17 replies to this topic

[Fomorii]

So this is my second account now. I started two days ago and am hooked but spent my cadet bonus on the CN9-A and CN9-AH, as well as upgrading them. I found builds off https://www.mechspecs.com/ that sounded like something I'd enjoy and built from there. However I find the CN9 altogether lacks what is promised. I wanted a medium because I felt it would allow me to be a jack of all trades. I can hit and run doing good damage and getting out before I get hit in return. I didn't want a light because they dont take hits too well, and heavies are too slow. The CN9 just feels slow and squishy and it does little damage. Feels like a waste.

I'm just looking for advice on where to start. I want something that I cant get pretty far with off my cadet bonus. I was enjoying the Timberwolf, despite it being slow, because it wasnt crawling but could wreck once I got into combat. Just seemed too expensive for a first mech.

Just wanted to see where others started off so I didnt wastes another cadet bonus to find out i am not enjoying the mech i picked.

[Koniving]

Other than 'faction pledges', I can't fathom why someone would do multiple accounts. And we aren't even at the stage of real pledges until Phase 3 comes in. Though I see if you feel you have made a mistake, I can understand an attempt to start over.

That said: Your CN9s and your account can both be salvaged but they need larger engines. Stock engines are fit for Battletech, but MWO has too much pinpoint damage at 3x (or greater) than Battletech's rate, and as such those engines and speeds don't cut it. You also don't have the piloting dangers of high speed in MWO as you would in Battletech, bumping into a building at 81 kph is merely an inconvenience, not something that would rip your arm off of its shoulder because you weren't far enough over.

Your mechs won't be close to "as promised" until you reach at minimum 'basics' on the skill tree, or at 'as promised' until you get elites. Be certain to begin unlocking your skill trees immediately, your medium will 'ride' like a heavy until you do.

I have Centurion tips and videos here in the spoiler which may help you salvage your original account and those mechs.

Spoiler

These tips may be from 2012, but they will still help with your playstyle and the Centurions. I'm the leader of the pack, though these tips are written by the 4th place medium mech winner of MWO's very first tournament (note that MWO's current 'first' tournament is the first after Steam).

7NationArmy is the person filming this as well as the one whose advice is on screen. These Centurions are 100% pure stock, no mods, no skill trees, etc., and you will repeatedly see "MechSpecs" and their infamous CN9-A build, time and time again during this video...getting their rear ends handed to them by us and our standard heatsink, full stock trial mechs with our significantly weaker armor and 'bad weapon combination'.

A build is only as good as its user, and the meta builds on MechSpecs assume a lot of anyone looking to use them.

Centurion videos (This is using the weaker Yen Lo Wang Centurion which can be generally mimicked by a CN9 AH with missiles instead of lasers).
Urban combat.
3 versus 6.

Centurion joke build in action in Community Warfare (48 mechs versus 48 mechs, 12 vs 12 at a time). Lasted me right up to 36 enemies before being destroyed. Warning: CW matches are long and as such the video is long.

Tell us more about what you want, and remember that MechSpecs has a list of meta mechs for high level competition play which... in normal circumstances, suck. Without actual teams supporting you with 12 player communication and assigned roles with support, many of their builds can and will fail you. No new player should be sent to make meta mechs right off the bat.

Edited by Koniving, 13 January 2016 - 03:17 PM.

[Fomorii]

Right now I'm running the AH with an AC/20 and 2 SRM4s and an XL250. I maxed the armor except on the shield arm. I hit speeds of 82.6. If I get ahead of the pack I get wrecked as I cant take head on damage and I'm too slow to turn tail and run, and I don't do enough damage to be in a head on scrap.

The A I have an MG with 2 ML and 3 SRM6s with an XL275. All armor is maxed. I'm running at 89.1 but I seem to die even faster than I do in the AH and I do even less damage.

I'll go back to my primary account and give it some more time after I watch your video. My basic skills are almost complete, so maybe it will get better.

As far as the second account I started it because I can't delete and restart my main account. I feel like I wasted the Cadet bonus.

[Fomorii]

Those mechs look like what I imagined the gameplay being. I'll just have to save for a D, apparently that is where I'm falling short not being able to use a larger XL.

[Koniving]

"XL" and Centurion. I see your problem right there.
XL's make you much easier to kill. Significantly easier to kill. It allows you to carry more weight or get a bit more speed, but it makes you fragile. It's like the difference between heavy armor with typical weapons, or cloth armor and a giant axe. Sure that axe will do you some good... but was it worth it?

From the videos you will see speeds in the 70s are more than adequate, and the abuse that I can survive is phenomenal. Even my Centurion D in both videos it is featured in is only 81 kph. Even in the CW match, my top speed is 81 kph and my engine is STD. Not XL, that's just suicide.

You're looking for speed and versatility.

Trebuchet? (I'm being filmed by Lordred. My Trebuchet is the orange and black one). (Note: My Trebuchet is slow, I don't like going beyond 86 kph).

It's the "other half" of a Centurion, the two are intended to operate as a pair. Trebuchets are generally a little faster than their Centurion counterparts, but as such they usually can't take quite the same beating. However this being MWO, that tidbit can be easily changed. Unlike the Centurion, the Trebuchet is skinnier. It is slightly taller but skinnier, and its side torsos are much smaller than the Centurion's, allowing it to better carry an XL engine at somewhat less risk.

Enforcer and Hunchback can roll pretty well with XL engines. Here's a Hunch.


Or a Cicada.

Edited by Koniving, 13 January 2016 - 03:29 PM.

[Fomorii]

I'll put the STD back on my AH since its slow anyways. The A just did amazing but I had other mediums to run with. I love the faster speeds. I thought about what you said and usually when I get owned is when everyone does their own thing. So, I guess I just have to stick with it until I get enough to pick up a D and that will be my third Centurion for the Elite.

[Koniving]

There is a small tidbit I should add: The two videos as the Yen Lo Wang are using XL engines in order to carry that kind of ballistic weight and ammo. With a standard engine a ballistic Centurion is more likely to carry an AC/10, UAC/5, etc. and possibly some MGs along with it (or spend that ton and a half entirely on ammo or more engine).


You're welcome.

Packing with other mechs does pretty good. If you can do that, great. (Mediums are usually in Bravo or Charlie lance, find them with B for the Battlegrid and meet up with them if you're not with mediums). Now if you're a lone medium, that speed will get you too close to the enemy and too far from help. Remember that.

Also, one last video.
You don't have to be a medium to have speed. This is a 70 ton Cataphract at 84.6 kph.

You're welcome.

Packing with other mechs does pretty good. If you can do that, great. (Mediums are usually in Bravo or Charlie lance, find them with B for the Battlegrid and meet up with them if you're not with mediums). Now if you're a lone medium, that speed will get you too close to the enemy and too far from help. Remember that.

Also, one last video.
You don't have to be a medium to have speed. This is a 70 ton Cataphract at 84.6 kph without any skill unlocks.

Welcome to MWO. Visit the threads again, no doubt you'll get a lot more advice and mech suggestions.

Edited by Koniving, 13 January 2016 - 03:57 PM.

[Fomorii]

Thanks for all the advice. The game is great its just hit or miss when running in pugs I guess. And its only a couple of days, I'll probably get better and enjoy my mechs more.

Edited by Fomorii, 13 January 2016 - 03:47 PM.

[Koniving]

(Oh, I suppose consider Blackjack 1X. This is recorded before quirks.)

The BJ 1x is the fastest of them. Small engines needed to get that speed, too.

And after quirks, this is a Blackjack at 64 kph with an XL 180 engine. Mind you premium time + hero mech bonus.

It is unlikely the quirks that make it so strong will last long. Still, you only get 45 tons to work with instead of 50 (Centurion).

[Fobhopper]

Fomorii, on 13 January 2016 - 03:46 PM, said:

Thanks for all the advice. The game is great its just hit or miss when running in pugs I guess. And its only a couple of days, I'll probably get better and enjoy my mechs more.

Being at tier 5, this is the 'easiest' tier to be because you only play against tier 5,4 and 3 players. Wins and losses will happen, but you are roughly on even playing field with most of the people you are playing with. Its just a matter of understanding the basics, getting a feel for the strengths and weaknesses of each mech class, and understanding the limitations of the weapons you use.

Being at tier 3 (like I am) I am teamed up with, and play against people from all 5 tiers. So the game gets tougher to get wins (much less easy wins) because more often then not the people I am fighting are equal if not higher tiered. So dont be in a rush to get your tier up. So for now, focus on playing trial mechs, doing the tutorial 'island' and earning all the reward money from your cadet and tutorial bonuses. And get a feel for how you want to play. The tutorial Island has a good mix of mechs to test and play around in. From the lumbering but powerful and tanky King Crab (KGC) loaded with AC weapons, to the Catapult with lasers, the Catephract with a good mix of weaponry, to lighter mechs that rely on speed to survive.

The Centurion is a formidable mech, but isnt designed to trade blows. The centurion is a skirmisher, and works best when you are with your team and lending fire support until you learn to understand the flow of the battlefield and pick off mechs that are out of position or caught in the wrong neighborhood. Others have already given pretty advice on how to pilot the centurion, the rest is up to you. I recommend getting into heavier mechs next to help hammer in the points above. Because heavier mechs cant get out of trouble as quickly, and you will learn (through trial and error) when to push and commit to a fight, and when to pull back. You cant win every game, but you can give the enemy hell before you die.

I really recommend spending a lot of time doing the 'protect the center torso training' in tutorial island. Thats one of the best training exorcises in this game, and will prove to be incredibly important for centurions as well as all other mechs in the game. Learning how to spread damage is one of the most important skills in the game, and luckily the centurion literally has an entire arm designed to soak damage (but only so much).

Edited by Fobhopper, 13 January 2016 - 04:12 PM.

[Cepsis]

This is actually my original account now that I'm back playing it. I just bought the two CN9s today, after a week of reading up and watching tutorials on different mechs this is what I went with. After buying the mechs and fitting them, apparently I just got into some really bad matches. I just ran three in a row where I did not die and dished out huge amounts of damage.

As far as changing classes Fob, I might get a Timberwolf eventually, but my playstyle is more mobile. It makes me anxious just plodding along in an assault or even most of the heavies I tried. The timberwolf just felt agile enough and packed enough firepower to enjoy it.

Thanks for the responses though. Was rough spending my C-bills and then thinking I grabbed the wrong mech.

[JC Daxion]

I run an XL-265 in my AH, my other cents i run XL-280 i think.. it's been a while. You really need to twist and take care of yourself to do well in them. At the upper tiers, and groups XL's can be a liability perhaps, but your average pug, it's really just up to the pilot.

I run the ac-20 dual SRM4 with as much ammo as i can pack, i think its 4 tons and 2.5 for SRM's One of my favorite mechs. Stick with the assaults, and then when they close dance around and wreck things, i find i need the extra speed to get to cover, or stay out of the line of fire.

If you are liking cents, you might wanna try the Hero.. stick an XL-300 in it, and it is pretty much the fastest AC-20 mech around.

Going STD to tank is solid advice, but the cents i just can't stop running them with XL's. the AH to me, just has low amounts of ammo, and by the time I'm losing a torso, I'm probably pretty close to outta ammo anyway and has no center energy, so no zombie...

The other Cent's you can STD though as even with just dual ML's or even better MPL's it can still do some decent damage.. think of it as a less maneuverable spider..

[Fobhopper]

Cepsis, on 13 January 2016 - 05:04 PM, said:

As far as changing classes Fob, I might get a Timberwolf eventually, but my playstyle is more mobile. It makes me anxious just plodding along in an assault or even most of the heavies I tried. The timberwolf just felt agile enough and packed enough firepower to enjoy it.

Thanks for the responses though. Was rough spending my C-bills and then thinking I grabbed the wrong mech.

Timberwolf, Catapult (especially the C1, as well as the k2 or J), Maddog, and Ebon Jaguar are all pretty fast for heavy mechs.

Just because you are in a heavy mech doesnt mean you have to be a slouch, just dont expect to be at the front of the firing line quickly. The Boars Head hero atlas has an XL 400 engine and can hit about 70kph. Dont be afraid of heavy and assault mechs, what they lack in speed they make up for it in durability and damage. I have more than a few screenshots of me doing over 1k damage in pug drops in my KGC's. not exactly something you can claim with mechs like the centurion (no disrespect, but you dont see a centurion live long enough to deal more than 400 damage)

[Koniving]

Quote

you dont see a centurion live long enough to deal more than 400 damage

Really now?(Later today will be in the field with my Centurions.)


CN9-AL, before quirks. January 2013.
CN-D and power of coordination. Oct 11 2013.

My Wangs would obviously qualify but their vids are up there in the spoiler.

Will be recording later today. Will have to throw in text or annotations or something 'cause no way to record my voice (unless I can find a recorder on the tablet that I can merge with my video). If anyone knows of one, I'd love to know about it. Android.

Edited by Koniving, 14 January 2016 - 06:44 AM.

[aaykeem]

Doing a lot of damage in a medium mech isn't impossible, just harder to pull off, mostly because of lower alphas/DPS and shorter theoretical lifespan. But if you can avoid getting fired at, you can lay down steady damage and rack up the points. I think in my best Centurion game I had 4 kills and a bunch of assists and I'm pretty terrible with running mediums (I only leveled them up to pad the CW drop deck with something semi-decent). But I noticed that piloting mediums needs a lot more focus from me during matches, a lot more situational and positional awareness, a lot more self-control to not chase kills and potentially end up in a bad spot. This directly leads to a lot of mediocre games, where I'm caught in a bad spot or leave a good position to chase someone and run directly into the enemy firing line. With my marauders, for example, I'm sometimes just cruising along blowing things up without giving it much thought and it's a lot more forgiving on positioning mistakes, even if it's slower. Or maybe the fact that it's slower is exactly why I do better in it - I can't rush ahead of the team and get slaughtered

Cepsis, on 13 January 2016 - 05:04 PM, said:

This is actually my original account now that I'm back playing it. I just bought the two CN9s today, after a week of reading up and watching tutorials on different mechs this is what I went with. After buying the mechs and fitting them, apparently I just got into some really bad matches. I just ran three in a row where I did not die and dished out huge amounts of damage.

A lot of the times the team just doesn't click, mistakes are made and you get stomped. It's important to be able to separate the games where you could have done more, from the games where you actually did your best given the circumstances and still lost. But always try to analyze whether you could've done something differently. In my case, i find that it's all about positioning and awareness of my surroundings.

And yes, the setup is very important. Not necessarily in objective terms of how "good" it is, but whether it fits your play style or not and if you can manage it well in combat. For example I've got problems managing more than 3 different weapon types/cooldowns when brawling, so I build my mechs accordingly.

Edited by aaykeem, 14 January 2016 - 08:05 AM.

[Spheroid]

The AL is very solid. It has some very strong quirks promoting boating of large lasers. Practically free at the current sale price.

[Leone]

Koniving, Beat ya to it.



So yeah, not so tough to survive for three minutes, though this match had me tanking for the party. Mostly face tanking without much twisting. So yeah, three kill most damage dealts. One of my first Centurion matches in the event tonight an I'm pretty happy bout this one. My CN9-AH Is gonna earn its double heat sinks, 'nother match like that.

Spoiler

744814366428807127 CN9-AH-STD 255 3 2016-01-15 09:56:33

Edit: oh and if you desire Here's a CN9-D for ya. This one was in the Van in group queue, grinding Kill Most Damage Dealts for a friend with LRMs. I'm afraid I accidentally snagged one. It can be a problem, when piloting a centurion. It did earn the 'mech the right to purchase double heat sinks though. The Centurion was a trooper.

Spoiler

~Leone

Edited by Leone, 16 January 2016 - 06:41 PM.

[PigsinBlankets]

Fomorii, on 13 January 2016 - 02:43 PM, said:

So this is my second account now. I started two days ago and am hooked but spent my cadet bonus on the CN9-A and CN9-AH, as well as upgrading them. I found builds off https://www.mechspecs.com/ that sounded like something I'd enjoy and built from there. However I find the CN9 altogether lacks what is promised. I wanted a medium because I felt it would allow me to be a jack of all trades. I can hit and run doing good damage and getting out before I get hit in return. I didn't want a light because they dont take hits too well, and heavies are too slow. The CN9 just feels slow and squishy and it does little damage. Feels like a waste.

I'm just looking for advice on where to start. I want something that I cant get pretty far with off my cadet bonus. I was enjoying the Timberwolf, despite it being slow, because it wasnt crawling but could wreck once I got into combat. Just seemed too expensive for a first mech.

Just wanted to see where others started off so I didnt wastes another cadet bonus to find out i am not enjoying the mech i picked.

The trick with the Centurion is very simple, don't get shot at, I run a CN9-AH with AC/20 and 2x SRM 4, and horror of horrors an XL engine - and I regularly get 600+ damage and 2-4 kills.
There are several tactics that are viable, but generally it boils down to having patience and not engaging until most of the other team have picked their targets (make sure its not you) and then unleashing the AC20/SRM4s 2-3 times into an unsuspecting opponent and then fading from view again.
So - stick near something big and a priority target , Atlii, Dire Wolves, Timber Wolves and Marauders make wonderful meat shields, use R and make your shots count. Or if in Alpha (and the lights stick together) use the ECM cover from the Ravens and Cheetahs to get behind the enemy and then blow to hell anything that comes Raven/AC hunting. The Stormcrow pilot that goes Raven hunting and suddenly finds themselves with 2 AC20 hits to the rear centre torso, before they see you, tends to run away or die or both.
Don't fight fair the CN9-AH is a close range assassin and most effective in the mid-late stages of the battle when striking from unseen or unexpected positions.

You also will have a few downright terrible games where you do maybe 100 damage and go down quickly - this happens if you get to impatient and try and push to far or to fast, (or just get really unlucky) and position yourself directly in front of 2-3 enemy Heavy/Assaults with no better target than yours truely. Insta- death.

Edited by Asrael999, 15 January 2016 - 09:14 AM.