15 replies to this topic

[Zigmund Freud]

Greetings. Most people don't like CW not because of clans vs IS balance, and not because of it's harder and more demanding than QP. People hate CW because it has absolutely no matchmaking. Tier 4 pug newbies get dropped against premade tryhard unit and get roflstomped for 10 long and boring minutes. And 12-men tryhard pro team go sealclub urbies. Eventually CW sucks for both participating teams, and entire match time is wasted for both.
The simplest matchmaker would fix it all. Not talking about some complicated calculation of tiers and tonnages. Just let people play against their weight category: premades play against other premades, and casuals plays against other casuals.

Inb4: not enough players.
1) there's not enough players playing CW for this very reason: no matchmaking. For some reason people prefer to play fair game. Fix matchmaker and people will follow, because CW gameplay is quite fun, including casuals with ingame VoIP VS other casuals.
2) throwing in 12-men premade against pugs to reduce "searching match" time is a bad idea, since 10 minutes of match is basically wasted for both sides, and neither team had fun gaming experience and competition. With matchmaking searching will take longer, but in result both premades and casuals will play better balanced and fair match.

Inb4: some tryhards like to stand near dropships and "farm noobs" for cbills.
Well, game is supposed to be played for fun, and both teams should have their fun. If somebody's definition of fun is spending 10 minutes spawn killing helpless newbies to earn imaginary money - too bad, sorry for spoiling such fun.


tl;dr
matchmaker, that let pugs play against pugs, and premades against premades will fix CW, attract more players into this mode and make it more fun to play.

[NARC BAIT]

Zigmund Freud, on 09 May 2017 - 09:32 AM, said:

For some reason people prefer to play fair game. Fix matchmaker and people will follow, because CW ga

any player who actually goes looking for a fair game, leaves MWO before too long, because, you never get one ...

and war isn't meant to be fair, or balanced, and half the reasons why people leave this game, is because its always so far from being balanced, that your not sure if your the butt of a bad joke ...

I wont play CW, there is nothing community about it, there is no continuity between games ... you cant attract me to play CW, when the bias is so badly towards the clans .... fine, give them range and weapons advantages, like in lore, but to balance that out, make there less of them, like in lore ...

pgi would rather mask imbalance, then address it ...

I don't disagree with the pre-made stuff .... but that's not the only thing that makes the whole mode, pointless .... clearly incursion should be a CW mode, where fresh mechs are always turning up at base to repel 0 dmg hero's ...

[50 50]

If you've only just experienced Faction Play because of the T3 event, then everything you have talked about has been discussed and various things tried.

There is not enough people participating in Faction Play to split into solos and groups or any other sort of division.
You just won't get any games. (It was tried in some form a while back)
Because there is not enough players, you can't have a more complex match maker that helps to match players of different skill levels vs each other.

Remember this is a 24/7 thing. Faction Play might get some decent numbers at different times of the day, but any to make changes based on that small period will have dramatic effects during the other times.

So... no. I don't believe any of these suggestions will help.
However, no one seems to consider flipping the system on it's head and doing away with the match maker entirely in favour of a more visible system where we can pick smaller engagements, see who we fight against, have less restrictive objectives and allow us to retreat should the fight go against us. ie. A dynamic way to play the mode?

[Zigmund Freud]

50 50, on 10 May 2017 - 02:43 AM, said:

If you've only just experienced Faction Play because of the T3 event, then everything you have talked about has been discussed and various things tried.

There is not enough people participating in Faction Play to split into solos and groups or any other sort of division.
You just won't get any games. (It was tried in some form a while back)
Because there is not enough players, you can't have a more complex match maker that helps to match players of different skill levels vs each other.

Remember this is a 24/7 thing. Faction Play might get some decent numbers at different times of the day, but any to make changes based on that small period will have dramatic effects during the other times.

So... no. I don't believe any of these suggestions will help.
However, no one seems to consider flipping the system on it's head and doing away with the match maker entirely in favour of a more visible system where we can pick smaller engagements, see who we fight against, have less restrictive objectives and allow us to retreat should the fight go against us. ie. A dynamic way to play the mode?

You're right, I've stopped playing CW maybe 1-2 years ago, because constantly got dropped against premades. No matchmaker is exactly the reason why I stopped playing CW, and why all players whom I presonally know stopped.
Take for example this event. Thousands of pugs are playing CW, not just for rewards, but also because it's fun. If they would be able to play against equal oponent - a lot of them would stay.

[Nesutizale]

For me wait times and the clubbing ended FW me. Sadly is quite unforgiving for smaller units or new players as is. Thats also a reason why it will never grow but slowly boil down to the few units that don't drop in their own MC fueled matches.

Problem we face is, without new players FW will die but without a "easy mode" for new player to learn it, beeing on the same level as others, only 1 or 2 of 20 might still be playing after their first few matches.

Also FW has become more and more a very restricting playground where you can only have a climps of fun when you conform to playing the current meta while QP gives you so much more ways to play a game.
You aren't forced to improve and conform, just stay at your Tier and have fun or push your limits, both is possible.

So I did say lets drop the facade of FW that it is anything else then a Units VS Units playground.
Let just the Faction-Reward system stand so units can play under their favorite banner and replace everything else with a Blackboard where Units can post their Droptimes and leave messages for other units to organize fights.

Edited by Nesutizale, 12 May 2017 - 08:23 AM.

[Zigmund Freud]

Nesutizale, on 12 May 2017 - 08:22 AM, said:

For me wait times and the clubbing ended FW me. Sadly is quite unforgiving for smaller units or new players as is. Thats also a reason why it will never grow but slowly boil down to the few units that don't drop in their own MC fueled matches.

Problem we face is, without new players FW will die but without a "easy mode" for new player to learn it, beeing on the same level as others, only 1 or 2 of 20 might still be playing after their first few matches.

Also FW has become more and more a very restricting playground where you can only have a climps of fun when you conform to playing the current meta while QP gives you so much more ways to play a game.
You aren't forced to improve and conform, just stay at your Tier and have fun or push your limits, both is possible.

So I did say lets drop the facade of FW that it is anything else then a Units VS Units playground.
Let just the Faction-Reward system stand so units can play under their favorite banner and replace everything else with a Blackboard where Units can post their Droptimes and leave messages for other units to organize fights.

But pugs also like CW's game modes. Why CW have to be tryhards only?
Edit: fixed grammar

Edited by Zigmund Freud, 14 May 2017 - 12:43 AM.

[Nesutizale]

I can buy PUGs?`Where, gimme!!! ^__°
Seriously, I am one of these PUGs that likes to stick his nose into FW from time to time too and yes I also think why should it be tryhards only.

Maybe I haven't made myself clear. Currently I see that FW allready IS (not Innersphere) tryhard only. Its not a matter of becomming like that. Look at the attitude that a lot of people have in the forums. Just to quote some:
"We shouldn't allow people that haven't mastered mechs"
"No to people without modules"
"No trailmechs, only meta allowed"

These and that there is no matchmaker to keep PUGs seperated from Units, forceing you to either play with a units that will force you to go with the meta or leave is a roundabout way to tell you
"This is an ELITE club and you don't belong here"

Theirfore I came to say "...lets drop the facade of FW that it is anything else then a Units VS Units playground."

[GI Journalist]

In my opinion, we only need three planet battles for Faction Play. A Clan vs. Inner Sphere battle like Tukayyid, a Clan vs. Clan battle, and an Inner Sphere vs. Inner Sphere battle such as Solaris. This would provide a variety of matches in Faction Play for all players, without diluting the player base over more than two or three buckets.

[Zigmund Freud]

Nesutizale, on 13 May 2017 - 03:17 AM, said:

These and that there is no matchmaker to keep PUGs seperated from Units, forceing you to either play with a units that will force you to go with the meta or leave is a roundabout way to tell you..

The very point of matchmaker is to keep PUGs separated from Units - by making drops pugVSpug and unitVSunit. And it is beneficial for both groups, as they get to play against equals.
Why would you limit CW to tryhards VS tryhards only, if you can make it playable for both tryhards and casuals?

GI Journalist, on 13 May 2017 - 06:37 AM, said:

In my opinion, we only need three planet battles for Faction Play. A Clan vs. Inner Sphere battle like Tukayyid, a Clan vs. Clan battle, and an Inner Sphere vs. Inner Sphere battle such as Solaris. This would provide a variety of matches in Faction Play for all players, without diluting the player base over more than two or three buckets.

And the planets change over time. This, plus unit's owned planets, where they can fight other units in organised 12vs12 fassion.

[Kalleballe]

50 50, on 10 May 2017 - 02:43 AM, said:

There is not enough people participating in Faction Play to split into solos and groups or any other sort of division.
You just won't get any games. (It was tried in some form a while back)

Incorrect, the previous attempt failed because it doubled the number of "conflicts" instead of matching all is pugs vs all clan pugs.

The real problem is this will make casual players enjoy the game more, and PGI (almost) never improve their game without making it worse somewhere else.

Edited by Kalleballe, 15 May 2017 - 02:24 AM.

[Simos The Greek]

Lets talk about CW!!
I have play with inner, and clan. There is balance of weapons, but no for teams. Premade sould play vs premade. One way to fix this without force of premade vs premade, is to make max group 4 people.
Why there is no people in CW? I play only Siege. Why to play other mode with 4 drops?
How many old players you have lose?
Yes, i have get many ghost drops in the past!! I prefer to wait and play Siege more than crazy 4 drops conquest.
Just make some maps for siege.. its realy so hard to make 2-3 more maps?!
The cost of hero mechs is outstanding.. and the cbills without premium is too low.
30-50 euros for one mech?!!! this game is not pay to win anyway.. Stop selling mechs and mc.
What to do? Give more mc in events (as old events), boost normal cbill earnings, make premium time "subscription" with low cost and mc earning. Example of subsciption: "20 euros for 6 months" 10-20 mc per match.
Give 6 month free subsciption to new players.
The skill tree is in good direction.. but i am afraid will boost hard premade groups (old players).

Edited by Sakis, 15 May 2017 - 04:06 AM.

[Zigmund Freud]

Sakis, on 15 May 2017 - 03:47 AM, said:

The cost of hero mechs is outstanding.. and the cbills without premium is too low.
30-50 euros for one mech?!!! this game is not pay to win anyway.. Stop selling mechs and mc.
What to do? Give more mc in events (as old events), boost normal cbill earnings, make premium time "subscription" with low cost and mc earning. Example of subsciption: "20 euros for 6 months" 10-20 mc per match.
Give 6 month free subsciption to new players.

You don't really get how free games works. MWO is actual free to play, where all premiun content is strictly optional, and is not rediculously OP. The only premium thing that was actually better - consumables - are also becoming buyable for cbills.
All those hero mechs, camo, fancy paintjob and cockpit items are optional premium content, and you can easily live without it. It's a good thing.

[Rick T Dangerous]

Well, personally I love CW in the current version. And I'm not in a unit. Going with a bunch of PUGs or solo players against a unit or a team consisting of two or three units is a challenge. And it's very annoying when a unit walks straight to the spawn site to "farm". Spawn farming is the major problem I see in CW, and there should be ways to fix that. Maybe giving the dropships lasers instakill beams. Or an algorithm that detects spawn farming and the farming team gets no rewards (rep., c-bills, XP and GXP) for the game (including zero kills, zero KMDDs, zero damage done for their statistics. But deaths count for stats).

I have to ask: why is there a minimum tonnage restriction for dropdecks? Most people seem to build their decks as close to maximum as possible. And if a player is best in lights, why force that player to use heavier mechs? I'd buy a fourth cheetah if I could use em all in one deck.... ...and should the firemoth arrive... muhahahaha

Sakis, on 15 May 2017 - 03:47 AM, said:

Why to play other mode with 4 drops?

Because they are completely different in CW. For example: Conquest in CW can't be won by just killing the other team as it can be won in QP, you need to cap in CW. Domination (a mode that I hate) is fun in CW, because it suddenly ceases to be skirmish at the kiddie pool. The only mode in CW that is boring is skirmish, it doesn't gain much. But I have to say that whenever I play CW-skirmish and who ever takes command of our team forbids spawn farming (once the caller explicitly said "give them time to regroup and coordinate"), I feel happy inside...

Edited by Rick T Dangerous, 15 May 2017 - 04:45 PM.

[Telemachus -Salt Wife Salt Life-]

Remember that time when PGI created a separate queue for "PUGs/Solo Players/Non-Unit People" and it ended up with the pugs/solos creating their own one person units so they can play with the tryhards? Yeah, me too.

[naterist]

Telemachus Rheade, on 15 May 2017 - 06:24 PM, said:

Remember that time when PGI created a separate queue for "PUGs/Solo Players/Non-Unit People" and it ended up with the pugs/solos creating their own one person units so they can play with the tryhards? Yeah, me too.

which is why you dont do it like a potatoe on dope. we arent talking unit v unit and nonunit v nonunit. were talking group size for that moment or that particular game. i dont even think it needs to be group and solo based though. you could put small groups of 3 or less in solo que, and groups of 4 or more have their own que. then allow solos whove reached level 20 be eligable as filler for either que, since they probably have an idea of whats going on, but no more then 5 lvl 20 filler pilots per team in the big group que.

[Archer Magnus]

I agree with OP, a PUG faction play would make it worthwhile for someone like me who wants to play solo (I only have short bits of time that I can play).

Another way to do this is to add Drop Decks to Quickplay. Have it as all PUG, and you earn some faction points. Not exactly the same, but more balanced. Then you would have longer games and since there would have waves of enemies you would have to PTO more.