20 replies to this topic

[Alistair Winter]

Are there more medium or heavy mechs in Battletech that has ECM, jump jets and decent firepower, but haven't been introduced to MWO yet, at the current point of our timeline?

We've got the GRF-2N and SHC-B, but I'm getting a bit tired of those. The Griffin, with 2 energy hardpoints and 4 missile hardpoints, can only be played as an LRM or SRM carrier, really. Sure, you can equip 2 ERPPCs, but it's kind of risky to have all your firepower in one arm without bigger armour & structure quirks. The Shadow Cat is fun, but it's more of a novelty, really. PGI never tried to fix MASC and never let us unequip it either, so we're stuck with 2 tons of dead weight on a mech with a serious lack of hardpoints and 3 tons of locked jump jets to boot.

When it comes to mechs, I'm kind of what roleplayers refer to as a 'munchkin'. The kind of guy who wants his Barbarian to also be a super powerful sorceror, and a great thief, while also having a Paladin's armour and a Priest's healing skills. And preferably a pet dragon. Riding a unicorn in plate armour. In other words, I do admit that I'm kind of looking for the ultimate lone wolf mech here, with all the bells and whistles.

Is there something that fits this category in 3053? Maybe a super cheesy IIC mech or something?

[Doman Hugin]

Back before the Clans, quirks and all the power creep thats happenened sinse, ECM was limited to unfavorable hard point mechs of a particular chassis, or poor chassis themselves.
Sinse there are not many post Clan IS mechs with ECM, that is still mostly true, and ECM Clan mechs sometimes conform to this rule too.
If the Helbringer did not have ECM it might be classed as a poor Clan mech.
Then they brought out the Archtic Cheeteh and now people are expecting ECM mechs to be as good as other mechs.

So to answer your question, I hope not.

[DivineEvil]

Quote

Are there more medium or heavy mechs in Battletech that has ECM, jump jets and decent firepower, but haven't been introduced to MWO yet, at the current point of our timeline?

No.

Quote

We've got the GRF-2N and SHC-B, but I'm getting a bit tired of those. The Griffin, with 2 energy hardpoints and 4 missile hardpoints, can only be played as an LRM or SRM carrier, really. Sure, you can equip 2 ERPPCs, but it's kind of risky to have all your firepower in one arm without bigger armour & structure quirks. The Shadow Cat is fun, but it's more of a novelty, really. PGI never tried to fix MASC and never let us unequip it either, so we're stuck with 2 tons of dead weight on a mech with a serious lack of hardpoints and 3 tons of locked jump jets to boot.

You can just equip one ER-PPC with lower SRM/LRM array on GRF-2N. Sometimes it takes it to try to balance the loadout with few groups of weapons, rather than just make a personal fleet of different boats.
Same is true for SHCs - they're decent mechs. MASC allows for very quick vector changes, when assigned conveniently, jump-jets are also good benefit for mobility. Hardpoints are good as well, they're just not about laser-vomiting. Its really make me feel weird when people using any Clan mechs cannot figure out how to make them work. The basic properties of the chassis are self-evident, and omni-pods allow for any combinations of ways to make hardpoints to accomodate pod-space. It's really astonishing.

[Widowmaker1981]

This would be the ultimate:

http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Dragoon

IS 70 tonner with JJs, high mounted Jager-style hardpoints and ECM. Its kinda unlikely to be released though, because its extinct lore-wise, never got mass produced after Kerensky left.

Clans have very little - heres what i could find for mediums/heavies with JJs:
There is a nova variant with ECM in the head.
http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Rifleman_IIC has ECM on one far out of timeline variant
http://www.sarna.net...Shadow_Hawk_IIC has ECM on one very far out of timeline variant

[Alistair Winter]

Doman Hugin, on 07 December 2015 - 04:32 AM, said:

Back before the Clans, quirks and all the power creep thats happenened sinse, ECM was limited to unfavorable hard point mechs of a particular chassis, or poor chassis themselves.
Sinse there are not many post Clan IS mechs with ECM, that is still mostly true, and ECM Clan mechs sometimes conform to this rule too.
If the Helbringer did not have ECM it might be classed as a poor Clan mech.
Then they brought out the Archtic Cheeteh and now people are expecting ECM mechs to be as good as other mechs.
So to answer your question, I hope not.

When Paul is done nerfing the ECM, it's not going to have much of an impact anymore. I don't want it because it's a Harry Potter invisibility cloak, I just want it because I have a tendency to wander off on my own, and any edge in stealth will stop me from getting ganked by enemy wolf packs.

DivineEvil, on 07 December 2015 - 04:53 AM, said:

You can just equip one ER-PPC with lower SRM/LRM array on GRF-2N. Sometimes it takes it to try to balance the loadout with few groups of weapons, rather than just make a personal fleet of different boats.
Same is true for SHCs - they're decent mechs. MASC allows for very quick vector changes, when assigned conveniently, jump-jets are also good benefit for mobility. Hardpoints are good as well, they're just not about laser-vomiting. Its really make me feel weird when people using any Clan mechs cannot figure out how to make them work. The basic properties of the chassis are self-evident, and omni-pods allow for any combinations of ways to make hardpoints to accomodate pod-space. It's really astonishing.

I've played both mechs to death, so I feel I have a fairly good handle on their options. Whatever merits the jump jets and MASC have, the limitations of the mech speak for themselves. In no way does the Shadow Cat has good fire power. For 5 more tons, you get the Nova. The Nova has enough firepower to melt a Shadow Cat in seconds.

As for the GRF-2N, I may try to run something close to a stock build, but the sad fact is that unless you're boating SRMs or LRMs, you're really sacrificing a lot of firepower compared to other 55 ton mechs. You can do a fun 2xSRM6 + ERPPC build, and you can probably make it work in the pug queue, but if you find yourself in a 1v1 with a skilled opponent, you won't have enough firepower to have a chance.

Widowmaker1981, on 07 December 2015 - 04:55 AM, said:

This would be the ultimate:
http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Dragoon
IS 70 tonner with JJs, high mounted Jager-style hardpoints and ECM. Its kinda unlikely to be released though, because its extinct lore-wise, never got mass produced after Kerensky left.

This mech! I need it!



Let's edit the Sarna wiki page and ask PGI to make it for MWO. It'll be our little secret!

[Juodas Varnas]

The Penetrator (3053) has a variant (6S) with JJs, ECM and pure energy loadout (seems that the variant is a bit later in the timeline, though).
It's also a 75 tonner, so there's that, with Jager-like arms, if going by the artwork.

Edited by Juodas Varnas, 07 December 2015 - 05:16 AM.

[martian]

Alistair Winter, on 07 December 2015 - 03:20 AM, said:

Are there more medium or heavy mechs in Battletech that has ECM, jump jets and decent firepower, but haven't been introduced to MWO yet, at the current point of our timeline?
...
Is there something that fits this category in 3053? Maybe a super cheesy IIC mech or something?

(disregarding "weak" and unavailable (such as long extinct) 'Mechs)

Inner Sphere:
PXH-1b Royal Phoenix Hawk
- multiple energy hardpoints in both arms and one high energy hardpoint just next tothe cockpit; at least two ballistic hardpoints
- fast and with jump jets
- ECM

ANV-3M Anvil
- on one hand, no hardpoints in arms. On the other hand energy hardpoints on both sides of the cockpit
- with jump jets and ECM

The Clans:
Black Lanner
- Clan OmniMech
- faster than the Ryoken (119km/h; 150 km/h with MASC), but no jump jets
- ECM suite
- various energy, missile and ballistic hardpoints

Viper 2
- essentially Madcat with Jump Jets and ECM suite
-energy/ballistic hardpoints

Edited by martian, 07 December 2015 - 05:35 AM.

[Juodas Varnas]

martian, on 07 December 2015 - 05:14 AM, said:

This variant is not from 3053, but from 3059.

Ah, my mistake.

[Widowmaker1981]

martian, on 07 December 2015 - 05:14 AM, said:

The Clans:
Black Lanner
- Clan OmniMech
- faster than the Ryoken (119km/h; 150 km/h with MASC), but no jump jets
- ECM suite
- various energy, missile and ballistic hardpoints

Viper
- essentially Madcat with Jump Jets and ECM suite
-energy/ballistic hardpoints

Black Lanner is pretty crappy though, its got a severe case of over engine - a 385 on a 55 tonner is just an absurd waste of tonnage.

[Metus regem]

Part of the issue is, ECM has a very different role on TT than it does here, in TT the main use for it is to disrupt C3 networks, as well as advanced fire control systems like Artemis. It doesn't make your Mech, or those in the ECM bubble invisible to targeting.

Edited by Metus regem, 07 December 2015 - 06:09 AM.

[Wildstreak]

Alistair Winter, on 07 December 2015 - 03:20 AM, said:

Are there more medium or heavy mechs in Battletech that has ECM, jump jets and decent firepower, but haven't been introduced to MWO yet, at the current point of our timeline?

We've got the GRF-2N and SHC-B, but I'm getting a bit tired of those.

Not just the SHC-B variant, you can put ECM on all your SHCs.

[Alistair Winter]

Wildstreak, on 07 December 2015 - 05:27 AM, said:

Not just the SHC-B variant, you can put ECM on all your SHCs.

Next thing you'll tell me that Clan mechs can actually swap their arms between variants.

[Widowmaker1981]

Oh also, i would NOT say the 2 tons for MASC on the Shadow Cat is a waste, especially not now after the skill tree nerfs. Main thing i like it for is the gigantic acceleration boost - allows you to be instantly at full speed after you land from a jump, which is imo massive, and worth way more than the extra ~10kph it would have from a bigger engine. Scats main issue is very poor quirks considering the mechs hardpoints and available tonnage.

[martian]

Widowmaker1981, on 07 December 2015 - 05:17 AM, said:

Black Lanner is pretty crappy though, its got a severe case of over engine - a 385 on a 55 tonner is just an absurd waste of tonnage.

That might be true, but I would imagine that with such oversize engine the Black Laner could be very nimble.

And of course, you don't have too many ECM platforms to choose from in early 3050s.

[KinLuu]

Why not Zoidbringer?

[Sjorpha]

A unit/class/character/mech that does everything well is horrible game design, too many developers fall for that temptation sadly.

[topgun505]

That is in the current timeline? Not much.

Mercury II. MCY-100
Morpheous MR-P1
Phoenix Hawk PXH-1b Special
Phoenix Hawk PXH-1c Special
Phoenix Hawk PXH-2

For clans (that isn't already released):

Lupus Prime

[Almond Brown]

Alistair Winter, on 07 December 2015 - 03:20 AM, said:

Are there more medium or heavy mechs in Battletech that has ECM, jump jets and decent firepower, but haven't been introduced to MWO yet, at the current point of our timeline?

We've got the GRF-2N and SHC-B, but I'm getting a bit tired of those. The Griffin, with 2 energy hardpoints and 4 missile hardpoints, can only be played as an LRM or SRM carrier, really. Sure, you can equip 2 ERPPCs, but it's kind of risky to have all your firepower in one arm without bigger armour & structure quirks. The Shadow Cat is fun, but it's more of a novelty, really. PGI never tried to fix MASC and never let us unequip it either, so we're stuck with 2 tons of dead weight on a mech with a serious lack of hardpoints and 3 tons of locked jump jets to boot.

When it comes to mechs, I'm kind of what roleplayers refer to as a 'munchkin'. The kind of guy who wants his Barbarian to also be a super powerful sorceror, and a great thief, while also having a Paladin's armour and a Priest's healing skills. And preferably a pet dragon. Riding a unicorn in plate armour. In other words, I do admit that I'm kind of looking for the ultimate lone wolf mech here, with all the bells and whistles.

Is there something that fits this category in 3053? Maybe a super cheesy IIC mech or something?

If there is and PGI introduces it, you will not be the only "munchkin" on the battlefield. Thus the status quo remains unaffected.

[Signal27]

Alistair Winter, on 07 December 2015 - 03:20 AM, said:

Are there more medium or heavy mechs in Battletech that has ECM, jump jets and decent firepower, but haven't been introduced to MWO yet, at the current point of our timeline?

We've got the GRF-2N and SHC-B, but I'm getting a bit tired of those. The Griffin, with 2 energy hardpoints and 4 missile hardpoints, can only be played as an LRM or SRM carrier, really. Sure, you can equip 2 ERPPCs, but it's kind of risky to have all your firepower in one arm without bigger armour & structure quirks.

As a ECM Griffin-2N ERPPC pilot that is my main medium mech, I can tell you that you will rarely get your arm blown off before your engine explodes anyway. In fact, I can't even remember the last time I got my ERPPC arm amputated before my torso got completely shot to hell.

Edited by Signal27, 07 December 2015 - 09:36 AM.

[Almond Brown]

Sjorpha, on 07 December 2015 - 05:50 AM, said:

A unit/class/character/mech that does everything well is horrible game design, too many developers fall for that temptation sadly.

Well PGI did not have much choice when they did it now did they.

Imagine how many TimberWolves/MadCats Mechs they sold. LOL!