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Rebalance Means I Will No Longer Support This Game.


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#61 Andi Nagasia

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Posted 14 September 2015 - 06:48 PM

View Postoldradagast, on 14 September 2015 - 06:09 PM, said:

There is a vast difference between "things change" and "we've decided to rewrite the game into something vastly different than what you've been buying and playing so far because this shaky idea on the back of a napkin says so." Do you like the mechs you bought? Tough - we broke them. Buy some new ones instead! Right... :rolleyes:

With all the people floating around here who seem offended that paying customers might not like having what they purchased being morphed into something else at somebody else's whim, it is no wonder that corporations have such an easy time selling crap to consumers and getting them to blow fortunes on upgrades and other junk.

But, hey - there's always another mech pack on sale, and maybe those mechs won't suck or have lame, non-combat "roles" - at least until you're done buying them...

remember some of us who also are paying Customers want a more balanced game,
its a 2 way street, not everyone will like this new take on a 4 pillar system but i think its for the better, :)

also there is this,

its a good listen if your willing to, :)

#62 DivineEvil

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Posted 14 September 2015 - 09:15 PM

View Postoldradagast, on 14 September 2015 - 06:09 PM, said:


There is a vast difference between "things change" and "we've decided to rewrite the game into something vastly different than what you've been buying and playing so far because this shaky idea on the back of a napkin says so." Do you like the mechs you bought? Tough - we broke them. Buy some new ones instead! Right... :rolleyes:

With all the people floating around here who seem offended that paying customers might not like having what they purchased being morphed into something else at somebody else's whim, it is no wonder that corporations have such an easy time selling crap to consumers and getting them to blow fortunes on upgrades and other junk.

But, hey - there's always another mech pack on sale, and maybe those mechs won't suck or have lame, non-combat "roles" - at least until you're done buying them...

The objective is to make your mechs as good as other mechs, nothing else. When you've been buying your mechs, it gave you the name, the concept art, hardpoints and stats. Nowhere there were any notification of "this mech is the best, it's gonna crush everything released earlier". And when that happens in reality, it is not intended and is not how it should be. However attached you've become to your cheesy toys holds no water to the idea, that each mech must represent it's tonnage, role and variant competetively, whether it is a two-year-old, original four IS mech or a brand new preorder Clan mech.

#63 ShinVector

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Posted 14 September 2015 - 11:43 PM

View PostDivineEvil, on 14 September 2015 - 09:15 PM, said:

The objective is to make your mechs as good as other mechs, nothing else.


We hear this point but it question... What can they do to the Spider 5V and the 20 Tonners ? LOL...

Also too bad the final summary below made no mention that PTS was 'a sensor quirk test.'
The community blow up was PGI's own doing.. LOL..

Really hope they are can fix the current issues without the weapons quirks though.

Quote

TL;DR:
* You should read the above.
* The current quirk system is not working as intended.
* The new system brings 'Mechs much more closely in line with each other while adding role and information warfare in a much deeper meaning to each 'Mech.
* This is the first pass at numbers and your feedback is requested.
* There are bugs and missing information elements but they will be addressed in a later build.


#64 DivineEvil

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Posted 15 September 2015 - 12:49 AM

View PostShinVector, on 14 September 2015 - 11:43 PM, said:


We hear this point but it question... What can they do to the Spider 5V and the 20 Tonners ? LOL...

Also too bad the final summary below made no mention that PTS was 'a sensor quirk test.'
The community blow up was PGI's own doing.. LOL..

Really hope they are can fix the current issues without the weapons quirks though.

The point is, mass is what determines mech's average value. In Community Warfare there's no such thing as "top-end mediums" or "low-end assaults". Mech is valued just by how good it stands for it's mass, nothing else. Same will be true when PGI will implement a Group Queue by-mass balancing.

What can they do to the Spider 5V? Make him as good as all other Spiders for other purposes. Nothing else to do.
What can they do to the 20tonners? There's nothing to do. It's 20tonners. A good 20tonner can backstab a 100 tonner, and it takes about the same expertise to be a good 20tonner, as a good 100tonner, just in different aspects.

#65 ShinVector

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Posted 15 September 2015 - 01:00 AM

View PostDivineEvil, on 15 September 2015 - 12:49 AM, said:

What can they do to the Spider 5V? Make him as good as all other Spiders for other purposes. Nothing else to do.
What can they do to the 20tonners? There's nothing to do. It's 20tonners. A good 20tonner can backstab a 100 tonner, and it takes about the same expertise to be a good 20tonner, as a good 100tonner, just in different aspects.


PGI needs to surprise us really.. so much hyped was built for the 'rebalance' and the end result was a huge blow up.

Honestly there are players in this game that I know want to lights purely scouting and command purposes...
MWO.. does not reward this at all...

Make LRM strong but requires lights to disable ECM and hold super locks ?
Huge sensor buffs for weak hardpoint lights like 5V or nerfed 20 tonners ?
Cbills and XP for locks, damage done and assist lock kills ?
Whos knows....

PGI surprise us in the next PTS...

Edited by ShinVector, 15 September 2015 - 01:00 AM.


#66 NeoRocket

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Posted 15 September 2015 - 01:28 AM

View PostHornsby, on 13 September 2015 - 04:54 PM, said:

I hope I'm not adding to all the doomsaying around here. I'm glad that PGI is taking this route to get the game balanced, once and for all so to speak. All I wished to contribute was that the OP's sentiment isn't an outlier. PGI should really try to get this right and avoid another quirkening in the future.

Once and for all... He said... No really... He said... Ahahahah No really then he said... Get this. "Once... And for all!" AAAAAAhahahaaha He said Once and for all... Of PGI! No! You CAN'T make this **** up he really said it! No Im NOT lying. Seriously... I KNOW!

#67 oldradagast

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Posted 15 September 2015 - 03:11 AM

View PostDivineEvil, on 14 September 2015 - 09:15 PM, said:

The objective is to make your mechs as good as other mechs, nothing else. When you've been buying your mechs, it gave you the name, the concept art, hardpoints and stats. Nowhere there were any notification of "this mech is the best, it's gonna crush everything released earlier". And when that happens in reality, it is not intended and is not how it should be. However attached you've become to your cheesy toys holds no water to the idea, that each mech must represent it's tonnage, role and variant competetively, whether it is a two-year-old, original four IS mech or a brand new preorder Clan mech.


So, "stats" are part of the mechs we buy, and those stats are being changed to heaven only knows what, but that's ok? Come on! And you really can't understand why people aren't happy with their "cheesy toys" being broken for no good reason? Wow - I'm sure your rousing speech about "suck it up" will really encourage people to keep spending money on this game. But, hey - if you want to buy a steaming pile of trash mech that changes functions every 6 months to relive your childhood, be my guest. Just don't be shocked when the game tanks because of this constant "change everything randomly!" mindset that has crept in since the Clans were released.

As for the rest, if you honestly think I'm worried that my Dual Gauss Direwolf won't be meta-king anymore, than you know nothing about me (I don't even own such a mech) and thus should't be posting such snotty assumptions about my motives. Save your venom for the PGI and don't waste it people pointing out the facts.

Edited by oldradagast, 15 September 2015 - 03:13 AM.


#68 DivineEvil

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Posted 15 September 2015 - 05:03 AM

View Postoldradagast, on 15 September 2015 - 03:11 AM, said:


So, "stats" are part of the mechs we buy, and those stats are being changed to heaven only knows what, but that's ok? Come on! And you really can't understand why people aren't happy with their "cheesy toys" being broken for no good reason? Wow - I'm sure your rousing speech about "suck it up" will really encourage people to keep spending money on this game. But, hey - if you want to buy a steaming pile of trash mech that changes functions every 6 months to relive your childhood, be my guest. Just don't be shocked when the game tanks because of this constant "change everything randomly!" mindset that has crept in since the Clans were released.

As for the rest, if you honestly think I'm worried that my Dual Gauss Direwolf won't be meta-king anymore, than you know nothing about me (I don't even own such a mech) and thus should't be posting such snotty assumptions about my motives. Save your venom for the PGI and don't waste it people pointing out the facts.

Ok, here's the deal. I'm looking at the Marauder pre-order offer.
It tells me what mechs I will recieve, what are additional virtual goods I will get and what are bonuses for Early Adopter order.
It tells me what is the tonnage, stock loadout, hardpoints and the visual representation of those mechs are.
It DOESN'T tells me what are the quirks for them will be, how good that mech will be at any time, what are the turn rates, angular limits, what the hitboxes are, what the meta will be at the time or anything else for that matter.

And I'm still going to pre-order as early adopter. You know why? Not because I'm a power-creep, who wants more cheesy toys. I will do it because I like how it looks, I like how Heavies play, I like Inner Sphere mechs, I love MWO, I respect PGI and I want to support them, so they can hire more people, make MWO better, get more people playing it, get better at their job, so they can keep providing for all the players, even if they're unaware of their position like you are. And for the same reason I do not care if the balance shifts, and if some of my mechs will not going to play as good as they're used to, because all of it is done for balance! I will wait for as long as it will take, and will offer my feedback. This is what is in my RIGHTS to do. It isn't in my rights to insult or abuse PGI because it's THEIR game, not mine.

Video games are not just "entertainment industry". Video games are the most modern and most complicated kind of art we have developed. There are writers, 2D-artists, 3D-artists, voice actors, composers, musicians and sound engineers working in it. You're not usually supposed to ask for returns for the books you didn't liked, or the artist galleries you didn't liked, or the cinema films you didn't liked or the music compositions you didn't liked. You pay for them, and recieve. Here now, you can ask support for a return of two. But if you don't like how development goes and can't find trust to put your money into it, then don't! And if you don't like the game, then don't play it, plain and simple.

And yes, I do not understand when people are whining over their overpowered toys, its irritating. I don't have any of those, because they would make me less competetive, and the game less challenging. I do, however stand for the balance in MWO. MWO is a business, which need to satistfy as many players as it can, otherwise it will not persist. If the balance and stats of mechs will change, then so shall it be. I believe, that the game in its present state is roughly a third of what it can be with a well established balance. This is a good reason to break everything to smithereens and get a fresh look, if that what it takes.

And sincerely, I don't really care if some of my own mechs will become a "steaming pile of trash" for a while, I have over 60 of them to shoose from. If you're think that you're somehow subscribed to have all the best bits, that are going to win you matches for you, then you should really grow up a bit. Liking a mech and relying on it to be competetive are two different things. If you like the mech, then it doesn't matter much if it's meta-unviable or something. You do not look on such a mech in that light. If you want it to be good, then leave your feedback, and do a good job on that for once. You're the one who's spitting venom around, just in case you didn't noticed.

Oh, and don't straw-man me. It's just silly. ^_^

Edited by DivineEvil, 15 September 2015 - 05:05 AM.


#69 Motroid

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Posted 15 September 2015 - 06:36 AM

View PostDivineEvil, on 15 September 2015 - 05:03 AM, said:

*words of wisdom*

Thank you very much for taking the time to write this up.
Forum bursts with spoiled brats and arrogant ****** feeling entitled to something they are not.
You are showing true and mature love for MW:O and I am sharing your thoughts.
Thanks again, that was a good and rewarding read.

#70 Kageru Ikazuchi

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Posted 15 September 2015 - 06:38 AM

View Postoldradagast, on 15 September 2015 - 03:11 AM, said:

... if you honestly think I'm worried that my Dual Gauss Direwolf won't be meta-king anymore, than you know nothing about me (I don't even own such a mech) and thus should't be posting such snotty assumptions about my motives. ...


Then what exactly are you bitching about? If it's not PGI re-balancing your OP toys, then what?

#71 Mystere

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Posted 15 September 2015 - 07:44 AM

View PostKageru Ikazuchi, on 15 September 2015 - 06:38 AM, said:

Then what exactly are you bitching about? If it's not PGI re-balancing your OP toys, then what?


Some people are just bitching for the sake of bitching.

#72 MechaBattler

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Posted 15 September 2015 - 08:04 AM

It is each player's prerogative to choose not to make further purchases if they don't like where the game is heading. But this is only the preliminary rebalance testing. And probably one of the few PTS where they insist that they'll take feedback and make changes, before eventually deciding if it goes live.

Chances are very good that people will not like the changes. Right now Clans have the best mechs for each class in the game. And if they manage to achieve a state of balance that puts the IS on a more level playing field. Some people are just going to be upset because their "favorite" thing is no longer the meta. But that reminds to be seen.

I certainly like the tanky Atlas quirks. But I very much feel like weapon quirks need to make a come back. I don't like Sean Lang's notion that armor and structure with a generic 10% cooldown as distinction. If the Atlas gets to be the tanky beast it ought to be. Then things like the Awesome should be the PPC siege beast it ought to be.





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