52 replies to this topic

[Mcgral18]

And the numbers are in!

<Loc iconTag="StoreIcons\Flamer.dds" descTag="@Flamer_desc" nameTag="@Flamer"/>
 
<WeaponStats maxDepth="10.0" volleydelay="0.25" speed="100" lifetime="1.0" duration="-1.0" tons="1" maxRange="90.0" longRange="90.0" minRange="0" ammoPerShot="0" ammoType="" cooldown="0.0" heat="1.0" impulse="0.0" heatdamage="4.5" damage="0.1" numFiring="1" projectileclass="" type="Energy" slots="1" Health="10" effectscale="13.00" maxheight="0" critChanceIncrease="0.14,0.08,0.03" critDamMult="1.1" trgheatinctime="3.0" heatinctime="4.75" coneoffire="10"/>

Results are what I expected, heatdamage made instant, instead of starting at zero (or .15x according to someone). Now, they'd go 4.5+0.15x, x being some sort of linear or quadratic heat ramping, as you've certainly seen with Fup's 57SHS Flamer.

Old stats for reference :

Spoiler

<Loc iconTag="StoreIcons\Flamer.dds" descTag="@Flamer_desc" nameTag="@Flamer"/>
<WeaponStats maxDepth="10.0" volleydelay="0.25" speed="100" lifetime="1.0" duration="-1.0" tons="1" maxRange="90.0" longRange="90.0" minRange="0" ammoPerShot="0" ammoType="" cooldown="0.0" heat="1.0" impulse="0.0" heatdamage="0.0" damage="0.7" numFiring="1" projectileclass="" type="Energy" slots="1" Health="10" maxheight="0" critChanceIncrease="0.14,0.08,0.03" critDamMult="1.1" trgheatinctime="3.0" heatinctime="6.25" coneoffire="10"/>

I forgot to back up my weapon stats before patching, but they've been untouched for over a year, so it's still accurate (Oct 2014)



Now, who has Premium, and wants to both see the new maps, and shoot me with Flamers? multiple quantities, and testing the chainfire stun lock.
Testing will be done on a 10 TrueDub mech, with a 60 heat capacity and 2.3 H/s dissipation (and maybe something with lots of DHS or SHS.)








They look terrible...I thought I had fixed that. Oh well, you can mostly see the important bits.

Edited by Mcgral18, 16 February 2016 - 11:32 PM.

[Deathlike]

Burn baby burn!

[Thunderbird Anthares]

and they look like microwave guns...
old effect back please

[Revis Volek]

Mcgral18, on 16 February 2016 - 12:44 PM, said:

And the numbers are in!

<Loc iconTag="StoreIcons\Flamer.dds" descTag="@Flamer_desc" nameTag="@Flamer"/>
 
<WeaponStats maxDepth="10.0" volleydelay="0.25" speed="100" lifetime="1.0" duration="-1.0" tons="1" maxRange="90.0" longRange="90.0" minRange="0" ammoPerShot="0" ammoType="" cooldown="0.0" heat="1.0" impulse="0.0" heatdamage="4.5" damage="0.1" numFiring="1" projectileclass="" type="Energy" slots="1" Health="10" effectscale="13.00" maxheight="0" critChanceIncrease="0.14,0.08,0.03" critDamMult="1.1" trgheatinctime="3.0" heatinctime="4.75" coneoffire="10"/>

Results are what I expected, heatdamage made instant, instead of starting at zero (or .15x according to someone). Now, they'd go 4.5+0.15x, x being some sort of linear or quadratic heat ramping, as you've certainly seen with Fup's 57SHS Flamer.

Old stats for reference :

Spoiler

<Loc iconTag="StoreIcons\Flamer.dds" descTag="@Flamer_desc" nameTag="@Flamer"/>
<WeaponStats maxDepth="10.0" volleydelay="0.25" speed="100" lifetime="1.0" duration="-1.0" tons="1" maxRange="90.0" longRange="90.0" minRange="0" ammoPerShot="0" ammoType="" cooldown="0.0" heat="1.0" impulse="0.0" heatdamage="0.0" damage="0.7" numFiring="1" projectileclass="" type="Energy" slots="1" Health="10" maxheight="0" critChanceIncrease="0.14,0.08,0.03" critDamMult="1.1" trgheatinctime="3.0" heatinctime="6.25" coneoffire="10"/>

I forgot to back up my weapon stats before patching, but they've been untouched for over a year, so it's still accurate (Oct 2014)



Now, who has Premium, and wants to both see the new maps, and shoot me with Flamers? multiple quantities, and testing the chainfire stun lock.
Testing will be done on a 10 TrueDub mech, with a 60 heat capacity and 2.3 H/s dissipation (and maybe something with lots of DHS or SHS.)

McGral, wont be home for another 2 hours or so but I will be around if you need a few pilots to flame.

Flameshield is not on.

[Mcgral18]

Preliminary results: 4 Flamers will ruin a 10 TrueDub mech, in roughly 3 seconds.

You can then chainfire for limited heat gain after that point (but it will reduce your own dissipation to a point).

[627]

So some non-math tests - I just took 2 of my 8 SPL from that hunchback IIC and glued 2 flamers on for some rounds.

First, overheating another mech works. On hotter maps it is faster of course but even on polar it wasn't really hard.

But as I expected, you still need to kill that guy somehow and there comes the problem.


So first round was on tourmaline, I shut down a timberwolf and started to flame a nova. Before it overheated, it killed me, plain and simple. So having more than 1 enemy is a problem.

Second match was on polar, again a timberwolf, flamed him for some seconds and when he used his SRMs he shut down. But that didn't take long so I flamed again and he shut down again after firing. Had luck he didn't shoot me, though so I could kill him.

Problem here was the short range and the now bad visibility of the flames in general on polar. In the time you need to close in and be in extreme danger, you could have made more damage and keep a way into cover.

This is not even high risk high reward, it's plain suiciding and hoping you can take someone with you.

In the end, I'd say from total useless to niche weapon and if you find a lone enemy you can kill it without problems. But giving up 2 E hardpoints for that? Not sure.

[RockmachinE]

So I put 3 headlights and an SRM4 on my 160+ kp/h Commando. Its sad how easy it is to shut out mechs completely. Its fun to do, but makes the game sad, very sad....

Edited by Louis Brofist, 16 February 2016 - 01:33 PM.

[Quicksilver Aberration]

627, on 16 February 2016 - 01:29 PM, said:

Problem here was the short range and the now bad visibility of the flames in general on polar. In the time you need to close in and be in extreme danger, you could have made more damage and keep a way into cover.

See, you are thinking about this all wrong, think about in more coordinated drops where you brawl. Flamers are going to be important in brawls I foresee.

[Mister Blastman]

[RockmachinE]

So I just completely shut out a UAC King Crab with my 3 headlight 1 srm Commando. Completely. This is stupid .

[jonfett]

4F: FlamerFlameForFun

[Nauht]

Only good for solo targets.

And if you couldn't kill anything heavier than another light 1v1 you're a bad light pilot.

[mogs01gt]

lol Im expecting to get flamed up from a nova with 2000000x flamers!

[Marauder3D]

I just suffered my first stunlock.

I was in a Rifleman 5D, running pulses. No other weapons but beam weapons.

Bad situational awareness on my part. Mad cat (pulse build) and 12 Flamer Nova come around the corner when I'm at about 30 percent heat. As a fire, Nova lights me up and I shut down. Mad cat finishes me with the head shot. (12 armor only)

So that was fun!

[Mcgral18]

mogs01gt, on 16 February 2016 - 01:49 PM, said:

lol Im expecting to get flamed up from a nova with 2000000x flamers!

We tried 35 DHS Whale VS a 13 Flamer Exe, both reached their cap nearly instantly.
It also offset the 4.5H/s of a single Flamer, until that 3 second multiplier started up.

[Kristian Radoulov]

inv

[Big Tin Man]

Hey laser meta, don't let the door hit you in the a55 on the way out.

Mcgral18, on 16 February 2016 - 02:09 PM, said:

We tried 35 DHS Whale VS a 13 Flamer Exe, both reached their cap nearly instantly.
It also offset the 4.5H/s of a single Flamer, until that 3 second multiplier started up.

Flamers trigger ghost heat? I thought it was 4.75 seconds before heat generation on yourself.

[Mcgral18]

Big Tin Man, on 16 February 2016 - 02:13 PM, said:

Hey laser meta, don't let the door hit you in the a55 on the way out.



Flamers trigger ghost heat? I thought it was 4.75 seconds before heat generation on yourself.

Oh, they still generate 1 H/s as their base heat. They ramp up from there.
That's 13 H/s on the GladBag, which no amount of heatsinks will help.

[Big Tin Man]

Mcgral18, on 16 February 2016 - 02:15 PM, said:

Oh, they still generate 1 H/s as their base heat. They ramp up from there.
That's 13 H/s on the GladBag, which no amount of heatsinks will help.

13 H/S is less than 1 ERPPC/second. That shouldn't redline a gladbag "nearly instantly." Something is strange with this.

Edited by Big Tin Man, 16 February 2016 - 02:21 PM.

[Impyrium]

Funny thing about flamers, from what I can see so far, they're heavily based on your opponent's fire discipline. If you have a target you've caught that reacts by attempting to alpha you, he's toast. But all the opponent has to do is avoid firing until his team gets there/you start racking up heat, and then you just look plain silly.

They feel like they're going to be very useful as a team support weapon. Obviously won't appeal to the players that want a one-mech-army going for them.