27 replies to this topic

[xe N on]

PGI is currently making steps to improve the new player experience (NPE). That is very good. However, one huge aspect that dramatically affect new NPE negatively is IMHO the mech skill tree. As far as I know, there currently is no plan for a change.

New player don't have the gaming skills of more experienced player and will, therefore, often underperform. However, they start in unskilled mechs which, in addition to their inexperience, keep their performance low.

The mech skills that can be unlocked by XP have dramatical impact of the performance of a mech. The basic bonus reach from 7.5 to 25% and are even doubled, after the elite tier is completed. Imagine these skills as quirks that you need to buy to make your mech equal with all other mechs. However, for elite you need 3 mechs on basic. This is an enormous barrier.

Eventually, new players are punished twice.

tl;dr:
For improving NPE mechs skills need to be fundamentally changed to allow new player a better entry into this game.

Edited by xe N on, 06 September 2015 - 03:47 AM.

[Yellonet]

At the very least they need to be told how the skill system works, it's a bit muddy now.

[Juodas Varnas]

They should just scrap the whole system entirely.
It's nothing but unnecessary hurdles for new players to jump over, just to have a CHANCE to be on the same level as other people.

Edited by Juodas Varnas, 06 September 2015 - 03:53 AM.

[Chados]

Great post, Yellonet. I fully agree. Radar Deprivation, Target Decay, the LL cool down, and the LRM/SSRM range modules have improved my experience in game significantly. And it took time...and an infusion of real cash...to convert MXP to GXP...to obtain radar deprivation. It's not a golden BB but it is a big help.

[TheCharlatan]

Skill system needs a overhaul. It's been in "placeholder" state for way too long.

[Elizander]

They can incorporate this into the tutorial where they are walked through the steps of unlocking efficiencies for their first mech. It would be easier if they are given one to start with. The mech XP needed to unlock the skills can be given by completing tutorial tasks.

Edited by Elizander, 06 September 2015 - 04:43 AM.

[sycocys]

It is possible you might be overestimating the value of the mech skills in the new/still casual player experience.

[TWIAFU]

Elizander, on 06 September 2015 - 04:20 AM, said:

They can incorporate this into the tutorial where they are walked through the steps of unlocking efficiencies for their first mech. It would be easier if they are given one to start with. The mech XP needed to unlock the skills can be given by completing tutorial rewards.

Add Skills to Advanced Training in the Academy.

[Yokaiko]

xe N on, on 06 September 2015 - 03:42 AM, said:

PGI is currently making steps to improve the new player experience (NPE). That is very good. However, one huge aspect that dramatically affect new NPE negatively is IMHO the mech skill tree. As far as I know, there currently is no plan for a change.

New player don't have the gaming skills of more experienced player and will, therefore, often underperform. However, they start in unskilled mechs which, in addition to their inexperience, keep their performance low.

The mech skills that can be unlocked by XP have dramatical impact of the performance of a mech. The basic bonus reach from 7.5 to 25% and are even doubled, after the elite tier is completed. Imagine these skills as quirks that you need to buy to make your mech equal with all other mechs. However, for elite you need 3 mechs on basic. This is an enormous barrier.

Eventually, new players are punished twice.

tl;dr:
For improving NPE mechs skills need to be fundamentally changed to allow new player a better entry into this game.

You forgot to mention once you have ground (at an average of 90k a match no hero/premium) 30mil for a set of properly built mediums, NOW go and spend another 24-40 million on modules to max the mechs out. Unless you are using omn-mechs, and just move omni pods from one CT to the next so the loadouts stay the same. Still you are going to be another 15mil in mods, after spending 34 mil for three Stormcrows for example.

.....and don't get any idea on screwing around with builds, the days of being able to spend 10mil experimenting died when we got Paulconomied™

[Belazaar]

I would like to see more team oriented tutorials. Things that cover working as a team and I don't mean death ball that is not a tactic it is from lake of communication.

We need firing lanes, team positing, situational awareness, radio/chat communication standards.

We also need training for leaders, so more people will step and lead.

And for the love of all things mech, quit going to the same place and camp.

Use the scouts and move as a group and go as slow is the slowest mech until you encounter the opforce.

In my opinion, this would help the game experience more than anything else.

Of course it may be the only people still playing this game are FPS types and they don't care about things like this.

[stjobe]

TheCharlatan, on 06 September 2015 - 04:07 AM, said:

Skill system needs a overhaul. It's been in "placeholder" state for way too long.

Sadly, it hasn't been in place-holder state since some time in open beta.

In closed beta we were told these skill trees were just place-holders for a real skill system.

In open beta we were told that these skill trees were no longer place-holders, they were what we were going to get.

And yes, that's a freaking shame. Not only for what it does to new players, but also for the way e.g. Speed Tweak and Twist Speed bonuses make 'mechs (especially heavies) way too fast and nimble.

All in all, I would dearly like to see a reworked skill system, but I find it unlikely that they'll ever get around to it.

[Yokaiko]

My personal favorite is paying the XP for pin-point when sliding convergence got turned off in open beta to reduce server load.

[El Bandito]

stjobe, on 06 September 2015 - 05:16 AM, said:

Sadly, it hasn't been in place-holder state since some time in open beta.

In closed beta we were told these skill trees were just place-holders for a real skill system.

In open beta we were told that these skill trees were no longer place-holders, they were what we were going to get.

And yes, that's a freaking shame. Not only for what it does to new players, but also for the way e.g. Speed Tweak and Twist Speed bonuses make 'mechs (especially heavies) way too fast and nimble.

All in all, I would dearly like to see a reworked skill system, but I find it unlikely that they'll ever get around to it.

Yokaiko, on 06 September 2015 - 05:22 AM, said:

My personal favorite is paying the XP for pin-point when sliding convergence got turned off in open beta to reduce server load.

How does PGI's balancing staff sleep at night, when the "Pinpoint" skill tree still exists?

Just when I started to praise PGI for one thing, I am reminded of many other things where they had goofed up.

Edited by El Bandito, 06 September 2015 - 05:28 AM.

[KharnZor]

Current NPE:

[Xoco]

sycocys, on 06 September 2015 - 04:32 AM, said:

It is possible you might be overestimating the value of the mech skills in the new/still casual player experience.

Getting that speed tweak is a difference between life and death on my Lights. When I was starting out, I don't have the cash to equip them, AND I run slower, so I can't outrun anything.
As a medium, life was nasty before I got the acceleration and hard brake skill. Not to mention I have lower heat threshold (that extra few percent is a difference between a mech shutdown and near overheat).
I haven't ventured much into Heavies and Assaults. I'm addicted to speed. But I bet it'd be quite painful until I can afford radar derp and seismic sensor quirks (which, after I factor buying a whole assault into the equation, is going to take a LONGGG time).

[Yokaiko]

El Bandito, on 06 September 2015 - 05:26 AM, said:

How does PGI's balancing staff sleep at night, when the "Pinpoint" skill tree still exists?

Just when I started to praise PGI for one thing, I am reminded of many other things where they had goofed up.

This is why I won't even pay for premium time anymore, much less $120 a time in mechs.

[sycocys]

Xoco, on 06 September 2015 - 05:51 AM, said:

Getting that speed tweak is a difference between life and death on my Lights. When I was starting out, I don't have the cash to equip them, AND I run slower, so I can't outrun anything.
As a medium, life was nasty before I got the acceleration and hard brake skill. Not to mention I have lower heat threshold (that extra few percent is a difference between a mech shutdown and near overheat).
I haven't ventured much into Heavies and Assaults. I'm addicted to speed. But I bet it'd be quite painful until I can afford radar derp and seismic sensor quirks (which, after I factor buying a whole assault into the equation, is going to take a LONGGG time).

There is a huge difference between what made a difference pre-PSR and now. People will actually be playing against people in their own skill tier. New players vs extra-casual and bad players the skill tree isn't going to make a whole lot of difference.

Starting out in tier 4 and pug (because new players are the most unlikely to be playing in groups) - the skill tree is just not that much of a factor at all.

[Scandinavian Jawbreaker]

Yup OP. IMO they should just ditch the double basic, it gives ridiculous upper hand in the battlefield. Or at least decrease it to 0.5x or something like that. If you look at other games giving tree bonuses they are really small... Like 2% chance to crit. Here in MWO they're completely out of hand.

[Squarebasher]

Give new players 25000 GXP to send.

[Johnny Z]

The new tutorial will help alot but Mechwarrior Onlines presentation to new players is just sad at the moment. Pathetic is another word that comes to mind.

Anyway, changing the way skills are handled is just another area of the game that is in a bad spot.

+1 for proper skills.