54 replies to this topic

[TygerLily]

How I'd do some physical attacks:

Buttons:
Hold the Physical Attack Button (pretend its L-Shift).

Shift-M1 is left arm
Shift-M2 is right arm
Shift-Space is Kick

Holding PAB makes firing reticule on HUD disappear and two punching reticules and a vertical line as a "kick reticule" comes up. Releasing the PAB makes your physical attack reticules disappear and the firing reticules reappear.

The punch reticules are to the respective left and right (ie, off center) and are where each punch will land. So to punch twice you'd have to punch with one arm and then slightly twist to land one with the other.

Mechs would kick toward center. The vertical line running down the center helps you line up a kick. Maybe a tiny horizontal line near the bottom to make it an actual crosshair.

Damage
Punch damage is Mech weight divided by 10, round UP.

Kick damage is Mech weight divided by 5.

Damage is FLD (front loaded damage, ie, delivered all in one big chunk)

Punch Limitations
It's a slow attack/animation (like using a two handed weapon in Skyrim or something. Not a quick knife) so you gotta aim it.

You cannot punch if you've fired an arm weapon in the past 5 seconds.

You cannot punch if you've taken arm damage in the past .75 seconds.

You cannot punch with an arm that doesn't have hand actuators.

Kick Limitations
Kicks only go forward of a Mechs leg facing.

Kicking cannot work while 5 meters or more above the ground (IE, no jump kicks or kicking while falling).

Cannot kick if you have only one leg.

Mechs always kick with left leg.

Death From Above
Just land on a Mech while jumping or falling.

DFA damage is Mech weight divided by 5.

Damae is FLD.

Maybe a multiplier based on falling speed?

Hand Weapons
Takes crits slots and tonnnage like any weapon in the Mechlab (no improv weapons in my world!)

Only one hand weapon allowed.

Makes ONE punch do the same damage as a kick (Mech weight divided by 5)

More Pipe Dreams
I would also make ammo explosions do damage to a small surrounding area.

And if an engine takes enough hits in a short amount of time I'd make engine explosions a thing.

Edited by TygerLily, 13 October 2015 - 12:04 PM.

[Khobai]

Never gonna happen. they would have to add new animations for every mech in the game. that is a re tarded amount of work. And the game has numerous other problems that take precedent.

the only melee this game EVER has a chance of seeing is on stock mechs that come with melee weapons like hatchets or swords.

punching and kicking will NEVER be a thing. its WAY too much work for WAY too little gain.

but seeing a hatchetman with a hatchet or a no-dachi with a sword isnt entirely out of the question. Thats the only melee youre ever going to reasonably get.

Edited by Khobai, 13 October 2015 - 12:15 PM.

[Dimento Graven]

Ted Wayz, on 13 October 2015 - 11:02 AM, said:

...

Just give up on knockdowns. They never have ad never will make any sense.

Yeah, 'cause 'making sense' is such a key part of "magic space robots"...

Whatever...

Lootee, on 13 October 2015 - 11:37 AM, said:

Lol yea right. How many months has it been since they said they were going to change the JesusBox number from 180 to 90?

...

I'm remembering only one month since he actually said it...

[Lugh]

Ted Wayz, on 13 October 2015 - 11:34 AM, said:

I still have my box sets and all the books and played TT when it first came out. The group I started out with and every one since had at least one person who understood engineering and/or science/physics like myself and we always removed knockdowns.

Modern day gyros and movement systems can prevent knockdowns. Futuristic ones more so.

Don't confuse Death from Above with running into another mech. Two completely different mechanics.

But riddle me this, tell me how some of the mechs if they got knocked down would get back up? Cicada? Jenner? Blackjack? It just doesn't work.

Yes knockdowns would be more rare(as it not occurring every time a collision occurred) but that's no reason to not have COLLISIONS in the game. Cicada has a piston style lever deploying from under mid torso to raise it enough that it can place the leg under and lift again, same with jenner. Blackjack could leg whip itself up the way some agile humans do...

For the most part here, you are telling me that gyros make knockdowns impossible, and yet the gyros on some of the NASA landers left them stranded...

And these competitions:
http://www.nbcnews.c...g/#.Vh1lnivUXL8

Seem to have robots falling down and getting back up again all the time too. I guess I just don't know enough about physics to realize how totally ignorant you and your friends appear to be about actual physics.

[wanderer]

OK. Physical weapons, again?

1) Easy enough to put a "melee hardpoint" where a 'Mechs fist is, and just swing the arm appropriately- even if it's actually just a phantom "arm slashing" effect rather than truly moving the limb. It's a "shot" just like any other weapon. Ditto with kicks, or even with charging a target or executing a death-from-above. Honestly, having a perpetual set of these active on a 'Mech wouldn't make a bad collision system simulator, especially if the mutual contact damage can be varied as a formula related to speed.

Visually, something like this for a punch, only less fancy.



2) Melee weapons cost weight and spaces because they're better at dealing melee damage- improvised clubs ala trees or torn-off limbs don't take up slots or weight (but usually break after being used to smash things).

[Ted Wayz]

Lugh, on 13 October 2015 - 12:13 PM, said:

Yes knockdowns would be more rare(as it not occurring every time a collision occurred) but that's no reason to not have COLLISIONS in the game. Cicada has a piston style lever deploying from under mid torso to raise it enough that it can place the leg under and lift again, same with jenner. Blackjack could leg whip itself up the way some agile humans do...

For the most part here, you are telling me that gyros make knockdowns impossible, and yet the gyros on some of the NASA landers left them stranded...

And these competitions:
http://www.nbcnews.c...g/#.Vh1lnivUXL8

Seem to have robots falling down and getting back up again all the time too. I guess I just don't know enough about physics to realize how totally ignorant you and your friends appear to be about actual physics.

I am not telling you knockdowns cannot happen during a collision. Do the math and let that tell you. Seriously. If the gyros aren't good enough to stabilize when encountering the amount of force a collision would generate then they wouldn't be able to keep a mech upright in the first place. Especially on dicey terrain.

Go to DEKAs website, not NASAs. And learn.

Did not say collisions should not cause damage. That I do believe in. But given how bad the servers can be do you really want that?

Dimento Graven, on 13 October 2015 - 12:13 PM, said:

Yeah, 'cause 'making sense' is such a key part of "magic space robots"...

Whatever...

I'm remembering only one month since he actually said it...

There are actual mechs that walk in the world now. So yeah, they are more realistic than thinking a 100 ton mech at 49 kph can knock down a 20 ton mech moving at 140 kph just by farting on it.

[PurpleNinja]

It's on the roadmap, after "remove ghost heat" and "give weapons the original TT values".

[Khobai]

Quote

I am not telling you knockdowns cannot happen during a collision. Do the math and let that tell you. Seriously. If the gyros aren't good enough to stabilize when encountering the amount of force a collision would generate then they wouldn't be able to keep a mech upright in the first place. Especially on dicey terrain.

you have to make piloting checks on dicey terrain in tabletop

[Dimento Graven]

Ted Wayz, on 13 October 2015 - 01:43 PM, said:

I am not telling you knockdowns cannot happen during a collision. Do the math and let that tell you. Seriously. If the gyros aren't good enough to stabilize when encountering the amount of force a collision would generate then they wouldn't be able to keep a mech upright in the first place. Especially on dicey terrain.

Go to DEKAs website, not NASAs. And learn.

Yeah, physics still says you're wrong, HOWEVER, we have the 'magic space robot' effect to account for here too, and that's namely, these aren't robots but "mechs", "mechs" that are piloted by humans, providing feedback via inner ear through the nuerohelmet, supplementing the actions of the gyro.

Quote

Did not say collisions should not cause damage. That I do believe in. But given how bad the servers can be do you really want that?

Yes.

Quote

There are actual mechs that walk in the world now. So yeah, they are more realistic than thinking a 100 ton mech at 49 kph can knock down a 20 ton mech moving at 140 kph just by farting on it.

I don't believe t hose 'mechs' are piloted, or 20 tons, or powered by fusion engines, and the list goes on.

MAGIC SPACE ROBOT effect trumps your miniscule reality, NAMELY because I can't hop into my real world 'mech' and come smash your house down for disagreeing with having collisions in. WHEN I CAN DO THAT, I'll secede to your 'reality' points then.

[MechWarrior5152251]

I spent half a match trying to ram and DFA enemies after my weapons were stripped on a Summoner... I assume you do a little bit of damage ramming, at least it works when friendlies bump you...

[JP Josh]

Lootee, on 13 October 2015 - 11:37 AM, said:

Lol yea right. How many months has it been since they said they were going to change the JesusBox number from 180 to 90?

Species spring to life, evolve, and go extinct faster than anything happens in mwo.

unless the devs get trolled twice in a row.

[MechWarrior5152251]

Thanks for the upload.

Edited by MechWarrior5152251, 13 October 2015 - 02:00 PM.

[wanderer]

The only quick way to change things is to troll devs with them and post lots of videos.

This will then get the offending feature broken or removed, ala the colilison system.

[Dimento Graven]

MechWarrior5152251, on 13 October 2015 - 01:54 PM, said:

I spent half a match trying to ram and DFA enemies after my weapons were stripped on a Summoner... I assume you do a little bit of damage ramming, at least it works when friendlies bump you...

Yes, you do, do some damage. As you can see in the vid on the OP, I eventually rubbed his leg off.

Here's an example of a death caused by collision:


Next, during this vid, you'll see me score a 'TK' when one of my group mates takes his VERY RED CT (which I accidentally caused) and smashes into my 'mech:


Anyway, we've long had damage from smacking into each other, it's just that it's so small it's 'almost' meaningless.

[D1SC0 LEM0NADE]

I would buy the Hatchet Man or Axe Man in a heart beat. Just saying.