45 replies to this topic

[MechLord71]

I have heard a lot of folks make references to the classic Unseen mech releases and the various "money grabs" for these mechs vice additional content. While I am definitely looking forward to more content variety, including single player mode perhaps one day, I am also happy to drop in occasionally and play the "arena" with my mechs. I am willing to pay a bit of real dollars to get some of my favorite classic mechs early, but the talk of the game going bankrupt has me concerned I may have little play time with my purchased pixels.

So, the bottom line is, what is the financial forecast for PGI and MWO? Is it healthy or barely hanging on?

Thanks!

[Mudhutwarrior]

Private company. No way to know.

[Ghogiel]

I wouldn't worry, Even if deving halted or slowed considerable due to funding I would expect servers to tick over for at least a year even in that case.

[FupDup]

With all the posts of people claiming to have spent literally thousands of dollars on this game, I find it hard to believe that they are short on cash. Where the heck is all of the robotpack money going into anyways, buying Paul more nerf darts?

[Mawai]

The truth?

No one who will give you an answer on these boards has a clue. There are folks who claim they are hanging on by their teeth. These folks are clueless because they have no information upon which to base such an opinion. Unless they work for PGI, in accounting, and post here on an alt account breaking company confidentiality then anything anyone tries to claim is based on nothing more than wishful or unwishful thinking.

PGI is a private company. It does not submit public financial statements and its tax information is confidential.

All that said, over the past three years since open beta, they have added a decent amount of content at a admittedly slow rate. This is because they have a small team. There are about 6 to 8 engineers total that work on all aspects of the game itself. They have a larger art staff. Of course, having a small shop also keep their costs down. Development was particularly slow in 2014 (or was it 2013?) because they were in the process of negotiating a license extension. Their license originally ran out in 2015 or 2016 ... at which point it looked questionable about how much they should invest in the game. However, Russ subsequently said they obtained the license until at least 2020 (again if I am recalling correctly). So, it would appear that PGI is in this for the long term and they are trying to keep costs down so that it is sustainable. They also just finished the server expansion providing facilities in Europe and Oceania which also has to represent a decent investment.

The bottom line is that no one knows for sure. If you are having fun playing, and can afford it then by all means buy some digital content. Enjoy it for now ... and as long as it lasts. I put in $120 before the game was even released without any real confidence it would last a year ... now it is past three ... and I still enjoy playing it. I also bought additional digital content along the way but if it all goes away tomorrow .. I would still say that I have received my money's worth (except for that Marauder pre-order ).

[Lucian Nostra]

I'd say doing decently or else they'd be scaling back their staff. Also while a lot of people are gonna scream money grab with the unseen mechs Im sure a LOT of them coming out has to do with their involvement with the HBS Battletech game.. REALLY hard to make a 3025 game without the unseen designs.

Honestly I think PGI needs to.. tinker with some pricing, camo and colors seem a bit expensive and I feel they could make more money dropping the prices.. but what do I know I don't know their sales figures

[Coolant]

Mudhutwarrior, on 08 November 2015 - 02:21 PM, said:

Private company. No way to know.

^^This. Any other posts say the contrary are 100% guesses.

[Bishop Steiner]

Mawai, on 08 November 2015 - 02:30 PM, said:

The truth?

No one who will give you an answer on these boards has a clue. There are folks who claim they are hanging on by their teeth. These folks are clueless because they have no information upon which to base such an opinion. Unless they work for PGI, in accounting, and post here on an alt account breaking company confidentiality then anything anyone tries to claim is based on nothing more than wishful or unwishful thinking.

PGI is a private company. It does not submit public financial statements and its tax information is confidential.

All that said, over the past three years since open beta, they have added a decent amount of content at a admittedly slow rate. This is because they have a small team. There are about 6 to 8 engineers total that work on all aspects of the game itself. They have a larger art staff. Of course, having a small shop also keep their costs down. Development was particularly slow in 2014 (or was it 2013?) because they were in the process of negotiating a license extension. Their license originally ran out in 2015 or 2016 ... at which point it looked questionable about how much they should invest in the game. However, Russ subsequently said they obtained the license until at least 2020 (again if I am recalling correctly). So, it would appear that PGI is in this for the long term and they are trying to keep costs down so that it is sustainable. They also just finished the server expansion providing facilities in Europe and Oceania which also has to represent a decent investment.

The bottom line is that no one knows for sure. If you are having fun playing, and can afford it then by all means buy some digital content. Enjoy it for now ... and as long as it lasts. I put in $120 before the game was even released without any real confidence it would last a year ... now it is past three ... and I still enjoy playing it. I also bought additional digital content along the way but if it all goes away tomorrow .. I would still say that I have received my money's worth (except for that Marauder pre-order ).

They've also recently hired more programmers. In my experience hiring patterns are usually somewhat reliable indicator that they at least aren't crashing and burning.

Beyond that? Nobody outside PGI and their creditors know for sure.

[Elizander]

Even if they are low on cash the first step for any company is to lay off workers in order to lower overhead and keep things going.

[TheCharlatan]

All we know is that they are hiring.
Where i come from, companies that are at a loss don't tend to hire new people.
But what do i know, right?

[orcrist86]

Here are three indicators of general business health:
They are hiring new programmers and artists
They are expanding their business (cross licensing with Battletech)
They are prepared to vigorously defend their IP (warchest for defending reseen designs is risk management 101)
They have actually sped up mech production to meet their contractual obligations to Battletech (overhead in personnel)
They have begun laying the foundation for product expansion over the next 1.5 years (expansion of current product and addition of PVE campaign ai design)

Is development glacial: sometimes
Is it always what we want: no
Is it working for them financially: probably so.

[MechLord71]

Thanks guys!!

[sycocys]

Bishop Steiner, on 08 November 2015 - 02:36 PM, said:

They've also recently hired more programmers. In my experience hiring patterns are usually somewhat reliable indicator that they at least aren't crashing and burning.

Beyond that? Nobody outside PGI and their creditors know for sure.

Just ramping up the staff to get working on Transverse I'm sure.

[Gamuray]

orcrist86, on 08 November 2015 - 02:44 PM, said:

Here are three indicators of general business health:
They are hiring new programmers and artists
They are expanding their business (cross licensing with Battletech)
They are prepared to vigorously defend their IP (warchest for defending reseen designs is risk management 101)
They have actually sped up mech production to meet their contractual obligations to Battletech (overhead in personnel)
They have begun laying the foundation for product expansion over the next 1.5 years (expansion of current product and addition of PVE campaign ai design)

Is development glacial: sometimes
Is it always what we want: no
Is it working for them financially: probably so.

Congratulations, by behavioral analysis you have convinced me 85% that PGI is doing reasonably well in terms of profit. (the 15% accounting for the possibility of poor business management, feigning profitability, etc.)

Good to [kind of] know.

[Khobai]

Quote

So, the bottom line is, what is the financial forecast for PGI and MWO? Is it healthy or barely hanging on?

PGI was trying to launch a second game title with TRANS|VERSE. I dont theyd be doing that unless MWO was successful. And presumably bryan is still working on their second game, since no ones heard from him since TRANS|VERSE flopped.

[Bishop Steiner]

sycocys, on 08 November 2015 - 03:58 PM, said:

Just ramping up the staff to get working on Aerotech I'm sure.

[Thorqemada]

orcrist86, on 08 November 2015 - 02:44 PM, said:

Here are three indicators of general business health:
They are hiring new programmers and artists
They are expanding their business (cross licensing with Battletech)
They are prepared to vigorously defend their IP (warchest for defending reseen designs is risk management 101)
They have actually sped up mech production to meet their contractual obligations to Battletech (overhead in personnel)
They have begun laying the foundation for product expansion over the next 1.5 years (expansion of current product and addition of PVE campaign ai design)

Is development glacial: sometimes
Is it always what we want: no
Is it working for them financially: probably so.

They are hiring new programmers and artists
= Temporary Employees to make some urgent Holiday/Steam Sales work done in time so they wont miss to much income from delayed work

They are expanding their business (cross licensing with Battletech)
= They hope sharing the 3D Models will result in good PR/Goodwill to expand their potential customer base as theirs is drying out

They are prepared to vigorously defend their IP (warchest for defending reseen designs is risk management 101)
= They are as well riding on the tail of some defeats HG has suffered as the situation is that desperate that they have no more Options but to sell Mechs of risky legality to keep the Show going.

They have actually sped up mech production to meet their contractual obligations to Battletech (overhead in personnel)
= Releasing OP Clan Mechs gave a slight Business boost but has sabotaged the sale of all non OP Clan Mechs and the "Unseen" and "Classics" are the only Mechs they can still monetize - to even out the lower sales they need to offer more Mechs but run out of Options soon.

They have begun laying the foundation for product expansion over the next 1.5 years (expansion of current product and addition of PVE campaign ai design)
= They have realized that they stand or fall with MWO and startet almost 3 years after making MWO accessible to the public to expand new monetization options as the current options lose "Steam" very quckly

Without the Transverse-Fail MWO would already be on the development deathbed.

Its sad - MWO may be a niche product but so is every other product and in the Mechwarrior Niche you have no competition and i honestly believe a good Mechwarrior Game could be as big as Eve.

Eve is both a positive and negative example:
Positive bcs it shows how much financial success you can have in "your" pretty uncontested niche.
Negative bcs Eve made themself a victim to a very specific part of their playerbase.
That now prevents them from expanding their playerbase through other areas of gameplay that would fit the Eve-Universe but have not the approval of the specific type of Players that have enough weight to influence the development direction.
Eve long and torturous march into sunset started the moment they obeyed to these hostile Players.

Edited by Thorqemada, 08 November 2015 - 04:32 PM.

[Bishop Steiner]

Thorqemada, on 08 November 2015 - 04:28 PM, said:

stuff

you forgot the WMDs in Iraq...........

[DAYLEET]

Worse case scenario, they make more mech pack and add ui fix for another 3 year, like the last 3 year.

[Grey Ghost]

Lucian Nostra, on 08 November 2015 - 02:33 PM, said:

Also while a lot of people are gonna scream money grab with the unseen mechs

I just find that whole idea so amusing, seeing as it is the oldest and most constant request I can think of in the history of MWO.