36 replies to this topic

[TLBFestus]

I know a bunch of people just supported the kickstarter for BattleTech, but how many didn't
support it?

Even though I read about, and was informed about the good record of HBS in producing kickstarted games, I just couldn't bring myself to support a game that is'nt even made yet.

It took some time, a couple of years actually, to come to the conclusion that paying for kickstarters, "early access", or "beta access" games similar to MWO is just not a good idea.

Let's see, some of "those" games I supported:


H1Z1
Rust
DayZ
Planetary Annihilation
The Fifth Day (OMG..what was I thinking?)
MWO


Those are just off the top of my head, I know that there are at least that many I can't think of at this moment (posting from work....and yes..i'm THE BOSS so it's OK).

Rust is actually OK, MWO is better than most as well, but both of them took YEARS to actually come anywhere close to meeting the expectations that the developers were selling.

Nowadays I see a game on STEAM and I think.."Oh..that looks cool" and then i scroll a bit further and see the words, "EARLY ACCESS". At that point I move along. Too many disappointments, too many broken promises or big ideas that sound good on paper but later get dumped.

I'm done with giving my money away without getting the product finished, and upfront.

My last contribution was the Marauder deal, where I pay in advance and wait for my "product". I just don't think I can' even do that anymore. Anyone else just "DONE" with pay ahead and hope deals like early access?

[Bishop Steiner]

Nope.

I am done with blind faith, though.

Which is why I moved on the HBS Battletech Kickstarter. Because faith in them is not blind, as they have a proven track record using this method.

Had this been their first time at the rodeo? I probably would have held off, after the Mechwarrior Tactics fiasco.

[PurpleNinja]

From you list I can only think you have too much faith.
Crowdfunding works for things like MWO, niche market.
From all the Kickstarter games I came across in the past years, only two made me think about it, MWO and Battletech.

[Rhaythe]

There are some gems in or recently emerged from the early access market:

• Kerbal Space Program
  
• Wasteland 2
  
• Fractured Space
  
• Don't Starve
  
• Beseige

But yeah. Overall, I would never recommend buying into early access. It's just a way to commercialize the "betas" of older days, and it gives companies no incentive to actually complete their games.

[sycocys]

I have no problem with chipping in for early access, the only reason I didn't with the Battletech game is because it's release is set to be at least a full year or more out. While not bad in terms of production length, I've got plans to purchase a new house and the net there will probably be like playing on the oceanic servers for MWo, so downloading full games is pretty much out of the question.

[PurpleNinja]

Bishop Steiner, on 09 November 2015 - 10:54 AM, said:

Had this been their first time at the rodeo? I probably would have held off, after the Mechwarrior Tactics fiasco.

I pondered about this one until I read "browser game", then I laughed.

[Gravitas]

I did not back HBS and their Battletech game based on the promise of 'early access'. I backed it because of what the campaign stated would come in their game. Early access will merely be a bonus.

[Saint Scarlett Johan]

You ain't the only one.

After MWO, MWT, and Diablo 3 I decided I was never going to preorder or crowdfund another video game ever again.

I've learned it is naive to buy a dream and not a product. And it was an expensive lesson.

[Nightmare1]

I never buy into games until after their release. It's too risky otherwise.

[Revis Volek]

Lord Scarlett Johan, on 09 November 2015 - 11:04 AM, said:

You ain't the only one.

After MWO, MWT, and Diablo 3 I decided I was never going to preorder or crowdfund another video game ever again.

I've learned it is naive to buy a dream and not a product. And it was an expensive lesson.

I still have friends who cant believe i didn't buy Fallout 4 already...

I will wait, If its worth it im sure i wont miss it. Like you said, Paying for dreams is too expensive especially when most dont come true.

[Rhaythe]

Really, after the last Batman game and now the COD:BlOps3 launch screwing over PC users, people should be well damn advised against preorders. But, alas... at least steam offers refunds now.

And yes, I'm parroting TB:

[Saint Scarlett Johan]

DarthRevis, on 09 November 2015 - 11:09 AM, said:

I still have friends who cant believe i didn't buy Fallout 4 already...

I will wait, If its worth it im sure i wont miss it. Like you said, Paying for dreams is too expensive especially when most dont come true.

Oi... I forgot all about FO. I remember preordering FO3 because I loved FO1 and 2.

FO3 was the worst preorder I've ever made in my entire life. When I think of the massive plethora of games I've played, no game makes me as salty, grouchy, cranky, bitter, or downright cantankerous as Fallout 3 did.

[GRiPSViGiL]

I find it hard to back Battletech since they are in bed with PGI to some degree so I refrained. Not really into turn based games either but I may check it out who knows. I did back Crowfall and I know of at least one other person on these forums who did as well. PGI didn't taint me from being a backer since I have money to spend on games but I know they aren't getting any more of my money. To bad for HBSs as well then.

[Bishop Steiner]

Rhaythe, on 09 November 2015 - 11:00 AM, said:

There are some gems in or recently emerged from the early access market:

• Kerbal Space Program
  
• Wasteland 2
  
• Fractured Space
  
• Don't Starve
  
• Beseige

But yeah. Overall, I would never recommend buying into early access. It's just a way to commercialize the "betas" of older days, and it gives companies no incentive to actually complete their games.

and in some cases, it's the only way a title will ever see daylight again.

Whatever one thinks of MWO and PGI, make no mistake, their "success" did tie into HBS being able to move forward with Battltech, too.

I suppose, thanks to shared art assets and such, one could even look at MWO as part of the path to getting to Battltetch..though what a convoluted path that would be.....

[GRiPSViGiL]

Nightmare1, on 09 November 2015 - 11:07 AM, said:

I never buy into games until after their release. It's too risky otherwise.

Interesting. When do you consider MWO released? No regrets? I consider CW release the actual release of MWO which to me is a complete failure. I am sure you have seen my posts prior to this. Anyway, no regrets concerning MWO to this point?

[Clownwarlord]

I kinda am done with it as well. I did join the Battletech Kickstarter though that is for a mech game that I do not have to play "online" for when ever it comes out. The only other games I do early content for is here for MWO and I did it for Call of Duty Advanced Warfare. As for the early content I am for once telling myself not to buy the Rifleman pack even though I know I want it because I have bought every pack (the biggest with out going gold mech) since Phoenix packages came out. I kinda am just sick and tired of the wait for something I buy and the hope for the game to get better.

Actually a game like Fallout I am waiting till the game of the year version for Fallout 4 comes out before I buy it (usually means wait a year). That way I can get all the content in one game and not have to hunt down each portion later on after they come out or spend extra money to make sure I get it when it comes out.

As for how this correlates to MWO well I will be waiting till the items come out and get c-bill versions of what I want and what works instead of paying for early access to some of the underachieving content. This will also give me more time to get other mechs mastered that I have yet to do so.

Mind you this is my personal opinion so feel free to disagree.

[Mudhutwarrior]

Watching what has happened here with the founders made me decide never to kickstarter a game. I will admit though that if I had known about MWO when it was in kickstarter I would have become a founder. I finally heard about the game from a the buddy who got me MW4 but it was like a week before open beta. I am not a big gamer so I don't really follow them,

Now as far as FO4 is concerned. I had set aside some cash and was planning on buying a mech pack or just several mechs but between the two sideways tourneys, the PSR and poor gameplay and then the bullcr$p with the timby giveaway I just said screw it and preordered straight from bethesda. Just got my shipping confirmation.
That I don't mind even if its buggy like FO3 was. Bethesda made it and they will fix it. They did the last two games I had from them. And when I had a question to tech support they answered it without smart ass remarks like the last e-mail from PGI. Bethesda didn't want my money on we promise to build it then tell people they were on Island. Im a sailor I know how to get off islands.

[Mawai]

Interesting comments.

I bought into MWO and received pretty much what I expected. Development has been slow but the game I bought into was based on what I saw in closed beta and not the "CW within 90 days of open beta" kind of vapourware promises. Overall, I'd have to say that I have been satisfied with my MWO related spending ... I could have hoped for more but what they have delivered so far has been sufficient.

I also bought the kickstarter for two of the shadowrun games from HBS. Those were good and delivered more or less what they promised to deliver. On the board game front, I bought into a game called Xia and another for kids named Goblins Drool, Fairies Rule ... both were delivered and in my opinion Xia was one of the best produced kickstarter games I have seen with a very high production quality.

I have recently bought the kickstarter for a space shooter called Everspace along with Battletech.

So .. in general, I would say my experience with kickstarters has been mostly positive but I've found that I have to pay attention to the details of the presentations by the developer to tell "fact from fiction" or existing code from vapourware or concepts from implementation. If I like what I see of what has already been done or if the concept looks good and appears practical then it is likely a good bet. If objectives seem to high to be met then they likely are .. so some objective analysis goes a long way when looking at kickstarters and if they are worth funding.

The PGI effort at crowdfunding Transverse is a great example of what not to do ..
- vaguely fleshed out ideas and concepts .. no detailed game design
- yet another space game in a market that is becoming filled with space games (or at least the potential for them)
- small development studio putting forward a game concept far larger than their current game that is only developed relatively slowly
- no code, no in engine concept demo, no sign that any work has actually been done

It isn't surprising at all that few if any wanted to fund Transverse ... in the world of crowd funding, it couldn't really pass any tests of feasibility.

[DemonRaziel]

I've passed on some decent kickstarters/preorders and bought pretty much right after the release (Wasteland 2, Pillars of Eternity, Banner Saga come to mind). Then I preordered The Witcher 3 and Bats: Arkham Knight and it was a 50% success.

But after the Bats: AK experience, I have given up on preordering once and for all. This includes passing on Battletech, which I am willing to buy if it proves a good game upon release, as well as Fallout 4.

As far as MWO is concerned, I joined the open beta and spent some money over the time (every two months), but have closed my wallet a long time ago. Does it still count as perordering, if I have not invested into this game since May 2014?

I was quite happy with the game's developement in the recent months, but after the latest patch, I am once again on a break and, obviously, won't spend any money on the game until I decide to come back.

[M4NTiC0R3X]

I had big stories but decided to go simple instead to prevent continued periods of mouth breathing straight passion. No I didn't fund kickstarter battletech. I would've liked to pay $60 - $120 but will not do so until I see the game, no paid early access either.

Diablo 3 fooled me once, MW:O fooled me twice *see hopes and dreams*...

Lesson learned, lurker out.