40 replies to this topic

[Damien Tokala]

i'm sorry, but this is not what the people want, and it is not what the people need. i advise we return to full tabletop values, and then double the armor/ammo count. begone with ghost heat unless it's a LASER VOMIT build. cool down the PPCs, since they're barely a threat compared to large pulse on both sides.

look! oh look! everyone will be HAPPY! people will come back! and MORE CUSTOMERS!

and remove these agility nerfs, that stuff is just stupid. the information warfare however, i agree with, and i'm happy with.

[GoodTry]

I don't know why people are obsessed with tabletop values. This is a video game. Table top values make no sense here. There is no convergence, no randomness to where your hits are placed, etc.

[Alek Ituin]

GoodTry, on 11 September 2015 - 05:40 PM, said:

There is no convergence, no randomness to where your hits are placed, etc.

Maybe there should be.

[Damien Tokala]

maybe we should be going more for tabletop style

[Drunk Canuck]

GoodTry, on 11 September 2015 - 05:40 PM, said:

I don't know why people are obsessed with tabletop values. This is a video game. Table top values make no sense here. There is no convergence, no randomness to where your hits are placed, etc.

Yeah but Small Pulse Lasers only do 3 damage, not 6 like they do in MWO.

[Damien Tokala]

yeah i found it a little stupid that 5 small pulse lasers is damage equivalent of two gauss rifles...

[Night Thastus]

I made a very comprehensive analysis of the PTS, but for now, I will say that perhaps TT did have it right in some regards. I think if we had convergence taken away, ghost heat taken away, the original heat cap of 30, true doubles, lore-powerful JJ's, and everything else, we might just get a game where quirks wouldn't be an issue, and where the rules would sort things out.

[SpectreHD]

Night Thastus, on 11 September 2015 - 08:37 PM, said:

I made a very comprehensive analysis of the PTS, but for now, I will say that perhaps TT did have it right in some regards. I think if we had convergence taken away, ghost heat taken away, the original heat cap of 30, true doubles, lore-powerful JJ's, and everything else, we might just get a game where quirks wouldn't be an issue, and where the rules would sort things out.

Hey, noob here. What does having a heat cap of 30 mean and how is lore JJs different fro, ingame?

[Telmasa]

This PTS is what I want and is what I need. Tabletop values were broken, imbalanced, and wrong on many levels, and definitely do not need to be followed to the letter. I would not be happy with the changes you came up with.

There is a lot that needs ironing out.
There is alot of weapon balance that would be nice now that weapon quirks are gone.
There is much work yet to be done.

But it's several steps on the way to where it will/needs to be, and taking 500 steps back to what you propose here would be extremely foolish.

[Volkodav]

Gauss without charge and damage the Clan ERPPC - 15

[Victorion]

Alek Ituin, on 11 September 2015 - 05:56 PM, said:

Maybe there should be.

Yes, that's what I want.

When I shoot at a mech, I want a hidden RNG dice roll to determine that it hit its shin, rather then the CT I was shooting for.

[Ragnahawk]

Why can't we just add stuff that's fun instead of digging up old graves?

[Bleary]

The TT numbers have always been broken. Yes, even without convergence. The balance in MWO has never been as bad as it is in the tabletop game.

Edited by Bleary, 12 September 2015 - 04:48 AM.

[Antares102]

Damien Tokala, on 11 September 2015 - 05:37 PM, said:

i'm sorry, but this is not what the people want, and it is not what the people need. i advise we return to full tabletop values, and then double the armor/ammo count. begone with ghost heat unless it's a LASER VOMIT build. cool down the PPCs, since they're barely a threat compared to large pulse on both sides.

look! oh look! everyone will be HAPPY! people will come back! and MORE CUSTOMERS!

and remove these agility nerfs, that stuff is just stupid. the information warfare however, i agree with, and i'm happy with.

If you want to play table top go ahead... play table top.
This game is based (mostly) on skill. Table top is based on roling 12 all the time.

[Damien Tokala]

Victorion, on 11 September 2015 - 11:16 PM, said:

Yes, that's what I want.

When I shoot at a mech, I want a hidden RNG dice roll to determine that it hit its shin, rather then the CT I was shooting for.

I've said nothing about dice rolls and convergence, I'm talking about the numbers. This weapon deals this damage and generates this heat.

I said tabletop VALUES, so of course I'm referring to hard numerical data, and not random chance.

[Antares102]

Damien Tokala, on 12 September 2015 - 03:05 AM, said:

I've said nothing about dice rolls and convergence, I'm talking about the numbers. This weapon deals this damage and generates this heat.

I said tabletop VALUES, so of course I'm referring to hard numerical data, and not random chance.

Yes, but the VALUES are bound to a system that is based on DICE roles.

[Lily from animove]

This is also not what balance needed.

[Damien Tokala]

If a weapon so happens to deal its full damage due to a specific dice roll, then it makes sense that skill level is substitute for said dice roll. If you can keep a laser on target, hey, you might as well have rolled a 6 because you've done full damage.

So if a small laser deals 3 damage maximum of its entire potential damage, then let it deal exactly that.

These turn rate quirks, sensor and whatnot, it's not something listed, so it's left to interpretation.


This ghost heat system in particular screws up alot of balance, but I see a need for it. Since laser vomit can be so dreadfully devastating.

What we need is for specific weapons to have specific quirks as well. gauss is a heavy sucker to mount, and as such should have a higher health.

Ppc is hot, and are known to affect targeting, allow it it's own heatsink slots, and getting hit by ppc knocks out all coms information for a time.

It's really NOT hard to balance this out, mechs were never meant to be this tanky, but were made so for the immersion.

Sorry if things seem so mashed together, I need time to form my argument about things in a way that don't have various curse words and insults to certain horrible developers.

[Alek Ituin]

Victorion, on 11 September 2015 - 11:16 PM, said:

Yes, that's what I want.

When I shoot at a mech, I want a hidden RNG dice roll to determine that it hit its shin, rather then the CT I was shooting for.

Then get non-space future targeting systems.

Sorry buddy, but you're playing in giant stompy robots generally produced in automated factories, using tech easily 500 years old, of which half is a complete mystery, and the other half is only barely understood. All of which is presided over by the Adeptus Mechani... ComStar... who maintains an iron grip on any knowledge that remains.


You shoot at the CT? Well the machine spirit of your 500yr. old targeting system says otherwise.

Deal with it.

[Yokaiko]

GoodTry, on 11 September 2015 - 05:40 PM, said:

I don't know why people are obsessed with tabletop values. This is a video game. Table top values make no sense here. There is no convergence, no randomness to where your hits are placed, etc.

Although it wasn't your point, you touched on it.

GET RID OF PERFECT CONVERGENCE right meow.