100 replies to this topic

[BigRed40Tech]

Maxwell Albritten, on 11 January 2016 - 08:15 AM, said:

The Capellan Confederation is a nation of rats.

I'm glad we can finally find common ground. Remember, admitting it is the first step towards changing it.

[CrazyWorm9]

hrmm yess i see it, the answer to the delema was in-front the whole time.

WoL = Goon = Squak squad = poor liao = Marik + Davion must free Liao from the Squak squad.

in all seriousness phase 3 wipse map clean again fresh start in phase 3 real war begins

Edited by CrazyWorm, 11 January 2016 - 08:19 AM.

[Dawnstealer]

Really, I feel for you southern states that don't have a direct border with the Clans, but the fact there's a NAP between two of the powers against the third is honestly kind of weird. Make it a three-way battle and make it interesting.

I remember some of the best battles I had in CW1 was on the Marik and Kurita border. Fighting the Clans is a grind, and the styles are so different, but against fellow IS factions, it's a whole different story - you get different tactics, way different builds, and so on. The three of you should be going crazy invading each other.

It's a game.

[BigRed40Tech]

Dawnstealer, on 11 January 2016 - 08:18 AM, said:

Really, I feel for you southern states that don't have a direct border with the Clans, but the fact there's a NAP between two of the powers against the third is honestly kind of weird. Make it a three-way battle and make it interesting.

I remember some of the best battles I had in CW1 was on the Marik and Kurita border. Fighting the Clans is a grind, and the styles are so different, but against fellow IS factions, it's a whole different story - you get different tactics, way different builds, and so on. The three of you should be going crazy invading each other.

It's a game.

That's just what you'd want, so when you finish those gene-constructed bufffoons, you'll be facing off against weak, separated enemies! I knew it!

[Kjudoon]

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Yes, take your own advice, yo.

Thanks for the laugh. That was good.

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This is the sort of Davion level garbage I mentioned. Take reality, warp it into something different, then act pained over it.

Davs aren't the one's trying to "George Lucas" this, you are. Liao shot first... and now doesn't want to deal with the consequences. I've stated before, most of Marik just wants their 8 worlds back. If the algorithm will just reverse course, all would be fine. If it doesn't we'll work something out sooner or later. Now if you want to continue to use the same spoon as the Antares Scorpions did to get you into this mess, you're gonna have to accept your part in it. TCAF already has made the situation worse. There is no reason why you should be stirring this up so much.

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You can say a lot of things, but you don't have to be a liar. Do you really want to be remember as being a liar?

I think I broke my irony-o-meter on that one. Should have turned down the sensitivity.

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I get that Marik wants to get some worlds back and that they are bored of stomping on Davion like the rest of us,

Actually, most of us are not bored with dropping on Davion. They've been generally an honorable and fun opponant who knows the value of playing back on the battlefield AND the forums in kind. So please, just speak for yourself. Not our faction and probably might want to use caution speaking for yours.

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but it's the childish Davion-esque truth bending that is the real disappointment here.

>snap< Now you broke the needle on the Irony-o-meter. I need a new one. Maybe digital this time.

Edited by Kjudoon, 11 January 2016 - 08:33 AM.

[MovinTarget]

Seriously Liao folk,

If you want our "a" game insults, you need to bring your "A" game in something other than delusions of grandeur.

Only your Supreme Chancellor would have the vision to polish up a toilet and christen it the celestial throne. You remind me of an ancient country on Terra... North Korea, I think... yeah, they worshipped delusional loony toons as well...

[Heart of Storm]

Not gonna reply on a quote by quote basis because, well, damn this below up quick.

ThomasMarik - I accept and for the most part agree with the essence of what you say. Personally I'm angered that, despite two threads worth of discussion on the Liao forums with the majority of loyalists not wanting to break the NAP, same as the majority of Marik forces we are still at eachothers throats.

Every drop Marik makes on Liao is a victory for Davion, and same with Liao on Marik. I've been saying this to Mercs 'till I'm blue in the face and all for nothing. Neither of our houses stand to gain, only Davion does, and its all because some Mercs decided that PUGstomping in clan mechs was no fun now that we have some semblance of balance and decided to come stir up trouble in IS space.

They succeeded, and its deeply frustrating to watch this unfold, discuss the unfolding scenario, have everyone agree that this was happening and we wouldn't be suckered into it, and STILL end up at blows with Marik.

I can't explain TCAF's actions, I can conjecture (and have done) but I am not TCAF - and in essence the issue here is loyalists joining the Mercs, that's the dealbreaker - I see the claims of other loyalists joining TCAF - yet to see it myself and only one person seems to be claiming that so make of it what you will.

I get it, I can't undo it, if I could hand back eight planets today I would, Marik is worth that much at least.

As I said in the original post, exact what revenge you feel you need, I won't drop against Marik whilst they rightfully claim what is theirs. Every other Liao loyalist can decide where they stand on the issue and act accordingly.


Kjudoon/Stormeagle - Mercs weren't (to the best of my knowledge) hired by Liao loyalists, they weren't answerable to us as we weren't their paymasters, you'd have to look beyond both of our borders to find who was paying them to fight.

Keep that in mind when brandishing accusations about our inability to keep Mercs in check, we can only do that when they're OUR Mercs.

[MovinTarget]

Heart of Storm, on 11 January 2016 - 09:58 AM, said:

Keep that in mind when brandishing accusations about our inability to keep Mercs in check, we can only do that when they're OUR Mercs.

Would like to see in forums where you and the "Liao Loyalists" disavowed the mercs that joined your faction *BEFORE* they proceeded to attack Marik. The fact of the matter is that you profited from them and had no problem profiting from them under your mantle until your ally decided it was tired of the abuse.

And then you throw up your hands and say "oh, but we can't control our mercs" and then TCAF gets involved and you say "Oh, but we can control TCAF"

If your Supreme Chancellor is so enlightened, why can't he keep a grip on anything?



Including reality?

[maniacos]

Heart of Storm, on 11 January 2016 - 09:58 AM, said:

You sound like a sane, but helpless mind in a crowd of lunatics. I hope phase 3 will give some power to houses dealing with mercs and especially trouble makers from the clan space. Until then we mercs will continue to fulfill what the contracts our command negotiated with our employers agreed to.

[beerandasmoke]

The elephant in the room that no one wants to talk about is TCAF. Will they abide by any NAP between the two loyalist faction? Until there is an answer from them then talking about peace is probably a waste of time.

[HelloKittyWarfare]

beerandasmoke, on 11 January 2016 - 10:24 AM, said:

The elephant in the room that no one wants to talk about is TCAF. Will they abide by any NAP between the two loyalist faction? Until there is an answer from them then talking about peace is probably a waste of time.

thats the point.

don't blame mercs for this. TCAF attacked marik worlds from day 1 of this conflict in reasonable numbers. they said multiple times clear: TCAF will attack marik and davion worlds.
i understand that there are liao-units who don't want this situation, but it will make no difference if they talk to marik at all. speak with TCAF, loyal liaos. thats the only way to end this.

if they ignore you and your wishes, thats no problem of anyone in marik for sure. marik is forced to fight by one of your own loyal units (and some mercs who doesn't count in this problem). thats the point. and there is no end in sight.
you can leave liao to fight as a marik against TCAFs invasions if you don't agree with their deeds.

TCAF is too big, to strong compared to the rest of liao faction. you can't do much if they don't want to listen. let's take a look at liao in last tykayyid stats:




http://mwomercs.com/...d-stats-part-2/
look at the activity of liao. TCAF says, they don't care about the NAP. thats a real huge part of your fighting forces, loyalists. if you can't convince them to stop their actions and , maybe,let marik get back their planets "you owe them", there is no sense in keep talking, am i right?
it's up to you.

[Dawnstealer]

stormeagle, on 11 January 2016 - 08:23 AM, said:

That's just what you'd want, so when you finish those gene-constructed bufffoons, you'll be facing off against weak, separated enemies! I knew it!

...I admit nothing.

[MovinTarget]

...and SMC was probably just passing through...

[Heart of Storm]

@MovinTarget

When they were doing the Chancellors work and rolling Davions? of course we didn't. We had no reason to suspect they weren't hired by a Liao faction after all - the only thing that would make us question was a post by a Davion suggesting foul play was afoot, but this was readily dismissed as forum salt.

Following the initial breach of the peace (which was by [AS], not [TCAF]) I had some interesting conversations with some Marik mercs, and ultimately with members of [AS] which is where the Mercs hiring Mercs thing was revealed - it wasn't a secret, we just hadn't known to ask.

So you're right, we didn't disavow them, because they hadn't done anything to deserve it initially, so why would we?

@ Jherek C

Its what it feels like, what will be will likely be, I've had my say, and as I've said its for all in House Liao to make their own stands based on their convictions. I've said what I will do, for what its worth I won't drop against Marik whilst they retake what's theirs. Its a small gesture but truthfully its all I've got, I am not Liao, just one warrior who just wants to stomp Davions without this politics creeping in.

@ bearandasmoke & HelloKittyWarfare

I've mentioned TCAF - but I'm as at a loss to explain their actions as anyone else. As I said I can conjecture that breaking the attack routes to Liao was a red rag (as its reclamation is their units stated goal) but it is conjecture.

TCAF, as you are right to say, are the big guns in Liao, and those big guns have ended up pointed at you, somehow.

Unless TCAF cares to explain itself it has to remain the elephant in the room, we both know what the problem is - I would stress that TCAF has existed for a long time and haven't violated Marik borders before, its only now, during MercGate that this has happened.

Its hard not to see the two as unrelated but again, this is conjecture.

[Texas Merc]

FWIW two days into CW Beta Uno I could see what was happening with Davion and their love of ghost dropping. At the time things had picked back up since CW was new and shiny and we were fieliding 2 sometimes 3 full CW groups not losing any matches and still losing planets.

I took it upon myself to go over and talk to a few friends I had in Marik. Namely Mp00 who I have been gaming with for damn near 15 years. I let him know what was happening on the Liao front with Davs and he agreed as it was the same for Marik on the Dav front. We negotiated a truce for the small groups that were skirmishing on the green/pink border. Eventually that became a makeshift alliance.

It would be a shame to let all of that go since it has lasted over a year. I get mercs infighting and stirring the pot, that stuff happens from time to time, but the loyalist units should just focus on Davion or better yet the clans.

I am sure all of this will end once the loyalist units get to vote on attack lanes but don't build up too much bad blood.




oh seven m8 and never not squawk!!!!!

HelloKittyWarfare, on 11 January 2016 - 11:24 AM, said:

thats the point.

words

get out

[Alex Reed]

Heart of Storm, on 11 January 2016 - 04:46 AM, said:

To the Loyalist of House Marik

Over the past few days it would appear the tensions on our borders have escalated into near open conflict, I am writing this to you for two reasons, one is to try get into the open the confusing sequence of events that have led to this distraction on our mutual front, and the second is to appeal to the common sense of those in both of our Houses who did not wish for this to come about and seek to see it brought to an end.

Common sense only becomes a problem when it is no longer common. Example, when TCAF declared that they would not abide by the NAP until Phase 3, they were announcing that the gloves were coming off. (FACT: 12/25/2015) When TCAF makes a statement like that, takes eight Marik planets, and then complains of attack lanes being blocked ... TCAF has lost its senses.

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Currently the main benefactors of this dispute are not Marik, or Liao, but that Steiner/Davion FedRat filth, who even now are taking a break from their daily routine of sexual misconduct with livestock and hiding under their beds whenever they see Green/Purple to laugh at out dispute and plot our mutual downfalls.

Given the nature of this RP paragraph, I am not going to even touch it.

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This must end.

Agreed. Liao will dictate the terms. Operation Flaming Sword is an operation limited in scope to eight planets. If Liao continues to harass Mariks in forums or cause issues in game, the limited scope of this Operation will turn into a Campaign that I don't believe either side wants to see (since, after all, we won't be buddies again until Phase Three .. acta non verba).

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As I see things, the sequence of events are as follows:

1. House Marik hires Mercs to assist on the Davion front.
2. A series of Merc units are hired on Liao's behalf to target the Davion front (not by any Liao loyalist unit I would stress).
3. Davions put on the run.
4. A Liao-aligned Merc unit targets Marik planets, after much discussion their aggression against Marik ceases, but tensions are mounted.
5. A Marik aligned-Merc trashtalks the Liao Mercs into open aggression.
6. A Marik aligned-Merc cuts off Liao's route to our namesake planet, Liao.
7. TCAF, a Liao loyalist unit attacks Marik planets blocking their route to Liao.
8. Marik Mercs retaliate against TCAF.

Can we all see the common thread here? Mercs, mercs and more mercs.

OK, let me offer the Marik perspective...

1. Seraphim Regiment acts as liaison to Phoenix Legion to assist on the Davion Front.

2. Antares Scorpions (and 69MG?) are hired to attack Davion ... wasn't paying attention ... wasn't our front.

3. Once again, not our front. Pics or it didn't happen.

4. Antares Scorpions targets the first Marik planets and trolls Marik through these forums to come out for a fight. This first made Marik aware that something was going on. This and Gonta's (TCAF) aforementioned message.

5. Is trashtalk now an Act of War? I cannot speak for the whole of the FWLM, but I can say that it was not SRPH.

6. Here, your timeline breaks down because it is out of order. You also fail to mention that your units took two planets from Marik just after the Mariks took them from Davion (Phact and Elnath) ... technically not your planet to take ... therefore, another transgression of NAP in the name of rebuilding the path back to Liao.

7. The Zion Province does NOT block Liao's path back to Liao. Your units took the entire province: Zion (Provincial capital), Kyrkbacken, Suzano, and Asuncion (Homeworld of the Seraphim Regiment, by the way ... poor choice of attack there). The Zion province is Marik space at every map reset ... so what you are saying is that it is OK to cut through the space of a sovereign house and annex his planets for a desirable "lane?"

8. ALL of the FWLM retaliated against TCAF and Liao. Almost two battalions dropped on Zion on the first night of Operation Flaming Sword. SAFE agents inside the Liao TeamSpeak server reported that pilots were being warned against going to Zion due to the superior numbers of the Marik forces.

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By way of evidence may I submit the following, taken 5 minutes ago.



Marik is blocking our route to planet Liao, reclaiming this is a stated goal of TCAF, repeatedly blocking this route was never going to lead to anything but trouble.

Notice the tags, it's a Merc unit responsible.

Once again, the aggrieved party has no choice but to sit back and take it? You say that you understand the situation but it is clear that you do not. For instance, the "merc unit" in question on Gan Singh is none other than the Seraphim Regiment ... we have been loyalist Marik for over two months now ... please check our recruitment thread in the House Marik forum and have your Maskirovka agents get their prescriptions checked.

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At this point, a solution needs to be found. I see elements of Marik soliciting alliances from House Steiner and even the Davions, what good will come of this? do you think Davion will forget the worlds you took from her? do you think the Davions won't turn on you the second Liao is pushed back?

OK, I'll offer a different view. If you have Marik soliciting help from Steiner, I would like to see it. I think you had a typo as Liao has been propositioning Steiner for an attack on the Marik border ... hardly sounds like the work of a true NAP friend, right? Sounds more like desperation. Someone who wants to incite more war on a neighbor rather than truly solve a conflict.

Also, why should we worry about Davion? Two days after our Op began, the Marik/Davion front grew quiet except for PUG battles. It sounds like you are more afraid of Davion taking advantage. TCAF should have thought of that before they started going all Galactus on our planets. It only makes sense that if Davion hates Liao and Liao hits Marik, Marik responds by pulling troops off their front to drop into yours. TCAF gave the Davions a gift basket ... their actions reduced Davion from a three front war to two. More troops on your doorstep ... once again, not our front - not our problem.

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We are your longest and staunchest friends and you are ours, together we must prove the strength of that friendship and endure past the chaos visiting Mercs, and the inability of our houses to control them with the tools we have available.

Transgressions against Marik have occurred, planets have been taken from Marik which should not have been, I understand your desire and need to reclaim those planets and will not seek to stop you in doing so.

The problem from Liao may have been visiting mercs. Marik has no such problem as Phoenix Legion was following FWLM orders the entire time. They are an honorable group and I was proud to serve beside them all. I am hoping that our honor and hospitality earned us a chance to run with them again sometime. The other group you alluded to was SRPH, my group ... when you took Zion Province, you played with fire ... hence Operation Flaming Sword.

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You are angry, and a blood price must be paid to sate that, I understand that too, but when that is done let us remember who are enemies are, and who our friends are.

8 planets ... that is the cost. After that, we may want to negotiate skirmishes to shift the algorithm to give you your attack lane while, at the same time, get us back to our southwestern border. I believe that would be mutually beneficial to all parties involved.

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Let this not be the end of what has been to our mutual benefit since the start. Let us not succumb to the machinations of Mercs, or the FedRats, let us be strong and endure together.

I am sure that Marik would very much like that ... once these accounts have been settled.

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I am open to suggestion about how this can be made right, I'm sure others in Liao are as well. You are not our enemies and we are not yours.

See above ... the 8 planet -- shift algorithm plan.

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Yours, with honour.

A Liao Loyalist.

Sincerely,

Col. Alex Reed
CO of the Seraphim Regiment

Edited by Alex Reed, 11 January 2016 - 05:22 PM.

[Kjudoon]

Alex Reed, on 11 January 2016 - 05:14 PM, said:

>Epic Stuff<

Edited by Kjudoon, 11 January 2016 - 06:00 PM.

[GI Journalist]

Free World League/Capellan Confederation Border Dispute

SPECIAL REPORT

At the heart of the current dispute between House Marik and House Liao lies the planet of Phact. A Capellan world captured by Federated Suns during 4th Succession War, it was finally liberated by Free Worlds League on December 19, 3050.

That victory was usurped by Antares Scorpions under the House Liao banner on December 20, 3050.

Following this first violation of the long standing non-aggression pact between House Marik and House Liao, came a disturbing message from one of the mercenaries responsible.

eSeifer, on 21 December 2015 - 06:27 AM, said:

Liao will attack Marik. Not the mercs, not the Loyalist, the new and reformed Liao as a whole.

At about this time, eSeifer began campaigning for the formation of a Liao Council. As proposed, this council would make far reaching decisions on diplomacy and each loyalist group of more than 8 member would receive a vote. It is not clear how many loyalist units responded to this proposal, as few saw merit in a council assembled by a mercenary motivated by apparently nothing more than the potential profits generated by a conflict on the border with House Marik. Some loyalist units disregarded the notice entirely.

This was a grave mistake. In the absence of other loyalist units, eSeifer and other mercenary under temporary contract reached an accommodation with the Tikonov Commonality Armed Forces [TCAF], persuading them of the merits of violating the cease-fire.

eSeifer, on 03 January 2016 - 01:50 PM, said:

My men will be paid well for every Purple chicken planet taken and Davion Scum wiped off another planet.
We formed a none existent high command among the chaos that are the loyalist outside of TCAF, who seen the need to form an alliance with the MERCs. (Ty TCAF for your coordination.)

We have taken both fronts and will continue to do so. As one contract expires more will come. Liao will be the empire it should be.

With other mercenaries and TCAF in the lead, House Marik worlds began to fall with the new year: Elnath, Ventabren and Suzano. House Marik patiently ignored this as other House Liao loyalist units began to protest.

Phact and Elnath had historically belonged to Liao. Those two attacks might have been overlooked, but Ventabren, Suzano, and Asuncion? Mercenaries were straying far into the Free Worlds League, and it wasn't even for the thrill of combat. They were dropping on the unprotected planets of a long standing ally and bragging about it!

Something was very wrong.

House Liao loyalists began to protest against mercenaries who were unilaterally declaring war on the Free World League.

The Antares Scorpions were disavowed, but the damage was done.

With the support of TCAF, the mercenaries could claim the attacks were under contract, even as they undermined years of diplomatic good faith.

The time has come to recognize this border conflict for what it is: a well orchestrated piece of statecraft. It is equally important to recognize that eSeifer and the Antares Scorpions are not to blame for it. They are mercenaries, who were paid to start a fight on the Free Worlds League border between House Liao and House Marik, and they executed their mission exceedingly well.

There remains the question of who paid them to do the job. Unfortunately, while conspiracy theorists on both sides will point fingers, it will be impossible to prove who was responsible. Mercenaries can either be tight-lipped, paid to lie, or themselves not know when it comes to employers.

We may never know for certain what agent hired them to do the job, or even whether it was a House, mercenary or Clan.

We can only examine the situation and see who benefited the most. Who benefits from a conflict between House Marik and House Liao?

Not House Liao. As the smallest standing military in the Inner Sphere, it seems apparent that some of its members were seduced by the promise of vast mercenary forces arriving in the Capellan Confederation to support their dreams of military expansion. TCAF isn't talking, but it appears they mistook the tough talk of sell-swords for dedication to their cause. House Liao is far from blameless thanks to this blunder. Reparations will have to be made, and the negotiations are going slowly.

Not House Marik. House Liao remains an intractable enemy, dedicated to reclaiming worlds lost during the Fourth Succession War. The Capellans may have put up little or no resistance on ill-gotten Free World League planets taken by the unruly mercenaries, but worlds recently retaken from the Federated Suns by House Liao will keep House Marik military units needlessly occupied.

Yet House Davion is a clear winner. They are no longer being attacked by House Marik, and House Liao must split its forces. House Davion is happy to have the opportunity to roll back any Capellan advance on its territory. None of the mercenaries promised to TCAF have arrived. No evidence can be traced to House Davion.

Indubitably, the ever suspicious House Liao will blame House Davion for this treacherous attack, but nothing will ever be proven.

[MovinTarget]

No Davion contracted mercs to disrupt your alliance. Considering how many planets we lost from those same mercs it would have made more sense to hire them to defend.

Go back to your tin foil hats and conjure up another conspiracy...

Oh wait I have one for you. A supreme chancellor with an inadequacy issue or two, tries to set up agreements with mercs that are more powerful than his standing army. When he can't control them, he sends his minions out to assert that they are acting on their own. When they begin to make notable and steady progress in FWL territory, he gets greedy and he sends his elite unit (TCAF) to support the initiative (Operation: Ben Dover). When it becomes clear that he overstepped his boundaries, he retreats to his palace man cave to practice gangnam style as he has endeavors to master the choreography of Psy ever since its discovery in the youtube section of the Helm core...


I guess that can't count as conspiracy though since that is what we all know pretty much happened.

..and tell him to give up dancing, he is never going to learn those moves.

[Ramsess]

Also to note that some loyalists other then TCAF were not bothered by the aggression and even mentioned reinforcing the mercs that were attacking us.
They did not believe in the NAP since it was only verbal and since the game could not force mercs to not attack us it wasn't their problem.