39 replies to this topic

[z MadButcher z]

They are both good mechs but the coming re balance is frightening. As quirks sit right now the Wolverine is a monster. The 6K is my personal favorite and my main ride in competitive matches. 4 LL and an XL280 it is fast and hits hard. Run a cool shot 9x9 and you can melt almost anything before you overheat. If the quirks change the 7K will be really the only viable one, and it will be an SRM brawler. The Cicada is still a good mech, but it relies on quirks too. I think that either one will be a good choice and it really depends on what your play style is.

[Mazzyplz]

solid advice from terciel i would also go xl300,


there's one more thing though- i believe cicada will get a new variant soon OP.

it seems we all forgot about this (i certainly did) but there will be a jumpjet cicada coming some time in the near future

[InspectorG]

RIP: Wubverine. Such fun was not meant for the world of Man. Perhaps in another Universe???

Cicadas are my pimp ride. For some reason, the X5 being my favorite. With a ML module you get just about Clan ERML range!
If only it was 5E, 1M....sigh.

xl300 are the engine to have for Cicadas, cut some speed for some cooling.

I use Cicadas as poke/sniper/flanker.

I normally dont recommend Brawling in a Cicada unless its late match. Those Hitboxes just catch way too many hits and the arms only shield your rear 5 and 8 o'clock - basically useless.

Cicadas:

A is the ML beast. XL300 and as much DHS as you can shove in. With modules you get ok range but nice duration/cooldown.

B is the Wubs. xl300, 5MPL, DHS. Wub them till their face falls off. WUBBA WUBBA LUB LUB!!!

C is the sad ERPPC sniper. If it only had another E hardpoint.... Sad. ERPPC+4MG for cleanup work or ERPPC+AC5. May have to use a smaller engine.

M is the ECM caddy. Most overvalue the ECM. Use a Target Dep module and hug terrain. 2LL+2ML, 2ERLL+2ML, 1LPL+3ML, 2PPC(shave the arm armor and head - smaller engine), UAC5(why?)+3ML
I prefer the Bolded.

X5. You get missiles...but im not sold on them. xl300 frees up tonnage. If you are WAY sneaky, go xl340+4ML+dhs...dont get caught.
I use 1LPL+3ML which synchs up pretty well. Not powerfull but support the fat mechs and you can do a lot. 2LL+2ML is ok.
Now Stock 4ML+2SRM2 works decent as a striker. 2SRM4 may be better and has likely the best Alpha for the Cicada.
SRM6 is not worth it, IMO, cant spare tonnage for Artemis and the spread diminishes it compared to the SRM4.

3ERLL CAN snipe over 800m optimal. If your positioning is good, you can do stupid stuff to the enemy. Peppering enemy assaults on the battle line in their back at 800+m is lols. Just dont get caught alone by a AC or FS, you will die.

Now...for trolling. 2LRM5 could, in theory, be used with 4ML to harass assaults and other slow targets. Just remember its a (Clan)ML poke mech that uses LRMs to suppress newbs. Its NOT a LRM boat.

The new Cicada i will likely use PPC poptarting...because f*ck it.

Best general advice i can give for the Cicadas, pull range and poke. Support the fat mechs(they should get shot at more than you). USE TERRAIN to shield, you have sh*tboxes despite your speed. 'LEET' speed is best speed, more has diminished returns on tonnage-IMO. Late match, vulture. Run 'N Gun(this is where i bring the X5 SRMs in. Prioritize the wounded heavy/assault mechs. Help keep enemy lights off your slow guys.

Hope this helps.

z MadButcher z, on 21 September 2015 - 06:41 AM, said:

They are both good mechs but the coming re balance is frightening. As quirks sit right now the Wolverine is a monster. The 6K is my personal favorite and my main ride in competitive matches. 4 LL and an XL280 it is fast and hits hard. Run a cool shot 9x9 and you can melt almost anything before you overheat. If the quirks change the 7K will be really the only viable one, and it will be an SRM brawler. The Cicada is still a good mech, but it relies on quirks too. I think that either one will be a good choice and it really depends on what your play style is.

Only the B and X5 are really quirk heavy. The rest could get by without. But they WILL get targeting quirks...for what thats worth. But ALL mechs will face this so, it will at least be a level field...in PGI's theory.

[InRev]

InspectorG, on 21 September 2015 - 07:17 AM, said:

Cicadas are my pimp ride. For some reason, the X5 being my favorite. With a ML module you get just about Clan ERML range!

Excellent post, all-around. And here I thought I was the only person in the game who actually loved the CDA-Tier5.

I fear for it post-rebalance though. The ML range quirks basically make the mech even somewhat playable. 400m on IS MLs which run cool as ice is pretty amazing. I pack a pair of SRM4s just for extra backstabbing potential, but generally speaking, I actually try to stay out of SRM range when possible, hovering between 300 and 500m.

If and when it loses the range quirks, it will be kind of hard to justify using it over the Loyalty-cada.

[TercieI]

InspectorG, on 21 September 2015 - 07:17 AM, said:

C is the sad ERPPC sniper. If it only had another E hardpoint.... Sad. ERPPC+4MG for cleanup work or ERPPC+AC5. May have to use a smaller engine.

Yeah, the 3C with ERPPC/MGs is the one CDA that really uses the max XL340, with the AC/5 it's more in the XL280/285 range (also an OK engine for poking CDA, can even go as low as 255/265 for certain roles). BUT the CDA-3C is a stunt however you run it, it's not really good.

[Mazzyplz]

yeah i was going to say the cda really does not depend on quirks.

Quote

X5. You get missiles...but im not sold on them. xl300 frees up tonnage.

au contraire if the OP says he has hugin then this could be right up his alley, the x5 competes with the oxide and hugin for best light/light-ish srm hero. go for the double srm4s

Quote

As quirks sit right now the Wolverine is a monster.

yeah that's it's problem, it was never meant to last. besides even so - it is a one trick pony, the wolverine 6k. the ecm cda with 3ll should be able to sneak up on you all day and blast your arm off if the player is smart, because with your arm off even with the arm w/o armor the wolverine's confidence decreases exponentially. it's like the dragon you hit a peak where people just shoot your arm off with ease. so i would not recommend the wolverine in any capacity, even though it has great firepower and range

the srm wolverine is a lot more solid for the same reasons


BTW here's the info on the cda 3f variant that is coming??? i haven't seen official confirmation; but i guess the twittersphere is law

http://mwomercs.com/...-cicada-cda-3f/

if this is true, then this will make it easy to pick a third variant right? it has 8 jumpjets.
makes the chassis more than a match for the shadowcat even with the range differences

Edited by Mazzyplz, 21 September 2015 - 07:40 AM.

[JC Daxion]

Terciel1976, on 21 September 2015 - 05:20 AM, said:

The 2B only has 5 hardpoints actually, it gets them in the arms as a tradeoff for losing one vs. the 2A. With current energy quirks, that's more than worth it, the 2A is clearly inferior to the 2B.

I don't own the 2B, but i wish i did, as i ran MPL's in my 2A.. (i owned them before quirks) since quirks, i have not really run it much.. It's basically a Jenner, that is slightly slower, and more armor.



But like the others stated.. the cicada's are either Or mechs for the most part.. Long range weapons, or short ranged brawlers. You can combo PPC and ac5 on the 3C, or just use the massive quirked PPC and machine guns. though i have seen a PPC+ac2 and 3 machine guns which did peak my interest to try.

You wan't the 3M, that is a no brainer.. as far as the others go.. I'd say get the 2B if you want the crazy quirked MPL mech.. which i would recommend, but if upclose brawling in a light is not your style, I'd say get the 3C, and try the PPC/AC combo's I think it would be like a faster medium that tends to run the dual ac5+ ppc builds

[InspectorG]

Mazzyplz, on 21 September 2015 - 07:33 AM, said:

au contraire if the OP says he has hugin then this could be right up his alley, the x5 competes with the oxide and hugin for best light/light-ish srm hero. go for the double srm4s

if it had 3M, yes, it would be a tier 2 contender and my money maker. But it only has a nice cooldown missile quirk. My main beef aside from a paltry 2M is the convergence.

Is it worth the tonnage to get Artemis to tighten those SRM6's??? I dunno.

If the 2M were on the same ST, hells yeah. But they are worlds apart it seems to me. 2SRM4 seems to work nicely. 2SRM2 is ok-ish if you want more DPS i guess.
SRM6 just has too many stray missiles that make you think 'da hell am i spending more tonnage for?'.

Really seems like it needs another M hardpoint.

[Koniving]

Breender, on 20 September 2015 - 03:41 PM, said:

Currently I don't have a medium mech, but that will soon be changed in October as 2 free mechs will join my collection, still, I can only pick 1 to master first, and I need some help to make my decision.

The CICADA is fast, 1 version with ECM, the others are focus on laser, which I think is a fast hiter. the problem is, I already owned and mastered my Raven, and their style are almost the same.

WOLVERINE provide different play style with each version (LL, AC5, SRM), but is only useful because of quirk, which will be changed soon.

Can anyone give me advise for which one I shoud pick? Also, how is the incoming free mech? The CICADA looks like a airbond mech.....and the WOLVERINE carry a afterbruner....

Quirks or "after", the Wolverine is built for combat and tanks incredibly well even for a 55 ton mech. Its variants are played fairly differently and they perform quite well -- even before the quirks. Still opinions weren't generally high since most have a large bulk of weapons in the right arm. Canonically (though this has no meaning here), it is both a Command mech, and general combat workhorse most known for punching other mechs.

The Cicada is canonically a 40 ton scout. Its armor is light; at stock as light as a Locust. In its favor it carries weapons and higher structure. In MWO it carries decent armor but just not enough given its size. The arms are expendable damage soaks. The ECM is definitely a merit. The mech handles averagely and its good as a hit-and-run machine.

You're welcome to jump on youtube and look up Cicada or Wolverine alongside "Koniving" or even from just anyone to see how they perform.

Good luck.

[Mazzyplz]

Koniving, on 21 September 2015 - 05:25 PM, said:

Quirks or "after", the Wolverine is built for combat and tanks incredibly well even for a 55 ton mech. Its variants are played fairly differently and they perform quite well -- even before the quirks. Still opinions weren't generally high since most have a large bulk of weapons in the right arm. Canonically (though this has no meaning here), it is both a Command mech, and general combat workhorse most known for punching other mechs.

The Cicada is canonically a 40 ton scout. Its armor is light; at stock as light as a Locust. In its favor it carries weapons and higher structure. In MWO it carries decent armor but just not enough given its size. The arms are expendable damage soaks. The ECM is definitely a merit. The mech handles averagely and its good as a hit-and-run machine.

You're welcome to jump on youtube and look up Cicada or Wolverine alongside "Koniving" or even from just anyone to see how they perform.

Good luck.

ahh so it is a puncher!

pgi needs to put in melee attacks asap

still want my hatamoto chi and axeman

[InspectorG]

Mazzyplz, on 21 September 2015 - 05:37 PM, said:

ahh so it is a puncher!

pgi needs to put in melee attacks asap

still want my hatamoto chi and axeman

Axeman would be amazing....with hth.

[Davers]

I found the Cicadas played very similar, the only exception is that the 2B has arm weapons and the rest are purely torso mounted. OTOH I found all my Wolverines behaved differently.

I ended up liking Cicadas, and running the 3M since it was 'the same' as the others plus ECM. The only Wolverine I liked was the 6K, and I have kept the LPL on it, even though the quirks changed.

[Breender]

I think "all my Wolverines behaved differently" made up my mind - for now, as it shoul keep master them interesting, but may wait until weekend to make the move, thanks for all helpful advise!

[TercieI]

Breender, on 22 September 2015 - 06:56 AM, said:

I think "all my Wolverines behaved differently" made up my mind - for now, as it shoul keep master them interesting, but may wait until weekend to make the move, thanks for all helpful advise!

That's not a bad reason at all (very similar to how I approach variant selection). Certainly the 6K/6R/7K all have different characters to them. If that's what you want and you're filling out to master the 7D, I'd skip the 6R since it's very similar to the 7D (one more missile hardpoint on the 6R but no MASC, though quirks may make them more different than the hardpoints make it appear)

Edited by Terciel1976, 22 September 2015 - 08:23 AM.

[Koniving]

Mazzyplz, on 21 September 2015 - 05:37 PM, said:

ahh so it is a puncher!

Spoiler

Indeed. In addition to using the excellent multi-channel communications system that is a staple of Phoenix Hawks and used often by field commanders in medium lances, this thing sports between 9.5 to 11.5 tons of armor (some of the highest of canonical 55 tonner builds; to note the Shadowhawks usually had between 4 and 6.5 tons of armor with exactly one exception, whose armor still only matched the highest armored 50 ton Centurion CN9-AL.) and notably was under-armed and with limited ammunition in exchange for its speed and armor. Between this and the original detachable hand-held autocannon, it wasn't foreign for them to drop their AC or other hand-held main weapon in order to brawl and retrieve their weapon later. Some pugilism and a laser turret in front of the cockpit made for some nasty fighting techniques.

Of interesting note: their jumpjets were known for frequent extreme wear, to the point that the upkeep would be pretty high for frequent use and thus some models dropped them entirely. Also the cockpit was very cramped and offered poor exterior vision.

Quote

pgi needs to put in melee attacks asap

still want my hatamoto chi and axeman

Dunno if they ever will. If they do, however, it would go a long way to balancing IS versus Clan without the gimmicks. Phoenix versus Invasion first half on megamek/BT... it was a close match but in the end Resistance turn the fight around rather epically between Shadowhawk and Battlemasters crippling the Dire Wolf in a single ten second instance with twin kicks to the same leg. Hip, upper, lower leg and foot actuators simultaneously destroyed. Ever seen a Dire wolf in a pushup position with the shattered remnants of one leg? I used one; it's quite the thing to imagine.

Nova would've won it, but it was too hot for its own good. Even at reduced power to its lasers (3 damage 1 heat) it still overheated bad.

[InspectorG]

Terciel1976, on 22 September 2015 - 08:21 AM, said:

That's not a bad reason at all (very similar to how I approach variant selection). Certainly the 6K/6R/7K all have different characters to them. If that's what you want and you're filling out to master the 7D, I'd skip the 6R since it's very similar to the 7D (one more missile hardpoint on the 6R but no MASC, though quirks may make them more different than the hardpoints make it appear)

What about using the 6R as a Gauss Sniper. 32% cooldown with module and it jumps????

[TercieI]

InspectorG, on 22 September 2015 - 07:37 PM, said:

What about using the 6R as a Gauss Sniper. 32% cooldown with module and it jumps????

The biggest problem with that is that you can't come up with a decent complementary weapon for the gauss with its hardpoints and the damage output of one gauss sucks.

[IraqiWalker]

Breender, on 21 September 2015 - 01:59 AM, said:

Well, I got 11 million C-bill in the bank, and I plan to get 7K then 6K if I pick wolverine, so XL or standard engine are not a problem.

For Cicada, I understand XL engine is a must, so I will start with 3M, but I have no idea which version should be my 3rd.

The catch for Cicada is that I have got the Raven mastery pack, already mastered the 3L and almost master the Huggin (yes, it kill a lot of Cicada). Also, it is only 5 tons different with Raven - which may matter in CW deck.


Wolverine provide much different play style, but I hear that it is bad without quirks, which will change shortly...


(Please forgive my grammar, I know I am bad about it)

Get the 2B with 5 MPLs, it is a beast.

[InspectorG]

Terciel1976, on 22 September 2015 - 07:42 PM, said:

The biggest problem with that is that you can't come up with a decent complementary weapon for the gauss with its hardpoints and the damage output of one gauss sucks.

So its basically pigeon-holed into 2AC5? Was just curious if it could be a knock-off version of the Grid Iron. Not sure i want to Leet the Wolverines despite the Laser Fist variant. RIP Wubverine.

[TercieI]

InspectorG, on 22 September 2015 - 08:06 PM, said:

So its basically pigeon-holed into 2AC5? Was just curious if it could be a knock-off version of the Grid Iron. Not sure i want to Leet the Wolverines despite the Laser Fist variant. RIP Wubverine.

AFAICT, pretty much. I really didn't like the mech, but I can't see much else to do with it. Three missile hardpoints doesn't pair well with a gauss rifle and the one energy is in the head and thus very limited.... I found it a very frustrating variant, honestly and am kindof dreading the 7D.

Edited by Terciel1976, 22 September 2015 - 08:16 PM.