129 replies to this topic

[A sebaceous cyst]

BLOOD WOLF, on 12 September 2015 - 01:35 AM, said:

Construcitve feedback, not conclusive statements that do no lead to anything. IE. this sucks i wasted my time and thats my feedback(That helps no one)

Are you saying that is what I did? I did provide an example of what I see as problematic and I am sorry but I do not see this proposed re-balance as being very balanced because when you look at any chassis in the PTS there are vast differences that really don't make any sense from one variant to the other. I do honestly feel that the system we currently have (which in itself isn't perfect) is more balanced than what PGI is proposing on the PTS...if neither you nor Iraqi may agree with me that is fine but that doesn't make my opinion any less relevant. I posted my opinion and feedback because PGI requested feedback from the community, I didn't post it for anyone else's approval or for any other reason. If you felt like your time was wasted by reading my post for any reason I am sorry but I wasn't trying to meet your (or anyone else's) approval/standards/requirements when I wrote my feedback.

Edited by A sebaceous cyst, 12 September 2015 - 01:59 AM.

[Padde]

I really do look forward to those changes!

MWO was beeing praised as a "thinking man's shooter" - and while you need to play smart, there is often no space for any error because one faulty move mostly means instant death.

I call myself a meta-player and i do have ALL viable mechs for Clan or IS but with those massive quirks for mechs like the TDR-5SS, DRG-1N - the game went i a wrong direction.

Someone above mentioned the "time to kill" - TTK and I think, we should need much more time to kill an enemy mech.

With this new balancing system, there will be a real chance for a change of the overall gaming experience in MWO!

AND PLZ REMEMBER - this is all work in progress - so much room for improvements and further changes...
I really don't get why people are complaining NOW about some CT-structur here and there...

Edited by Padde, 12 September 2015 - 02:06 AM.

[BLOOD WOLF]

but you have to set the foundation and recognized that this is just the beginning and can be drastically subject to change. you need to start writing and talking as if you are looking for approval because you play and talk with others and talking to the void is pointless. if you state that your feedback is just yours and nothing more than why would pgi consider it? it has to make sense, and having constructive discussions allows us to slowly come to better conclusions. Im not saying what you say is less important.

[BLOOD WOLF]

Juodas Varnas, on 12 September 2015 - 01:54 AM, said:

Well... It does suck.
A lot.

It did tho

It was a wild shoot on their part, not saying its easy to find balance, and thank goodness we have a pts, just imagine if we were stuck with this till the next patch.

Edited by BLOOD WOLF, 12 September 2015 - 02:08 AM.

[Lily from animove]

IraqiWalker, on 12 September 2015 - 12:54 AM, said:

This is not a balance pass.

Seriously, how do people not understand what is going on here, despite it being mentioned at the beginning of most posts. This is the beginning of the test, of the first draft, of the first stage of the possible balance pass.

Why are people treating this like it's a final product?

because to give proper feedback you have to use this as the "final" version to adress issues. Then PGI may change this.

[Unnatural Growth]

Because PGI has a VERY strong history of putting something on the test server, asking for feedback, getting loads of feedback about things that don't work or we don't like, and then PUSHING IT OUT TO THE GAME SERVER AS IS ANYWAY!!

Do you get that?

So, they may "say" it's just the first step, and you may think it's the first step, but there are many that are just assuming that THIS is what we're gonna get on the live servers, and they're pissed about it.

And no, I haven't tried it yet myself, so no "feedback" from me yet. Maybe tonight I'll look around in the pts.

[Quardak]

do you see the last things PGI doing? Testing Mechlab... gettin tons of feedback AND putting it in !

So HELP and you WILL get answer


... i also like some wired quirks not really. BUT i try to give feedback so they can think about it...

ALL CRAP is no Feedback ... its MIMIMIII (do you hear a baby cry?)

Edited by Quardak, 12 September 2015 - 03:20 AM.

[PFC Carsten]

IraqiWalker, on 12 September 2015 - 01:16 AM, said:

In tabletop a single turn was 10 seconds, and a proper fight between 2 mechs lasted no more than 30-40 seconds. This game already has TTK equal to if not better than TT.

You are right - 10 seconds it was. But given that most weapons fire more than once every 5 seconds, DMG output still is twice as high as in TT, thus lowering TTK accordingly. Plus, in normal play, you didn't get to stuff your mech full of whatevers for maximum FLPPD.

That's why I stand by my point, TTK is the single point that need to be fixed in order to make MWO less a normal shooter and more about tactics, which, given the InfoTech-stuff, seems to be in line with what PGI is thinking/planning.

Edited by PFC Carsten, 12 September 2015 - 03:22 AM.

[RapierE01]

Am i right that this is only the "Sensors and Movement" Phase and the "Weapons and Equipment" Phase will come after this?

[Yokaiko]

PFC Carsten, on 12 September 2015 - 03:17 AM, said:

You are right - 10 seconds it was. But given that most weapons fire more than once every 5 seconds, DMG output still is twice as high as in TT, thus lowering TTK accordingly. Plus, in normal play, you didn't get to stuff your mech full of whatevers for maximum FLPPD.

That's why I stand by my point, TTK is the single point that need to be fixed in order to make MWO less a normal shooter and more about tactics, which, given the InfoTech-stuff, seems to be in line with what PGI is thinking/planning.

TTK is going to remain low as long as I can focus every weapon on a mech to ONE portion of the hit box, you see the monster tank bonus on Atlas -D, yeah, two alpha's bye bye RT just like always. Once that is handled you can kill it at leisure, just like always.

Damage output in DPS is at least 3.3 times TT, PPCs/AC20 are at 130% ROF, Gauss, right at 100% , just over 200% for LLAS, 240% mls/mpl/slas/spl etc. 1800% for AC2 900% AC5 500% AC10 etc

So why does the meta not revolve around missiles and ballistics? Because they don't focus as well in a game that makes lasers literally point and click.

Edited by Yokaiko, 12 September 2015 - 03:37 AM.

[Mekanïk Destruktïw Kommandöh]

Right now new quirking system looks horribly wrong.
I could write a long post, but it doesn't matter.
The only thing, I wish, you really will listen to what community saying.
Because current state is a total meaningless mess of movement/info quirks.

I really enjoy the balance we have right now in the game.
And if you will rebuild from scratch a new balance, please, do this without me.

[LastKhan]

Alot of quirks are very questionable. Can we give more positive quirks to the atlas? its been awhile since ive seen one if any on the battlefeild. The lynx.. why negs at all its already trash?

[InRev]

BLOOD WOLF, on 12 September 2015 - 02:07 AM, said:

It did tho

It was a wild shoot on their part, not saying its easy to find balance, and thank goodness we have a pts, just imagine if we were stuck with this till the next patch.

The sad thing is, based on PGI's track record, I wouldn't be at all surprised if this makes it to the live server without any changes. Remember the UI 2.0 test server and feedback?

Whole lotta good THAT did at the time. It took them months to bring the UI back to a usable state.

[Man with Axe]

All those quirks numbers look like taken absolutely out of air without any concern about chassis design and Mech's designation. Why structure bonuses? Why sensors debuffs? Had Paul ever graduated from high school? He is absolutely ignorant in physics.
Please fire Paul Inouye already. He is incompetent. How many more attempts since ECM implementation will you allow him to prove that? New quirks system is big enough proof of yelling incompetence, IMO (though old quirks system wasn't a sate of art at all).

If deployed on production server this patch will start the new era of few meta-chassis while 80% of rest Mechs will just dust'n'rust in hangars.

[Koshirou]

IraqiWalker, on 11 September 2015 - 11:27 PM, said:

This is a first draft of changes. We're not even close to a final draft, and somehow you immediately jumped to that phase?

If PGI radically change their approach to balancing I may radically change my stance on spending more money on MWO. But this is hypothetical. As things stand now, I'd consider it downright unethical to reward the level of quality produced by PGI.

I also don't see what you mean to accomplish by calling this a "first draft".

Either PGI is already definitely planning on reintroducing weapon quirks or a similar system later on - then testing the current setup is entirely pointless.

Or - and this is actually what it looks like to me - they really think they can do without any additional weapon balancing. In this case my original assertion applies, since no matter how much they fiddle with their current balancing parameters, they cannot balance Clans vs. IS.

Edited by Koshirou, 12 September 2015 - 07:48 AM.

[Lily from animove]

RapierE01, on 12 September 2015 - 03:27 AM, said:

Am i right that this is only the "Sensors and Movement" Phase and the "Weapons and Equipment" Phase will come after this?

No, entirely not, the townhall meeting clearly says if we find the change awesome it gets on live, otherwise probably a change on 22nd, which means delay of it coming on live.

And by this there is no W&E change planned.

Edited by Lily from animove, 12 September 2015 - 09:30 AM.

[Lexx]

Taking too long to find a match on the PTS.

Seems like everyone is looking at the numbers and making forum posts and no one is on the server actually testing them.

[Sinsabul]

I'm looking forward to this re-balance. I've always been against quirks. I'm a founder and have bought just about every package this year too between my account and my son's. I have all the clan and he has all the IS. I'm not going to whine about how, "I paid money, bla bla bla". I'm against nerfing MY mechs only because of the absurd quirks of the ones that aren't mine tbh, lol. In general, I've always thought it stupid that the exact same weapon can magically fire further/faster on one mech than on another, etc. Additionally, so much quirking has been done to bring IS mechs up to par with clan mechs that it contradicts all the lore. Seriously, it's kind of messed up when IS mechs cool faster and fire further than clan mechs. My concern here is that everything will still really have quirks but they will just be invisible to us (so still not remotely realistic...we just won't be able to SEE it to complain about numbers). That being said, I get the need for balance. This is a game designed to generate money - at least, it needs to in order to keep going. The best way to do that is to keep people happy across the board as best you can and THAT means balance. So, lets see what you have for us...

Edited by Sinsabul, 12 September 2015 - 03:55 PM.

[Kirtanus]

Current PTS set of movement/sensors quirks looks terrible and awful. Most of the mechs are lossing any sense of using them which was partly revived by curreent quirk system. I want to see movement/sensor quirks but as 2nd line of balancing after you get weapons/armour(not structure) quirks in right place.

[Kmieciu]

Sinsabul, on 12 September 2015 - 11:45 AM, said:

IS mechs cool faster

There is currently no quirk affecting cooling on live servers.