47 replies to this topic

[DjPush]

Having spent the last 3 days with a total of 14 hours using all 3 variants. I'm a bit confused about what to think of it. I just finished the basic pilot tree on all 3 and have finished with speed tweek in the elite tier. Speed tweek has made a drastic impact on the mechs movement, yet it doesn't seem to be quite enough. It still moves worse than my IS Highlanders.

The load out possibilities have potential to be devestating. Most of my builds have a 80+ alpha with enough space for heat sinks to have a 1.25 or better heat efficiency. Pretty impressive.

Here is the catch. They have no staying power in the battlefield. If you sneeze in the cockpit, you risk losing your arm or torso. That being said, this mech is reduced to nothing more than a backfield fire support mech that spends most of it's time running and repositioning behind the team. We all know this is near impossible for a 90 ton mech with a top speed of 62kph.

A new tactic had to be developed to pilot this thing. I found myself trying to predict where the enemy was going and how my team would react. Then try to get there first, far enough away from the front line to not get cored by medium laser boats, yet close enough that I don't end up getting left behind or swarmed by lights.

You can forget about brawling. People have already figured out how soft these mechs are and immediately aim for the side torso.

Load outs for the Highlander should include Large pulse and a ton of LRMs. Ballistics are practically useless. A single UAC10 might be useful but the risk of jamming and being without the weapon is a death sentence. You can fit a UAC20 in the right arm but you really want to avoid getting close enough to use it. The gauss rifle... Well it's not a brawling weapon anymore. I wouldn't put any more than 2 tons of ammo if you equip one. You will lose it in the first 3 minutes of a match.

This is just my assessment of the mech. Other people may have different or better experiences.

I like the mech but it is extremely difficult to pilot. Your chances of survival are slim. However, when the stars align and everything goes right. This thing can be a monster. At the moment it is just too damn soft.

Edited by DjPush, 18 December 2015 - 08:21 AM.

[ExplicitContent]

I haven't spent the amount of time you have, but yes to all. When my most viable highlander is a (gasp) lrm60 boat, something needs to change.

[0bsidion]

Yeah, it's funny. We had all these Chicken Littles running around yelling, "The sky is falling!" when these mechs were first announced. So many doomsday predictions were made. And now they're here and from my experience so far are generally worse than the Omnis we already have.

[ExplicitContent]

I'm not an advocate of P2W, but I do expect P4V (pay for viable). The line is where does the lore affect the decisions for how the mechs should be. I get that in lore they were a death sentence. So the lore group is all, "This is how they are supposed to be!" But if that's the case, then why have all of my other clan mechs been nerfed so hard and balanced against their IS counterparts? Not asking for OP, just asking for competitive. Currently the IICs have the negatives of both sides of the fence. Clan heat and IS hitboxes sans structure quirks.

[DjPush]

I just don't know what think. It may be too soon to make a call. I think before PGI does anything (if they do) they need to wait for the dust to settle with the IIC mechs. I can see the potential in these mechs. I think once I have them mastered it will be a different story. I should have them done by the end of the weekend. When they are finished I'll give them another review.

Edited by DjPush, 18 December 2015 - 08:28 AM.

[Alistair Winter]

There's really nothing intrinsically bad about the Highlander or the Highlander IIC, but both mechs suffer because of their hardpoints and their engine cap. At 60 kph, you're not very mobile at all. With 2 ton hoverjets, even less so. So you have to rely on firepower. Unfortunately, most Highlander variants have a fairly even combination of ballistic, energy and missile hardpoints, and that's just not very good.

An AC20 or UAC20 with some lasers and some missiles isn't scaring anyone. All the best assaults generally have lots of lasers or lots of ballistics or a combination of both, unless they're LRM boats. This is why the IS Victor and IS Highlanders have been unpopular for a while. Especially after the gauss nerf! It's not going to change unless PGI does something to encourage the combination of ballistics, missiles and energy. And right now, those builds are usually too hot, because they require 2 different types of ammo, ballistics take up a lot of space, missiles take up a lot of space (especially with Artemis) and you don't have the space and/or weight available for heat sinks to keep the thing cool.

If UAC20, UAC10, AC20s and AC10s had less than half the amount of heat they do now, the Highlander and Highlander IIC would be much better mechs. These mechs always lack the DPS to be effective at only 60 kph.

And fix those jump jets too.

0bsidion, on 18 December 2015 - 08:04 AM, said:

Yeah, it's funny. We had all these Chicken Littles running around yelling, "The sky is falling!" when these mechs were first announced. So many doomsday predictions were made. And now they're here and from my experience so far are generally worse than the Omnis we already have.

We also had people running around yelling "I can't wait to destroy all those ACH's with my Jenner IIC", but that didn't exactly come to fruition either. Without knowing the quirks, it's always hard to predict how mechs are going to perform. Well, almost always.

[Barantor]

Alistair Winter, on 18 December 2015 - 08:31 AM, said:

We also had people running around yelling "I can't wait to destroy all those ACH's with my Jenner IIC", but that didn't exactly come to fruition either. Without knowing the quirks, it's always hard to predict how mechs are going to perform. Well, almost always.

Nobody knows anything till they try them in games, we have had predictions like the Shadowhawk would be DOA because of how tall it was and then it dominated the Meta for a long time till jump sniping died, so did the many other mechs. Shadowhawk is still good, these older jumper mechs got hurt the worst with the JJ nerfs since they don't have other mobility to fall back on.

I'm of the mind that some JJ heavies and Assaults should get JJ quirks that make them have twice the JJ capacity as normal to at least make up for the anemic nature of the current JJs.

[Hit the Deck]

A HGN should be made as a fire support Mech in our current situation because of the relatively slow speed and hardpoints. Suitable weapons are Gauss, the large lasers family, and LRMs.

Sometimes it can carry dual UAC/5 or UAC/10 (IIC).

[Gas Guzzler]

I had a very similar experience actually, with the whole trying to predict what the team is going to do. It backfired a little last night because I was tired and playing like garbage, but its definitely an unforgiving mech. The IS version is actually 10 times better at poking due to its accel/decel quirks and all the direct fire hardpoints on one side.

I think I actually like the IS one more right now, the 732B in particular.

[Roadkill]

I dunno, I'm liking my HGN-IIC(O) brawler. I carry a UAC/20, 3 x MPL, and 3 x SSRM-6. It's pretty freakin' brutal. 20, lasers, 20, Streaks... it's a constant stream of serious damage.

Just don't lead with it. Any Mech will go down if focused, but the IICs go down faster. So make sure you have teammates with you when you engage, preferably letting them engage first. The IICs all seem pretty epic as the "2" in a 1-2 punch.

[DjPush]

On my HGN-IIC(o) I have a UAC20, 1 x LP, 2 x ERML, 3 x SRM6. It wasn't working out so well at first. I was getting to close to the front and my UAC20 jammed on every shot. Once I got a little further into the pilot tree and I had some practice with it. I was getting 6-700 dmg games with it. I'm guessing these mechs will be pretty sweet when mastered. They just require you use your head a little better.

[Bishop Steiner]

DjPush, on 18 December 2015 - 12:05 PM, said:

On my HGN-IIC(o) I have a UAC20, 1 x LP, 2 x ERML, 3 x SRM6. It wasn't working out so well at first. I was getting to close to the front and my UAC20 jammed on every shot. Once I got a little further into the pilot tree and I had some practice with it. I was getting 6-700 dmg games with it. I'm guessing these mechs will be pretty sweet when mastered. They just require you use your head a little better.

Yup. It's why I am kinda against any "sky is falling" posts just yet. Some, like the Jenny, do seem to be weak...others.... just need to find the sweet spot (my first impression of my HBK-IICs were NOT charitable)

[Escef]

So far I've found the Highlander IIC to be about where it should be. The clan XL and change in hardpoint locations over its Inner Sphere cousin make the IIC just as fast, more durable, and able to still meaningfully contribute after a right torso loss (something most standard engine IS HGNs had an issue with).

It plays a lot like a slower, jump capable Warhawk.

[pbiggz]

I destroy in my highlander so sounds like you guys all got personal problems.

[Bishop Steiner]

pbiggz, on 18 December 2015 - 01:06 PM, said:

I destroy in my highlander so sounds like you guys all got personal problems.

but you are a bad playing bads. You are scared to show your mighty Epeen Badge, so it must be so!

[saagri]

I have a 2xlrm15, 3 ml, and a uac20 highlander and it seems to do best by using lrms in the first phase of the match to soften targets, then use the closer ranged weapons to mop up. But yeah, every one seems to go for the right side torso. Also, I have lost my left arm a surprising number of times as well...

[Escef]

saagri, on 18 December 2015 - 01:14 PM, said:

I have a 2xlrm15, 3 ml, and a uac20 highlander and it seems to do best by using lrms in the first phase of the match to soften targets, then use the closer ranged weapons to mop up.

Honestly, I run 2xLRM5 on a brawler King Crab (2xAC20, 2xML, 325 STD), just to give me something to do at range and help stave off that urge to commit way too early. It's a bit of a psychological crutch, the build would probably be better off with SRMs, but not the way I play, y'know?

[Gas Guzzler]

pbiggz, on 18 December 2015 - 01:06 PM, said:

I destroy in my highlander so sounds like you guys all got personal problems.

I destroy in it as well. That doesn't mean it is without issue, nor does it speak to its inferiority to the 732B or other assaults.

I also destroyed in a DDC prior to the last quirk pass, so that must have been fine too?

Edited by Gas Guzzler, 18 December 2015 - 01:55 PM.

[Bishop Steiner]

Gas Guzzler, on 18 December 2015 - 01:54 PM, said:

I destroy in it as well. That doesn't mean it is without issue, nor does it speak to its inferiority to the 732B or other assaults.

I also destroyed in a DDC prior to the last quirk pass, so that must have been fine too?

well, it implies it likely cannot be TERRIBAD, or you would not have been destroying anything. (unless farming tier5s?)

[pbiggz]

Bishop Steiner, on 18 December 2015 - 01:09 PM, said:

but you are a bad playing bads. You are scared to show your mighty Epeen Badge, so it must be so!

Tier 4. Clubbing seals is just too fun.