19 replies to this topic

[Not A Real RAbbi]

Just did a few PUG drops. Last two, BOTH, I got to backstab an Adder to death. BOTH times, we had been face-to-face first. Both times, I turned to circle the Adder, and BOTH times, the Adder pilot did NOT pay me any more attention.

Look, light pilots generally don't go toe-to-toe with anything heavier, and are loathe to even go that route with one another. Opportunists live longer.

So, if some dude in an Arctic Cheetah with a bunch of small pulse lasers goes flying by in the opposite direction, you may want to pull a quick Crazy Ivan and check your six. I got two easy kills tonight off folks that failed to check their six after my fly-by.

WORSE YET, the first alpha didn't clean out the CT. In both cases, the other pilot got a first big hit in the rear (relatively big, anyhow, for us light guys) and failed to take action. And in both cases, he/she paid for it in as long as it takes a ACH-A with c-SPL level 5 cooldown module to prepare a second alpha with 5 SPLs. A lot of mediums wouldn't survive a pair of those. A slow 35-ton clan light mech doesn't stand a chance.


LESSON: DO NOT leave an unattended enemy on your six. Especially an opportunistic, fresh light with a lot of pulse lasers and ECM and an expendable module gift pack to win.

TL;DR- Check your six, cover your six, cover each other's sixes.

[The Basilisk]

What is realy worse I got 3 incidents last evening where exactly this happened to me but I absolutely failed to SEE the arctic cheater doing his fly by.
He taunted me afterwards, hey dude are you blind or what ?

Errr....yes....it seems so.

I had this effect with closely passing high speed lights before and it always was a problem with the light mechs LODs not beeing loaded on some level of distance.

So if an other mech seems to not see you...this actualy could be the his problem....he realy can't.

[Not A Real RAbbi]

I hadn't heard of this before. Is PGI explicitly aware of this?

Also, quick question for you: Once they got that first hit on you in the back side, you DID take some appropriate action, right? Because both of the above, for whatever reason (not trying to shame anyone, mind you), just went on about their business as though I hadn't just melted the rear CT armor right off of them, even though I DID.

And no, this isn't me saying I'm some kind of hot-stuff light fighter. Check my stats. I'm PATHETIC. All the more reason to be alarmed that I managed to kill ANYTHING, even in one of the most amazing lights in the game.

[The Basilisk]

TheRAbbi, on 10 August 2015 - 10:23 PM, said:

I hadn't heard of this before. Is PGI explicitly aware of this?

Also, quick question for you: Once they got that first hit on you in the back side, you DID take some appropriate action, right? Because both of the above, for whatever reason (not trying to shame anyone, mind you), just went on about their business as though I hadn't just melted the rear CT armor right off of them, even though I DID.

And no, this isn't me saying I'm some kind of hot-stuff light fighter. Check my stats. I'm PATHETIC. All the more reason to be alarmed that I managed to kill ANYTHING, even in one of the most amazing lights in the game.

Oh sure, I turned... but did not see a thing untill I droped dead...seeing the ACH trampling through my remains.

But I also got incidents where I just dropped dead without any warning.
This isn't related to that LOD problem its just lagg or server out of phase.

So If a guy is constantly not reacting without beeing engaged otherwise he is either afk or just getting no feedback by his hud.

BTW you can see some of the LOD and texture loading probs this game has prominently on the new city map. on frozen city and and other spots with lots of dodads. You may see something like edges or surfaces suddenly vanishing and then reapearing in a more crisp and detailed fashion.

Turmaline desert is an other good example where some of the crystal spires are invisible at some ranges but the mechs behind are not.

If you look closely you may see body parts of mechs vanishing at certain ranges when they get closer or running away from you fast.

The ACH is the newest candidate simply becoming mostly transparent at some ranges. In addition with his ECM you are simply invisible.

Edited by The Basilisk, 10 August 2015 - 10:48 PM.

[Ustarish]

working as intended.

[Surn]

Op states the obvious. Public queue games are most often "ball up and nascar". It isnt supper fun, but it wins.

[Chados]

That's happened to me vs the AC as well. ACs are hard to see. I ended up chasing my tail til I dropped dead. They're real little and hard to see from the perspective of a 65 ton heavy's cockpit.

SSRMs ought to come in larger flavors than SSRM2 and come with some kind of a lock-on-jam option. That'd put paid to the little buggers.

[Unknown Rand]

TheRAbbi, on 10 August 2015 - 09:27 PM, said:

Look, light pilots generally don't go toe-to-toe with anything heavier, and are loathe to even go that route with one another. Opportunists live longer.

xD i must be one of the " stupid " light mech pilots who will fight just about anything that gets near me or in my way


sometimes it pays off and i will melt arms legs and torsos off the heavier mechs and gain a few kills, other times i dont even know what hit me as i die

Edited by Unknown Rand, 11 August 2015 - 03:28 AM.

[Rogue Jedi]

Unknown Rand, on 11 August 2015 - 03:27 AM, said:

xD i must be one of the " stupid " light mech pilots who will fight just about anything that gets near me or in my way


sometimes it pays off and i will melt arms legs and torsos off the heavier mechs and gain a few kills, other times i dont even know what hit me as i die

unless I have SPLs I am reluctant to dogfight other light Mechs, or some Mediums but unless it has streaks I will not hesitate to take on any heavy or assault.
I have 1 on 1 outfought a fresh Dire Wolf in a legged Spider, and taken a fresh Timber Wolf in a Firestarter which entered the fight at about 40%, and I have lost count of the number of times I have taken down the Mech which legged me, when it gets irritating is when someone else walks around the corner and secures what should have been my kill.

Lights can kill absolutely anything if the Light has the better pilot, and most slower Mechs even if the slower Mech has a slightly better pilot

[Koniving]

Always be weary of pests, especially when adventuring alone.

[TwoFistsofFear]

If I know I'm about to go down anyway Ill ignore the light behind me to take another shot or two at whoever I've got in front. Id rather get another shot on someone then go down mid turn between mechs. Always gotta go down auto cannons blazing, PPCs blasting, and lasers....lazing? I cant tell if that sounds right or just makes lasers sound lazy.

[Acierocolotl]

I imagine people get visually overloaded.

I vividly recall when I got my Creeping Death award: I circled around behind the enemy traffic jam on the caldera in the volcano map and unloading into heavy backs. It was with my 6 small pulse Jenner F. I was knocking them down like dominos without having to move at all, I almost felt embarrassed.

So it isn't even an ACH here, it can be anything. Watch your backs! I find them delicious.

[Garonis Buhallin]

While I was mastering out my Arctic Cheetahs I lost count of how many mechs I simply cored out from the rear. or took a leg with a fast pass. Actually, it reminded me of when I was mastering out my Firestarters. I also remember doing the very same thing with my Jenners in Beta. The lesson here is that a light mech in capable hands is a dangerous mech to any weight class.
I have not seen any disappearing mechs, myself, and I know the tail end hurt is very strong about the ACH, but it is the Mechwarrior that is the dangerous bit, not the mech. With the disappearing mechs.. perhaps it is judicious use of terrain with the Radar deprivation module.

In Edit:
I also find it delicious when folks drop their rear armor to 8 to 10 points, as many do. My 36 point miniwub alpha loves it!

Edited by Garonis Buhallin, 11 August 2015 - 09:22 AM.

[xe N on]

Light mechs are dangerous but mostly haven't the heat or cooling capacity to strike more then 2-3 laser alphas. Especially not lights that got no heat reduction quirks like the Jenner. They need a lotof time to cool down again.

An 4xC-UAC10 Direwolf on the other hand ... If I'm forced into a choice, I would ignore the light first.

Edited by xe N on, 11 August 2015 - 09:45 AM.

[Not A Real RAbbi]

Garonis Buhallin, on 11 August 2015 - 09:20 AM, said:

In Edit:
I also find it delicious when folks drop their rear armor to 8 to 10 points, as many do. My 36 point miniwub alpha loves it!

THIS has made leveling up my ACHs so much easier. Not sure when it became the meta thing, as I was gone for well over a year. But it makes my life in a light mech a LOT better. Two nights in a row with 3 kills in a match--UNHEARD OF for me before the clan invasion!

Back on topic.

Not sure about this whole disappearing ACH thing. If it's a lag/latency thing, then I'm sure it'd be just as bad against a SDR, and almost as much so against an LCT or FS9. And maybe it is. I haven't experienced it, but I generally pull a 40-ish ping on the NA server.

If it's a heavy or assault, I fully understand that the light is gonna be ignored in favor of facing down the other big mechs with big guns. Priorities of fires and all that. Roger. But this was one-on-one, in one instance, FAR away from the big fight, in open terrain (I know, he should never have caught me in the open). Out in the water on River City. The other was on Forest Colony, near where Theta would be in conquest. There was traffic, so I can understand it getting hectic, especially with him being outnumbered and suddenly focused by two or three enemy mechs.

Had it happen (sorta) again tonight, against an EBJ on Mining Colony. I almost cored that one out from behind, and as it was, I gave a LOT more than I got before he ran me off. Two full alphas (5x cSPL) in the back CT plate before the lone (far from the fight) EBJ pilot turned my way, easily 350-400 meters from any other interested mechs, and not taking any real fire. But again, first full alpha went straight into the rear CT plate, and I observed virtually no discernible reaction. Cool down, alpha again. THEN, there's a back-up-and-turn-and-put-my-back-to-the-wall (that bit saved his mech) response.

Man, I NEVER EVER EVER ignore damage from the rear, unless I'm in the middle of something and either A.) about to die anyhow, or B.) hauling tail outta there, zigging and zagging, and praying to the gods of critical damage for divine intervention. Even then, it's not so much IGNORING it, as knowing I'm either helpless to mitigate it or doing everything I can to get away from it.

Admittedly, it could just be really new players that don't get the whole damage direction indication thing, or aren't truly aware of how squishy the rear plate is, or something. That's not out of the question. And if it's the case, well praise be to the gods of poor elo...

[Nightshade24]

xe N on, on 11 August 2015 - 09:44 AM, said:

Light mechs are dangerous but mostly haven't the heat or cooling capacity to strike more then 2-3 laser alphas. Especially not lights that got no heat reduction quirks like the Jenner. They need a lotof time to cool down again.

An 4xC-UAC10 Direwolf on the other hand ... If I'm forced into a choice, I would ignore the light first.

on the contrary most lights that do not go overboard can still dish out nasty firepower and can keep alpha'ing non stop for 15 seconds+ on even terra therma. Such as most of my raven builds and such (things like 3 med las and 2 SRM 6's or many locust builds I run), one of the biggest advantages most lights have in terms of firepower is not sheer alpha but heat efficiency and the speed to keep in combat for a prolonged time and when that is done they go to the next battle swiftly and just keep on laying down damage like no tomorrow.

[The Basilisk]

Got two other incidents yesterday evening.
Frozen city ventured with my lance from drop point to theta in my BLR-GHE and nearly reached the cappoint when I suddenly just dropped dead. No threat indicator armor diagram didn't blink.
Only reason given was C-SPLaser -- Engine Destroyed and my CT front armor was blown.
85points of armor + Internals gone in a split second.
No one of my lance saw a thing.
The Pilot doing the kill drove a SCR and and loled at me cause he thought he would have been out of range.

The other Incident was in Crimson when I was in my WVR-6R blasting away with my ACs at an Warhawks back.
No thread indicator no armor blink just death screen.
On the report screen some LRM dmg from a previous fight with an ULLER and then
C-SPLaser -- Legs destroyed.
Again no other mech around me saw what happened.
The guy who made the kill claimed he had 4 CSPLs left and was out of LRMs and was firing for half a minute. And everybody ignored him.

Edited by The Basilisk, 12 August 2015 - 12:08 AM.

[Takashi Uchida]

This is how Locust 1E pilots eat in the PUG queue. Ask any of the people in the Locust Appreciation megathread in the lights section.

Lasers won't cause the screen shake that ballistics and missile weapons do, so it can very easy for a beginner to ignore damage from the rear. I'm guilty of frontloading my armor, and this particular threat is one of the reasons why I hesitate playing Dire Wolfs when I know I don't if I'll having friends looking out for me.

As soon as I see the red indicator flash that I'm taking damage from behind, I immediately twist. Mechs built for backstabbing commonly have lasers with short beam duration, so sometimes it too late. However, it's a good thing to do any way because if it's someone flashing an c-ERLL at you you can atleast roll a lot of damage onto your arms. It's been a while since I've been backstabbed, but it still happens.

Edited by Takashi Uchida, 12 August 2015 - 01:50 AM.

[Pocket_Aces]

I think the main issue is threat focus, many folks target the threat they are on. If I'm getting cored from the back, but a few people are targeting the mech I am, I don't change target, unfocused fire is bad. Rather die and win than die anyway and lose.

[Tylerchu]

People should also be concerned about the SRM-16 Oxide.I'd put it up as the ultimate backstabber/assassin.