35 replies to this topic

[Mechwarrior Buddah]

If they widen it up more or allow all tiers to fight each other doesnt that kind of invalidate the point of the tiers?

IE allowing top tier ppl to fight bottom tier ppl doesnt exactly give the bottom tier ppl a chance to fight ppl at their skill level.

Seems to me it would be like removing any skill base from the MM and would be chaos O.o

And are there so few ppl playing?

[WatDo]

Wait, really? I hope this is some kind of troll because that definitely does invalidate tiers and matchmaker entirely.

[DAYLEET]

Thats group queue though. Cohesive fire and movement is greater than individual skills. while elo made no sense in solo queue, in group queue ,assuming only group of 12 exist aand work together, elo would be better.

Ive not had the chance to try the group queue since PSR. Hopefully this weekend ill have a few drop and see for myself.

Edited by DAYLEET, 25 August 2015 - 11:24 AM.

[Mechwarrior Buddah]

WatDo, on 25 August 2015 - 11:22 AM, said:

Wait, really? I hope this is some kind of troll because that definitely does invalidate tiers and matchmaker entirely.

How would I make up a twitter post? Its out there for anyone to see

[Mcgral18]

If you play in the Group Queue, taking only Light Mechs and complaining that you have no Assault, it's the risk you take.
Likewise if you expect a balanced match when you stack whichever robots or player skill in your group.

Release valves are required to get a match, period, in the group queue (with random size groups, and the limit on chassis)


Those measures theoretically work on the PUG LIFE, where it can individually choose which players and robots.

Edited by Mcgral18, 25 August 2015 - 11:26 AM.

[Mechwarrior Buddah]

Mcgral18, on 25 August 2015 - 11:25 AM, said:

If you play in the Group Queue, taking only Light Mechs and complaining that you have no Assault, it's the risk you take.

I dont play lights

I dont get what that has to do with this.

Othere than less ppl would be playing group when the top tier can seal club the bottom tiers

Edited by Mechwarrior Buddah, 25 August 2015 - 11:28 AM.

[Alistair Winter]

For the Oceanic server, I can see why they would do this.

For everyone else? No. I'd rather have 1 good game than 2 bad games. I never thought I'd make it out of the underhive as a pugger, but Tiers and PSR have made it possible. I'm not going back.

[CDLord HHGD]

Alistair Winter, on 25 August 2015 - 11:27 AM, said:

I'm not going back.

Indeed.

[Mechwarrior Buddah]

Alistair Winter, on 25 August 2015 - 11:27 AM, said:

I'm not going back.

Unless theres so few players globally that they need to do this

[Mcgral18]

Mechwarrior Buddah, on 25 August 2015 - 11:27 AM, said:

I dont play lights

I dont get what that has to do with this.

Othere than less ppl would be playing group when the top tier can seal club the bottom tiers

It's one possibility, which has everything to do with this.

There's a (supposed) 5 chassis limit (while there was a recent 6 Assault posted), which means if you stack 3 of a group, you shouldn't be able to play with another group that has 3 of them, removing a MM option. Then if you get a 7 man and a 5 man, where it's 3/2/2/0 and 3/0/2/0, they couldn't (shouldn't) form a group, because 6/2/4/0 exceeds the 6 chassis limit. Which means even if they had the same PSR, the MM now needs to find another 5 man (or combination) with a worse PSR because that group can't match.

Which causes a worse match.


Group queue can already put low tier with high tier, if they group together (as it uses the average group PSR). Release valves expand every minute, getting larger and larger as it goes on.

[Jello2142]

Mechwarrior Buddah, on 25 August 2015 - 11:18 AM, said:

If they widen it up more or allow all tiers to fight each other doesnt that kind of invalidate the point of the tiers?

IE allowing top tier ppl to fight bottom tier ppl doesnt exactly give the bottom tier ppl a chance to fight ppl at their skill level.

Seems to me it would be like removing any skill base from the MM and would be chaos O.o

And are there so few ppl playing?

So this is just a fancy way for Russ to say population is low? Also I see the word "GROUP" but all group sizes does that imply single up to 12 as well?

I do however agree allowing all tiers to play is inviting some discouraging stomping to start up again from new players and space poor people who don't have space $$$ to run Meta mechs. Opening up the flood gates to all tiers is not a solution to the problem of low population it is just a good way to possibly make it worse

The only logical solution to lack of players is to attract more players. Steam would be a good start albeit I have no idea what it takes to get something on steam but that is above my pay grade.

[Deathlike]

I thought we were a "large and diverse" playbase?


Seriously though, the issue is partly the regional servers because it starts to section off some people (see Oceanic @ sub-20% levels with NA @ 70+% level on a consistent basis).

So... at some point something is giving in.

[Alistair Winter]

Mechwarrior Buddah, on 25 August 2015 - 11:32 AM, said:

Unless theres so few players globally that they need to do this

Widening tier availability will potentially exacerbate this problem.

[DAYLEET]

You don't have to let the MatchMaker put you in other tier. In solo the slacking happens at 60seconds, in group it has been lowered to 30seconds but it might be lower now. What im saying is cancel the search and start a new one when you go past your 60-30 seconds, i actually have my celphone on the desk with a chrono. This means you wait longer, but im fine with that, id like to have a tickbox instead of having to chrono myself.


A tickbox to lock the tier im ranked at.

Edited by DAYLEET, 25 August 2015 - 11:42 AM.

[CDLord HHGD]

Mechwarrior Buddah, on 25 August 2015 - 11:32 AM, said:

Unless theres so few players globally that they need to do this

Personally I don't care. I spent MONTHS battling the hacker L33T meta tryhards and now that I have tasted something better, I am not going back. Winning 50% of my matches that are hard fought on both sides is much better than the 90% losses from before.

[Mechwarrior Buddah]

cdlord, on 25 August 2015 - 11:41 AM, said:

Personally I don't care. I spent MONTHS battling the hacker L33T meta tryhards and now that I have tasted something better, I am not going back. Winning 50% of my matches that are hard fought on both sides is much better than the 90% losses from before.

no, no, Im saying if they institute this youll be going back no matter what because those guys will be thrown into the queue with you again

edit: spelling, just had dental surgery as before I was a werewolf:



and now huge painkillers

Edited by Mechwarrior Buddah, 25 August 2015 - 11:50 AM.

[CDLord HHGD]

Mechwarrior Buddah, on 25 August 2015 - 11:48 AM, said:

no, no, Im saying if they institute this youll be going back no matter what because those guys will be thrown into the queue with you again

edit: spelling, just had dental surgery as before I was a werewolf:



and now huge painkillers

I'll still fight the good fight in-game. End result will be my renewed effort to speak against the meta on these here forums.

Hope you heal from the dental work quickly. Had 4 wisdom teeth removed several years back, worst experience of my life....

Edited by cdlord, 25 August 2015 - 11:57 AM.

[cSand]

cdlord, on 25 August 2015 - 11:41 AM, said:

Personally I don't care. I spent MONTHS battling the hacker L33T meta tryhards and now that I have tasted something better, I am not going back. Winning 50% of my matches that are hard fought on both sides is much better than the 90% losses from before.

Amen.


Finding though, observing the various builds during my likely-short-lived-residency "up there", (I die a lot so plenty of time for having a look around ) that the majority are made up of one finger alpha warriors in the high tier.


"the most skilled pilots"


Granted there are certainly a handful of actually skilled folks who don't seem to need that crutch (that Aresye fellow from the boards here being one of them I've seen)


Mostly just EZ-alpha warrior though

I am wondering if the rebalance will reward skilled piloting more at a higher standing that ability to ram 8 lasers in someone

.... not optomistic though

Edited by cSand, 25 August 2015 - 12:03 PM.

[Mechwarrior Buddah]

cSand, on 25 August 2015 - 12:01 PM, said:

Amen.


Finding though, observing the various builds during my likely-short-lived-residency "up there" that the majority are one finger alpha warriors in the high tier.


"the most skilled pilots"


Granted there are certainly a handful of actually skilled folks who don't seem to need that crutch (that Aresye fellow from the boards here being one of them I've seen)


Mostly just EZ-alpha warrior though

I am wondering if the rebalance will reward skilled piloting more at a higher standing that ability to ram 8 lasers in someone

.... not optomistic though

oh man Im so messed up I thought you two were the same person and you were quoting yourself -.- Im gonna go lie down

[AlphaToaster]

I don't see much difference between this and no MM when the end result is top teir facing new players.

So it's really, "we don't want teir 1 to face teir 4 or 5 unless teir 1 get bored waiting for a long time"

No obligation to protect new players from top players once that boredom sets in I guess. Which I thought was the whole point of Elo/PSR to begin with....

Edited by AlphaToaster, 25 August 2015 - 12:05 PM.