation.


losing its triple range hurt it the most, that was a sad day.

At the rear of the ball of a bit behind it would be my preferred placement, so the enemy would have to go through or around the Ball o Death.

[Dino Might]

Mycrus, on 10 August 2015 - 06:31 AM, said:

even in a light, ever?

LordBraxton, on 10 August 2015 - 06:37 AM, said:

You can stick within 150m of your team without stopping your roll in a light. After the enemies position has been located, and unless you have serious coordination to go kill any idiots trying to play sniper on the other team, yes you should rejoin the deathball. (flying around it like a drone)
Yes. But MWO never changes. I am more exhausted by the people who decide they'd rather hide in the back and help the enemy team.



yes. this too. snipers do massive damage. to their teammates.

LordBraxton, on 10 August 2015 - 06:37 AM, said:

You can stick within 150m of your team without stopping your roll in a light. After the enemies position has been located, and unless you have serious coordination to go kill any idiots trying to play sniper on the other team, yes you should rejoin the deathball. (flying around it like a drone)
Yes. But MWO never changes. I am more exhausted by the people who decide they'd rather hide in the back and help the enemy team.



yes. this too. snipers do massive damage. to their teammates.

Run a Locust. Never be in the deathball. Ever. It's why I run it. I am most effective out on my own. I can cap, squirrel, harpoon a whale solo, scout, spot, and then, after the battle is fully engaged, come in and core out the enemy "sniper" mechs, effectively invalidating every ton of frontal armor they possess, saving my team from having to chew through it all.

If you want to avoid the meta, you gotta avoid the meta.

(there was a pun in there for those that don't get it)