19 replies to this topic

[Appuagab]

(******** means r3t4rd3d which is referring to brain not functioning properly)

Edited by Appuagab, 17 August 2015 - 04:14 AM.

[Lily from animove]

yeah wen't a lot boring.

[Ironwithin]

Assault without turrets = assault with tourettes

One of our *=%?! lights is capping their /°§")=%)(?*' base... great another match with no $!&?=$§&?'*: CBills.
One of their *=%?! lights is capping our /°§")=%)(?*' base... great another match with no $!&?=$§&?'*: CBills.

Yeah yeah "defend your base" bla bla "play faster 'mechs" herp-derp "coordinate better" blubidibub ... go §%/"=()&?`'#*_;:!"§$" your !"$§$%/)_*'.

[TWIAFU]

Your right, it is awesome without Turrets.

Thankfully, we have the choice to not play Skirmish with the option to Cap, we can just play Skirmish.

If you do not like the game mode and/or win options, do not play that made.

Rocket science, it is not. 3rd grade intelligence it does take to realize that.

[Appuagab]

TWIAFU, on 17 August 2015 - 04:19 AM, said:

If you do not like

I like assault with turrets. Not playing assault without turrets is not the way of playing assault with turrets m8. It doesn't work this way.

[Lily from animove]

TWIAFU, on 17 August 2015 - 04:19 AM, said:

Your right, it is awesome without Turrets.

Thankfully, we have the choice to not play Skirmish with the option to Cap, we can just play Skirmish.

If you do not like the game mode and/or win options, do not play that made.

Rocket science, it is not. 3rd grade intelligence it does take to realize that.

honestly assautl without turrets mae it into a worse randomassault. In pugland evertyhign is nw even more random than before. The mode tuned into either another skirmihs, or 2 teams capracing. The amount of real tactical "assaults" in this game more is so negliable small you can simply deactivate the mode. Yes, thats an option, but hardly chnags that the current assault tunred out even more worse. And this only because on a few maps the mode was broken due to bad turret placement.
Could have bee fixed by relocating those turrets and the base, instead a big "across the board" changes. Or they could have removed turrets form SOME maps, and not all. Even that woudl ahve been a proper solution.

But so far, the turrets only were an issue on River city and on caustic where one of both bases was too close to the main combat areas.

Edited by Lily from animove, 17 August 2015 - 05:53 AM.

[Rushin Roulette]

What are you talking about? I see loads of Tourettes in the Assault games and these forums... see there even seems to be a few in this thread.

[Squarebasher]

At first it was a bit of a pain, but now I think most players are getting used to it, and it is better imo.

[MarineTech]

Personally, I prefer Assault without the turrets.

Means you have to use actual strategy and tactics. Otherwise, it's really just a minor variant of Skirmish.

[Tarogato]

Assault without turrets: punishes idiots that don't defend their base.

Why did you let your base get capped so hard? You could have prevented - it's called scouting and positioning.

---

IMO, quadruple the reward for capping the enemy base. If EVERY match is a capwarrior, then soon enough player behaviour will change to combat the constant and consistent threat. When that happens, we'll have an interesting game mode. But with low rewards for capping, Assault is always going to be Skirmish with a cheap cop out tactic that nobody likes.

[Appuagab]

Tarogato, on 17 August 2015 - 11:10 AM, said:

Why did you let your base get capped so hard?

Lol I didnt, pic related. MUH TACTICS. You can fantasize about TUCTEECS as much as you want but the fact is: if one team appears near enemy base they cap it just not to let opposite team do the same thing earlier. Oh yeah, that's definitely much more TACTICAL than capping a base protected by turrets.

[Rogue Jedi]

since the turrets have been removed I have only ever won or lost to a cap when most of the loosing team was already dead,

I frequently will take my light to cap, that convinces the enemy to send a lance back to protect the base (from 1 Light Mech) so my team steamrolls the other 2 lances and claims victory, this works quite frequently.

removing the turrets has allowed a single fast Mech to have a major effect on the outcome of the match, and I like the added tactical element

[Tarogato]

Tarogato, on 17 August 2015 - 11:10 AM, said:

Why did you let your base get capped so hard?

Appuagab, on 18 August 2015 - 04:04 AM, said:

Lol I didnt,

Then why did you lose 80% of your base and come here to complain about base capping?



You would have had a lot more of an interesting match if your team would have positioned themselves so that the enemy team could not get to your capzone. Instead, you played Nascar and sat on the enemy cap and never defended your own. Employ a boring tactic, enjoy a boring and fruitless win. Next time maybe fight for your base. Scout out the position of the enemy team and position your team between your base and the enemy team so that they have to fight you or go around wide. Send scouts to watch those wide flanks. Even in solo queue you have team chat and VOIP so there's no excuse for not doing any of this.

[Lily from animove]

Appuagab, on 18 August 2015 - 04:04 AM, said:

Lol I didnt, pic related. MUH TACTICS. You can fantasize about TUCTEECS as much as you want but the fact is: if one team appears near enemy base they cap it just not to let opposite team do the same thing earlier. Oh yeah, that's definitely much more TACTICAL than capping a base protected by turrets.

this describes the majority of the current games., and most maps have ways way too long to prevent capping once it starts capping.

So you have 2 options all rush in to have more mechs capping than the opponents.
Some stay behind, getting steamrolled by the full opponent firce and they cap faster then than your team does.
nealry everone defends base to be a proper defense vs the deathball, which efficiently makes the match a skirmish.

real tactics as delaying th opponent and granting your team time, preventing caps or distracting to not work at all unless you face soem real derp pugs.

@Taro your tactic would have made it just a skirmish. and leavign part of the tema behind is not a tactic its suiciding half of the team and then a caprace of your half team vs their entire team.
The only "tactical" lookign matches are those where both detahballs meet and skirmish it out while a few lose mechs make their way to the opponent base. but map design makes this a rare event, most of the times the both detahballs will miss each other because they take the shortest way to the opponent base.

The theoretical tactical elements this game mode should have and offer are not present with the current MWO's setup of maps and spawns and the rest of the design assault has.

Edited by Lily from animove, 18 August 2015 - 05:54 AM.

[Dodger79]

Rogue Jedi, on 18 August 2015 - 05:02 AM, said:

since the turrets have been removed I have only ever won or lost to a cap when most of the loosing team was already dead,

I frequently will take my light to cap, that convinces the enemy to send a lance back to protect the base (from 1 Light Mech) so my team steamrolls the other 2 lances and claims victory, this works quite frequently.

removing the turrets has allowed a single fast Mech to have a major effect on the outcome of the match, and I like the added tactical element

Before the removal of the turrets you could have achieved the sam thing by just shooting at the turrets or by running through the cap zone. Ok, by this your pint could get some scratches, but the effect on the other team should have been the same.

Just remember: the turrets were introduced because so many players complained about not getting real matches where two teams fought each other but cap-races, where 1 or 2 Lights with capping modules decided the matches. "Better scouting", "better tactics" or "base defend" weren't working solutions at that time and i suppose they still aren't. The maps are getting bigger (thankfully) so most Mechs simply do not have the speed to deny a proper cap-attempt, scouting all possible ways just means splitting up your lights which usually results in them getting slaughtered alone when they actually do find the enemy fast movers on their way to your capzone. The turrets prevented that by being dangerous enough for single Lights. Just switching their weapons loadout from LRM to more short range would have been better then removing them completely.

[Rogue Jedi]

Dodger79, on 18 August 2015 - 06:00 AM, said:

Before the removal of the turrets you could have achieved the same thing by just shooting at the turrets or by running through the cap zone. Ok, by this your pant could get some scratches, but the effect on the other team should have been the same.

should have but was not, most people ignored the "base under attack" warning, and only did something about it when "base is being captured", as it was extremely risky to run in with a single short range light Mech to kill the turrets, you rarely got the same effect

[Dodger79]

Rogue Jedi, on 18 August 2015 - 06:16 AM, said:

should have but was not, most people ignored the "base under attack" warning, and only did something about it when "base is being captured", as it was extremely risky to run in with a single short range light Mech to kill the turrets, you rarely got the same effect

Well, then thanks to the removal we are in joyful anticipation of the new/old tactics of base defend, where no team is willing to take the risk of being cap-rushed and therefore stays near the base. That maybe worked on small maps like the original Forest Colony, but on the one, Tourmaline, Alpine, River City, Crimson etc. it will just lead to a lot of drwas with 15 Minutes of waiting for an enemy that never comes because he does the same. This playstyle back in the days without turrets was the most unpleasant playing experience in all my time in MWO and i am playing since closed beta. Can't wait to get it back /irony off...

The turrets were supposed to be kind of "time buyers" and they did a good job on this. They were too good in shooting their LRM right into the enemy spawn on small maps like the old River City. Bus as all the very small maps get overhauled this problem would have disappeared without taking further action or PGI could have changed the wapons on the turrets. Removing them completely just doesn't make it more tactical, just more boring. Again: the turrets were added for a reason. For a GOOD reason.

[Koniving]

With turrets at super high health.

The defending team was too lazy to do any tactics beyond "camp the hill." And they lost. In anti-climatic fashion. Evidently they thought their turrets would do all the work for them.

Without turrets.

Defense tactic leaves one mech to hold the base. Reinforcements come when the base is rushed as base is primary target (got more money out of winning via base capture than total annihilation of enemy forces). I think this is a very important point for assault mode; it needs to have a reason to value capturing (and thus defending) the bases.

I also feel it should have "destruction" of base elements rather than "stand and twitter your thumbs." This way a single light will have a hard time, but several mechs could get something done.



13 minute base defense. Also before turrets. After lights make a go at the base, we come back to defend it. This is after most of our team is wiped out. We successfully defend the base against all odds.

[HighTest]

I actually learned to like Assault with turrets. But if I had to be objective, the turrets needed to be tuned a little to make capping the bases more viable:

- Reduce the number of turrets by 2 per map
- Either change missile turrets to SRM turrets, OR fix LRM turrets so they don't shoot >1000m and through obstacles and focus the CT almost exclusively. (Honestly, some of the old maps just aren't big enough to support LRM turrets.) Missile turrets should not be able to hit mechs who are engaged neat the centre of a map.

That would make it easier for a couple of lights or a lance of small mechs to apply pressure to the other team without having Assault matches devolve into Skirmish or mini-Conquest-cap-rush matches. The bases need to deter 1-light-mech capping, but still be usable as a valid win condition.

My CAD$0.02 (or basically not much these days).

[D A T A]

I have never seen a base without defensive countermeasures.
Lrm turrets were annoying, pinpoint lasers as well.


Each base should have 6 turrets with 2cstk 6 each to prevent dumb locust capwarrior online