50 replies to this topic

[SunTzu]

Why does the PSR punish aggressive gameplay? If I'm in my medium and the rest of my team is afraid to push, why should I get punished for getting a lower score than the heavies/assault afraid to take any damage for the team? Enemies shoot at things, all mechs (maybe not the pilots) put out damage. In order for a team to win you have to deal damage, fair enough, but someone has to take damage. If you're in a heavy/assault at 90% armor when 8 of your team is dead, and only 3 enemies are dead, you clearly are not contributing to the team. You should receive a low match score regardless of your damage output as you're crippling the team by not playing your role.

[Elizander]

You can be aggressive without pushing, but only if you have enough ranged weapons. If you are a brawler and everyone's uptight, you're better off hiding for the first 50% of the match or consider putting in a large laser somewhere.

[ScarecrowES]

PSR rewards team play. Going Rambo and getting yourself killed should definitely be punished.

If you're the only one doing something, chances are, the team knows something you don't. The results screen will tell the tale.

[Gamuray]

I disagree. I've had many matches in my assaults where I put out over 1000 damage or near to that point and still had most of my armor (yes, those were carry matches). You can't always ever choose who the opponents shoot at, so no punishing people for not getting shot. However, a damage soaker/tanker bonus isn't a bad idea, but only if your allies are within a certain radius of you and the enemy, and within sight of the enemy. Otherwise it's not tanking and is just called dying.

ps. Slow assaults sometimes don't get shot because they never make it close enough to the fight, but do damage from long range loadouts. Again, no punishing ANYONE for not getting shot.

[KharnZor]

SunTzu, on 23 August 2015 - 01:41 PM, said:

Why does the PSR punish aggressive gameplay? If I'm in my medium and the rest of my team is afraid to push, why should I get punished for getting a lower score than the heavies/assault afraid to take any damage for the team? Enemies shoot at things, all mechs (maybe not the pilots) put out damage. In order for a team to win you have to deal damage, fair enough, but someone has to take damage. If you're in a heavy/assault at 90% armor when 8 of your team is dead, and only 3 enemies are dead, you clearly are not contributing to the team. You should receive a low match score regardless of your damage output as you're crippling the team by not playing your role.

Do i have to state the obvious?
How about instead moaning you do something about it. For a start you can drop into Forest colonoscopy at any time in the training grounds and have a good look at the terrain and where you can take your medium, where the most advantageous fire lanes are and more.
Half the battle is already won if you have the map knowledge

Edited by KharnZor, 23 August 2015 - 02:41 PM.

[Kiiyor]

I'm seeing the exact opposite.

My matches have been swift and brutal, for the most part. you have to be aggressive to get a slice of the pie. You get in and eat or you don't eat.

I'm not talking blind charging either - everyone just seems to get to the front line faster. Before PSR there would be a minute or two of probing, some peeking or whatnot. Not now. People seem to know what they're about.

I think the gameplay experience is going to be quite different from person to person. I wonder if we'll see different meta in different tiers.

[MerryIguana]

ScarecrowES, on 23 August 2015 - 01:50 PM, said:

If you're the only one doing something, chances are, the team knows something you don't. The results screen will tell the tale.

And if the whole team is pushing, that first mech in is the biggest team player of all. No reward.

[Deathlike]

SunTzu, on 23 August 2015 - 01:41 PM, said:

Why does the PSR punish aggressive gameplay? If I'm in my medium and the rest of my team is afraid to push, why should I get punished for getting a lower score than the heavies/assault afraid to take any damage for the team? Enemies shoot at things, all mechs (maybe not the pilots) put out damage. In order for a team to win you have to deal damage, fair enough, but someone has to take damage. If you're in a heavy/assault at 90% armor when 8 of your team is dead, and only 3 enemies are dead, you clearly are not contributing to the team. You should receive a low match score regardless of your damage output as you're crippling the team by not playing your role.

You really shouldn't be pushing as the medium... ONLY if the bigger mechs do so first.

You're actually being punished when the rest of the team are chicken. That at least I would agree with.

[SunTzu]

KharnZor, on 23 August 2015 - 02:29 PM, said:

Do i have to state the obvious?
How about instead moaning you do something about it. For a start you can drop into Forest colonoscopy at any time in the training grounds and have a good look at the terrain and where you can take your atlas, where the most advantageous fire lanes are and more.
Half the battle is already won if you have the map knowledge

You did not understand even one sentence I put down did you?

Gamuray, on 23 August 2015 - 01:54 PM, said:

I disagree. I've had many matches in my assaults where I put out over 1000 damage or near to that point and still had most of my armor (yes, those were carry matches). You can't always ever choose who the opponents shoot at, so no punishing people for not getting shot. However, a damage soaker/tanker bonus isn't a bad idea, but only if your allies are within a certain radius of you and the enemy, and within sight of the enemy. Otherwise it's not tanking and is just called dying.

ps. Slow assaults sometimes don't get shot because they never make it close enough to the fight, but do damage from long range loadouts. Again, no punishing ANYONE for not getting shot.

I just did 2 kills 9 assists and 1394 damage, I was at 60% when I was done and nobody else on my team broke 500 damage with only 2 people going over 300. I guess there is just a difference in play philosophy. Some players understand it's ok to take damage if you're dealing damage and winning. While others don't wanna lose even 1%, even if it means they stifle their potential or gimp the team. I just wanna know what PGI wants because the play makers are often punished if their teams don't back them up.

[bad arcade kitty]

that's the obvious problem with using personal score especially in a team game instead of the end result i.e. win or loss

[Elizander]

bad arcade kitty, on 23 August 2015 - 02:47 PM, said:

that's the obvious problem with using personal score especially in a team game instead of the end result i.e. win or loss

Team score tracking would be fine if there were fixed teams, but that's not possible in MWO for 12 people.

[Trev Firestorm]

ScarecrowES, on 23 August 2015 - 01:50 PM, said:

If you're the only one doing something, chances are, the team knows something you don't. The results screen will tell the tale.

Sometimes yes, most of the time teams acting as described are just oblivious waiting to be enveloped.

[bad arcade kitty]

Elizander, on 23 August 2015 - 02:54 PM, said:

Team score tracking would be fine if there were fixed teams, but that's not possible in MWO for 12 people.

elo is perfectly possible in a team game, your elo gain/loss depends on the elo of your teammates and enemies

they shouldn't have invented some silly abusable psr, they should have just added the tiers, separated soloq and groupq elo and possibly increased the elo gain

[Johnny05]

ScarecrowES, on 23 August 2015 - 01:50 PM, said:

PSR rewards team play. Going Rambo and getting yourself killed should definitely be punished.

If you're the only one doing something, chances are, the team knows something you don't. The results screen will tell the tale.

I disagree with this. Have been so many times on Terra with most of the team hiding in the doorway with me the lone mech in the centre. If everyone walks in we have the centre together, that's not being Rambo.

[KharnZor]

SunTzu, on 23 August 2015 - 02:45 PM, said:

You did not understand even one sentence I put down did you?



I just did 2 kills 9 assists and 1394 damage, I was at 60% when I was done and nobody else on my team broke 500 damage with only 2 people going over 300. I guess there is just a difference in play philosophy. Some players understand it's ok to take damage if you're dealing damage and winning. While others don't wanna lose even 1%, even if it means they stifle their potential or gimp the team. I just wanna know what PGI wants because the play makers are often punished if their teams don't back them up.

Yea i understood perfectly.
My bad i got a few tabs open atm and replied to the wrong thread.
Good advise tho eh

[Seelenlos]

SunTzu, on 23 August 2015 - 01:41 PM, said:

Why does the PSR punish aggressive gameplay? If I'm in my medium and the rest of my team is afraid to push, why should I get punished for getting a lower score than the heavies/assault afraid to take any damage for the team? Enemies shoot at things, all mechs (maybe not the pilots) put out damage. In order for a team to win you have to deal damage, fair enough, but someone has to take damage. If you're in a heavy/assault at 90% armor when 8 of your team is dead, and only 3 enemies are dead, you clearly are not contributing to the team. You should receive a low match score regardless of your damage output as you're crippling the team by not playing your role.

Read the PSR post:
The best player in the loser-team wit hhigher PSR-rating still goes up.

Thats what most wont tell you.

Keep up the work! Make Damage, Spot, Assists and UAV etc and have a good score at end. then in some time you will leave the losers behidn you.

Believe me, i am seeing more and more better matches with all those loser noobs around me in losing matches !

Edited by Seelenlos, 23 August 2015 - 03:07 PM.

[bad arcade kitty]

psr rewards solo play and ditching your team if there is a danger for your personal score

Seelenlos, on 23 August 2015 - 02:59 PM, said:

Read the PSR post:
The best player in the loser-team wit hhigher PSR-rating still goes up.

and that's the key of the problem why it forces passive gameplay... nobody wants to risk their score

[Nightmare1]

ScarecrowES, on 23 August 2015 - 01:50 PM, said:

PSR rewards team play. Going Rambo and getting yourself killed should definitely be punished.

If you're the only one doing something, chances are, the team knows something you don't. The results screen will tell the tale.

This times infinity.

[Screech]

Problem is the match score system needs a major overhaul if it is expected to be some metric on pilot ability. Pretty sure with the current system if a player killed all 12 opponents solo with headshots they wouldn't break 350 points.

[Mycrus]

SunTzu, on 23 August 2015 - 01:41 PM, said:

Why does the PSR punish aggressive gameplay? If I'm in my medium and the rest of my team is afraid to push, why should I get punished for getting a lower score than the heavies/assault afraid to take any damage for the team? Enemies shoot at things, all mechs (maybe not the pilots) put out damage. In order for a team to win you have to deal damage, fair enough, but someone has to take damage. If you're in a heavy/assault at 90% armor when 8 of your team is dead, and only 3 enemies are dead, you clearly are not contributing to the team. You should receive a low match score regardless of your damage output as you're crippling the team by not playing your role.

In a fast mech

Run wide / flank

Attack enemy rear... drop uav / drop artie

Shout "push push push" in voip...

That is how you pug herd your team to victory