38 replies to this topic

[TercieI]

Sorry, OP, every mech needs to be able to deal damage first and foremost. All you need to scout is speed and eyes. It's hard for new players to hear, but all the scouting toys and paraphernalia just make you a less effective fighter, which is what you need to be after the first 90 seconds.

[TAKTCOM]

You use NARC if you want to remain invisible. If this is not important TAG easier and not require ammo.
I use ShadowCat like stealth scout-killer. 2 ML + 3 Streaks + ECM enough to infiltrate into the enemy's rear and do there whatever you want. You can keep the enemy in sight, and direct LRM. Or just backstab them. The enemy thinks that this LRM and trying to hide. Of course, if you to let a sheaf of missiles in people's faces, they realized what was going on.
I tried using NARC it is usually ineffective. Same for TAG. Your team may not have enough LRM boats. Or they quickly died. Or they do not know how to let rockets a steep trajectory and all their shots broken on the house and rock. So many possibilities. Not in NARC/TAG favor.
If I wanted to make a pure scout (I thought about it), I would take the Spider with ECM or Mist Lyx. They are quite fast, they have a lot of jump engines have ECM and the main they are very very small. You can not put them in a lot of guns, two or three laser so that it is purely reconnaissance vehicles.

[Brizna]

Why do scouting discussion turn out to talk about NARC/TAG? That's a different role.

Scouting is the act of finding the enemy and relying that information to your drop leader, for that high speed and jump jets are the most important qualities, followed closely by an ECM able mech so you can scout without being scouted yourself.

All that said, the current maps in MWO don't really require of good scouting and the result is that scouting ability palishes in comparison to how important it is to be able to deal the greatest damage once the fight starts.

Anyway if you really want to use an scout mech I suppose that SDR 5D is the best thing since sliced bread, once the enemy is scouted there are better options sure, but you will scout them just fine and most often undetected.

[Rogue Jedi]

Brizna, on 19 January 2016 - 10:38 AM, said:

Anyway if you really want to use an scout mech I suppose that SDR 5D is the best thing since sliced bread, once the enemy is scouted there are better options sure, but you will scout them just fine and most often undetected.

as a pure scout the SDR-5V is probably better than the 5D due to 20kph higher speed and the amazing mobility given by 10+ JumpJets.
the 5V is also the most lightly armed Mech in the game ^{(with the 5D sharing second place with some of the Commando varients)} and unlike the 5D does not have ECM

[epikt]

Brizna, on 19 January 2016 - 10:38 AM, said:

Why do scouting discussion turn out to talk about NARC/TAG? That's a different role.

Because, as I said on the first answer on this topic and as Terciel reminded at the top of this second page, not to mention the numerous times it has been discussed here and there, light mechs are not primarily scout, they are fighters that eventually scout. Hence you don't build a scout, that make no sense.
So we assumed that what OP meant by "scout" is "spotter for lurms", and then we can discuss diferrent build options.

[Not A Real RAbbi]

epikt, on 19 January 2016 - 11:39 AM, said:

Because, as I said on the first answer on this topic and as Terciel reminded at the top of this second page, not to mention the numerous times it has been discussed here and there, light mechs are not primarily scout, they are fighters that eventually scout. Hence you don't build a scout, that make no sense.
So we assumed that what OP meant by "scout" is "spotter for lurms", and then we can discuss diferrent build options.

Pretty much THIS.

[Dave Korhal]

So I decided to build a Raven-3L scout. Put all the toys on it: ECM, ANS, TAG, NARC. Finished its weaponry with an SRM 6 and 2 small Pulse lasers, which gives me a 20-dmg at close range, which provides a decent punch when I catch them unawares.

So even with that slapped-together build, sneaking up behind enemy mechs in PUGs is fun. It's even better when I don't shoot immediately and wait to see how long it takes them to notice; I love watching them panic as missiles rain down on them. When one finally turns around, I shoot, toss a NARC on it, and run like hell.

Scouting is fun.

[Not A Real RAbbi]

Dave Korhal, on 19 January 2016 - 07:18 PM, said:

So I decided to build a Raven-3L scout. Put all the toys on it: ECM, ANS, TAG, NARC. Finished its weaponry with an SRM 6 and 2 small Pulse lasers, which gives me a 20-dmg at close range, which provides a decent punch when I catch them unawares.

So even with that slapped-together build, sneaking up behind enemy mechs in PUGs is fun. It's even better when I don't shoot immediately and wait to see how long it takes them to notice; I love watching them panic as missiles rain down on them. When one finally turns around, I shoot, toss a NARC on it, and run like hell.

Scouting is fun.

MAD props, Dave. You simply cannot imagine how my heart sings, that another mechwarrior is taking to this light scout/spotter thing. There is hope for us lunatics yet!

[TAKTCOM]

Dave Korhal, on 19 January 2016 - 07:18 PM, said:

So I decided to build a Raven-3L scout. Put all the toys on it:...ANS...

AMS? You do not need it. ECM cover you from LRM enough good. Also TAG and NARC duplicate each other's functions.

Edited by TAKTCOM, 19 January 2016 - 10:18 PM.

[Tesunie]

loopala, on 18 January 2016 - 06:07 PM, said:

Looks almost like my old Super Locust! Just... with less firepower.

I give it a thumbs up! If for nothing else, originality.

[Dave Korhal]

TAKTCOM, on 19 January 2016 - 10:11 PM, said:

AMS? You do not need it. ECM cover you from LRM enough good. Also TAG and NARC duplicate each other's functions.

I found AMS useful for shielding nearby mechs; I had a few extra slots and tons available, so I decided to toss it on. And they duplicate each other's functions, but I find having both available handy for different situations... not to mention the TAG helps when I miss with the NARC.

[TAKTCOM]

Dave Korhal, on 20 January 2016 - 01:08 AM, said:

I found AMS useful for shielding nearby mechs; I had a few extra slots and tons available, so I decided to toss it on. And they duplicate each other's functions, but I find having both available handy for different situations... not to mention the TAG helps when I miss with the NARC.

In the end, it's your build and your choice. If it works for you, why not.

[Appogee]

Dave Korhal, on 17 January 2016 - 09:53 AM, said:

What's a good loadout for a scouting mech? My initial build is a Light Mech with max armor (80% in front), jump jets, a good engine, ECM and a TAG with minimal weapons. Am I overlooking anything?

Dave in this game, at present, we dont need Scouts.

We almost always know exactly where the enemy is and will be. What your team will most need is for you to be shooting and killing the enemy.

By all means, take a Light Mech if you prefer, pop a UAV over the enemy when you find them.

But don't be confused. Your job is to help kill the enemy, not just to find them or call out their positions. So weapons should be your prime concern.

If you mentally think your job is only to Scout, then you are just condemning your team to fight 11 v 12.

PS: TAG will only be of benefit IF there are several LRM boats on your team and IF they pay attention to whatever you're tagging and IF they couldn't have targeted without it. But you don't know who you will drop with on your team, so TAG is a speculative bet that often has no value in a match. By comparison, you could swap that TAG for a ML and deal additional direct damage in every single match.

Edited by Appogee, 20 January 2016 - 01:48 AM.

[The Basilisk]

Brizna, on 19 January 2016 - 10:38 AM, said:

Why do scouting discussion turn out to talk about NARC/TAG? That's a different role.

Scouting is the act of finding the enemy and relying that information to your drop leader, for that high speed and jump jets are the most important qualities, followed closely by an ECM able mech so you can scout without being scouted yourself.

All that said, the current maps in MWO don't really require of good scouting and the result is that scouting ability palishes in comparison to how important it is to be able to deal the greatest damage once the fight starts.

Anyway if you really want to use an scout mech I suppose that SDR 5D is the best thing since sliced bread, once the enemy is scouted there are better options sure, but you will scout them just fine and most often undetected.

THIS ALL THE WAY !!!!!

Sadly the current MWO maps do not require scouting.
Either they alow for long range visual sighting or are so smal and cluttered you and the enemy will meat at the same map hot spots again and again.

Next problem is in PuGlandia there is no team gaming most of the time....so no dropleader to report to who coordinates positions and informations.

So, yea. Lights are overquirked light weapon boats only able to do what they do due to operating close to game engine restrictions and beeing protected by the demons ping, HSR, hitscan and left out terrain interaction. ( realy try to go into a sea or turn at 135 kph on stilts with a 35t mech...you just get your leggs ripped of ).

Edited by The Basilisk, 20 January 2016 - 01:32 AM.

[MechWarrior4023212]

If in doubt BIGGER FASTER engine!

[Windscape]

narc and tag are only useful when you have an organized team, that is bringing LRM boats. A light mech pilot puts as many weapons as possible, runs like sanic, and outwits the big guys

[Tesunie]

Windscape, on 20 January 2016 - 10:48 PM, said:

narc and tag are only useful when you have an organized team, that is bringing LRM boats. A light mech pilot puts as many weapons as possible, runs like sanic, and outwits the big guys

I've seen someone use a NARC Raven to very good effect in PUGs before. Of course, we had a couple LRM users, but just knowing where the enemy was really helped a lot.

So yes... and no?

[Windscape]

Tesunie, on 21 January 2016 - 06:39 AM, said:

I've seen someone use a NARC Raven to very good effect in PUGs before. Of course, we had a couple LRM users, but just knowing where the enemy was really helped a lot.

So yes... and no?

maybe

The main reason why narc is better on an organized drop becuase you will know that you will have LRMboats, narcing in pugs can be useful, but you may not get a LRM boat at all, unless you get caustic or polar of course

[Rogue Jedi]

Windscape, on 21 January 2016 - 11:56 AM, said:

The main reason why narc is better on an organized drop becuase you will know that you will have LRMboats, narcing in pugs can be useful, but you may not get a LRM boat at all, unless you get caustic or polar of course

while I do not dissagree that it is easier to make money off NARC or TAG in orgonized group drops they are still realy helpful to the team, but like most of the scout role the bigest problem with NARC and TAG is that they are under rewarded for a high risk activity

For solo queue there is no way to know what Mech types you will get regardless of map, yes Caustic and Polar are the best maps for LRMs so an LRM player is more likely to pick them if they are available but of my 6 drops on Polar only 2 of them seemed to have LRM boats, and only about half the time on Caustic are there a lot of LRMs.

the main uses for NARC and TAG are marking priority targets so your team knows to shoot at them and turning off an ECM, yes LRMs take full advantage of the lock to fire but just knowing your priority target is for example moving through G5 is helpful