33 replies to this topic

[anfadern]

I am a tier 2 player that started to play a new chassis, the ebon jaguar and I suck beyond anything you could imagine.

And this wold be fine if the other players had a reasonable spread. I get stomped really badly by high tier players and I perform sub par all the time. This to the point that it not even fun to play at all.

This makes me think that the the way the matchmaker work combined with the PSR hurts the sales of PGI since the high tier players stay in their current mechs rather than starting over in a new one.

[monk]

Yep. It's one of the current side-effects. Leveling up a new mech is a huge pain and a lesson in patience. This is multiplied many times over if the mech is sub-par.

[FlipOver]

Yeah, PSR should be (in my eyes) related to the class of mech, not the overall performance.

I do understand how painful must be to level up mechs when playing solo.

Try to join a group of players, use the LFG feature or just look for a factions TS and join them. It will help you a LOT with the leveling of the mechs, especially if on that group you have more T4 players than T2-T1.

Edited by FlipOver, 28 September 2015 - 12:17 AM.

[Navid A1]

People have been suggesting chassis specific elo/PSR for a very very long time.

PGI has been silent on this.

I can not think of a single negative point in introducing chassis specific rating.... no new buckets and better balanced matches.

[Jungle Rhino]

Problem is not the PSR system - problem is the BS mech skills that totally ruin the game balance - ESPECIALLY for new players.

PGI is NEVER going to get anywhere with their Steam release until they make fresh chassis marginally competitive. Sure have mech XP but make the difference 2.5% or something tiny.

Massive downer to the game.

[VanguardMk1]

I'm tier 2, same as you. I've had no problems leveling my Black Knights, which are considered sub standard. I do wish you could be placed in a bit lower tier until your mech reaches the elite skills, to make it a bit easier. Class based PSR would be nice too but I doubt that will come any time soon.

[PyckenZot]

Jungle Rhino, on 28 September 2015 - 12:23 AM, said:

Problem is not the PSR system - problem is the BS mech skills that totally ruin the game balance - ESPECIALLY for new players. PGI is NEVER going to get anywhere with their Steam release until they make fresh chassis marginally competitive. Sure have mech XP but make the difference 2.5% or something tiny. Massive downer to the game.

Ever tried running a new tank in WoT? (and that game is still doing fine) This is how F2P works. Give you bad equipment so as to coerce you into spending money.

On the PSR topic, it is the problem in a specific way. PSR is based on W/L and then damage dealing, more than anything else. So with high PSR you'll drop against metamechs and good groups. Usually a combination of both. As such levelling a new mech with high PSR will be a real pain in the ass. However, in the same time, doing so should drop you of the ladder quite fast as well

Edited by PyckenZot, 28 September 2015 - 12:45 AM.

[El Bandito]

I usually spend at least 9K GXP towards giving my new mechs some vital basic skill tree. It helps a lot.

[Jungle Rhino]

PyckenZot, on 28 September 2015 - 12:41 AM, said:

Ever tried running a new tank in WoT? (and that game is still doing fine) This is how F2P works. Give you bad equipment so as to coerce you into spending money.

That is magnificent reasoning! Drive away the new players (believe me I have tried to get my BT tabletop nerd mates into this game and failed)

How about: We fund the game with early access to content, exclusive skins and other cosmetic features while giving new players a good experience?

[Paigan]

anfadern, on 28 September 2015 - 12:13 AM, said:

I am a tier 2 player that started to play a new chassis, the ebon jaguar and I suck beyond anything you could imagine.

And this wold be fine if the other players had a reasonable spread. I get stomped really badly by high tier players and I perform sub par all the time. This to the point that it not even fun to play at all.

This makes me think that the the way the matchmaker work combined with the PSR hurts the sales of PGI since the high tier players stay in their current mechs rather than starting over in a new one.

Some of many detail flaws of the in principle nice PSR idea are:
- new chassis are counted from the first match on (should only be after the 100th match or once you mastered them or so)
- all games from jan 2015 on count instead of just the last 1000 or so, meaning "newbie times" are mixed in (except for older players)
- new players don't get a kind of "grace time" for the first 100 matches or so
- And then there's this.

I normally like to propagate financially supporting the company that runs the game. But looking at OBVIOUS idiocy like the chat with all its bugs and deficiencies and fundamental sanity flaws in PSR, I slowly must seriously doubt their competence ... and sanity.

Edited by Paigan, 28 September 2015 - 12:50 AM.

[PyckenZot]

Jungle Rhino, on 28 September 2015 - 12:47 AM, said:

That is magnificent reasoning! Drive away the new players (believe me I have tried to get my BT tabletop nerd mates into this game and failed)

How about: We fund the game with early access to content, exclusive skins and other cosmetic features while giving new players a good experience?

Nothing to do with reasoning but a simple reality of life. Leveling a new item is a pain in any F2P I know. Don't like it, don't play it,... If you're scared to lose your PSR/ stats. Do it in CW,...

[Jungle Rhino]

PyckenZot, on 28 September 2015 - 12:55 AM, said:

Nothing to do with reasoning but a simple reality of life. Leveling a new item is a pain in any F2P I know. Don't like it, don't play it,... If you're scared to lose your PSR/ stats. Do it in CW,...

I'm terrible at this game! - not worried about losing my mighty Tier 4 ranking. I'm just saying it is awful as all hell to level new mechs. If people don't like it they won't play it - which is why none of my BT tragic table-top nerds do. I'm trying to point out why that may be...

[Soultraxx]

PyckenZot, on 28 September 2015 - 12:41 AM, said:

As such levelling a new mech with high PSR will be a real pain in the ass. However, in the same time, doing so should drop you of the ladder quite fast as well

My experience from this weekend did not show this to be true.

With the event on and the inevitable change in play style, I decided to level my most hated Mechs - Kit Foxes (any coincidence it ryhmes with sh*t box?) and not worry about the event.

No matter how poorly I did in a game I never moved more than one pixel. Over the entire weekend of less than stellar performance my total loss in PSR is about 9 pixels.
This suggests to me that it is unlikely that you will change tier when levelling new mechs because PSR movement is so slow.

[Sjorpha]

Navid A1, on 28 September 2015 - 12:20 AM, said:

I can not think of a single negative point in introducing chassis specific rating....

I can:

It would divide the data(matches played) from which the PSR is calculated by a factor equal to the number of mechs you own. Not only would this be a bucket problem in and of itself in terms of decreased statistical certainty, but as a player just imagine the time it takes now to change you tier multiplied by each mech you own.

It would require tier to be displayed per mech rather than on the home screen, making it quite difficult, or at least time consuming, to track your overall progress as a player.

It seems to me that it would be better solution to keep one PSR value, and instead have the matchmaker apply a negative modifier to unleveled mechs so you are seeded lower while leveling up.

[Paigan]

Sjorpha, on 28 September 2015 - 01:22 AM, said:

I can:

It would divide the data(matches played) from which the PSR is calculated by a factor equal to the number of mechs you own. Not only would this be a bucket problem in and of itself in terms of decreased statistical certainty, but as a player just imagine the time it takes now to change you tier multiplied by each mech you own.

It would require tier to be displayed per mech rather than on the home screen, making it quite difficult, or at least time consuming, to track your overall progress as a player.

It seems to me that it would be better solution to keep one PSR value, and instead have the matchmaker apply a negative modifier to unleveled mechs so you are seeded lower while leveling up.

It would completely suffice to do what I wrote above.
Not per-chassis PSR, but give each mech chassis (and newbies in general) a certain amount of "grace matches" that don't count towards PSR.

[Moldur]

Sjorpha, on 28 September 2015 - 01:22 AM, said:

I can:

It would divide the data(matches played) from which the PSR is calculated by a factor equal to the number of mechs you own. Not only would this be a bucket problem in and of itself in terms of decreased statistical certainty, but as a player just imagine the time it takes now to change you tier multiplied by each mech you own.

It would require tier to be displayed per mech rather than on the home screen, making it quite difficult, or at least time consuming, to track your overall progress as a player.

It seems to me that it would be better solution to keep one PSR value, and instead have the matchmaker apply a negative modifier to unleveled mechs so you are seeded lower while leveling up.

It would take forever

Edited by Moldur, 28 September 2015 - 01:41 AM.

[Joseph Mallan]

anfadern, on 28 September 2015 - 12:13 AM, said:

I am a tier 2 player that started to play a new chassis, the ebon jaguar and I suck beyond anything you could imagine.

And this wold be fine if the other players had a reasonable spread. I get stomped really badly by high tier players and I perform sub par all the time. This to the point that it not even fun to play at all.

This makes me think that the the way the matchmaker work combined with the PSR hurts the sales of PGI since the high tier players stay in their current mechs rather than starting over in a new one.

What makes you think this doesn't affect everyone???

[Cyborne Elemental]

Yeah I just got through leveling my Ebon-Jags, and I spent alot of GXP out of frustration.

These things are super squishy and clumsy feeling until they're leveled up, it was almost as hard as it was leveling the Baddog's.

Once you reach these upper tiers, people know how to build, and they generally build the most powerful PPFLD setups they can cram onto a mech here, so you just have to follow suit and play the cheesiest builds you can cram into your mech too.

No more fun and games, this is the big boy tier ^^

[Antares102]

My advice:
Do in in CW. Doesnt affect your PSR.

[Doman Hugin]

I've found leveling a new mech is more about figuring out (within the damage is the predominant role) it's role, and play it.

I'm leveling Adder's at the moment in T2, and getting some pretty good games (got positive KDR on all varients so far), i still trip myself up occationaly forgeting it's a 97 KPH light and try something not suited to it, and die horribly.

If you can play the mech as it is, not as you want it to be, any chassis is playable in ay tier.