177 replies to this topic

[Tyman4]

I hereby bid for the right to trial for the unlocking of clan hardlocked equipment, JJs, heatsinks, engines, and structure.

IS mechs are sufficiently tough to handle clan equipment. Why anyone would pay the additional 5 million for the word "Clan" (outside of dedication) is beyond me. So plz unlock clan equipment so we can experiment with loadouts.

Thanks

Tyman4

[Johnny Z]

Tyman4, on 24 January 2016 - 11:45 PM, said:

I hereby bid for the right to trial for the unlocking of clan hardlocked equipment, JJs, heatsinks, engines, and structure.

IS mechs are sufficiently tough to handle clan equipment. Why anyone would pay the additional 5 million for the word "Clan" (outside of dedication) is beyond me. So plz unlock clan equipment so we can experiment with loadouts.

Thanks

Tyman4

A soon as Inner Sphere hard points are unlocked. Then both have unlocked hard points and equipment. Why Clan mechs should have unlocked hard points and equipment and not Inner Sphere makes no sense.

Another Clan player begging for easy mode topic....

[Brandarr Gunnarson]

This has nothing to do with Clan vs. IS.

This is Battlemech vs. Omnimech.

They are different construction types, not different techlines.

That said, they are fine the way they are and provide interesting differentiation and choices.

[Col Jaime Wolf]

the disparity between good and bad clan mechs can never be appropriately addressed with quirks.

unlocked endo and ff for all clan mechs so balance can be universal and properly applied

until then the best clan mechs will always be far better then the worst ones.

and yes i am fine with this breaking the lore. IS mechs already break lore, we shouldn't really have access to a full mech factory for IS mechs but then suddenly not clan mechs.

Edited by Mellifluer, 25 January 2016 - 12:13 AM.

[adamts01]

I like the differences too. They just went too far with many of the quirks in my opinion.

[Hawk819]

Tyman4, on 24 January 2016 - 11:45 PM, said:

I hereby bid for the right to trial for the unlocking of clan hardlocked equipment, JJs, heatsinks, engines, and structure.

IS mechs are sufficiently tough to handle clan equipment. Why anyone would pay the additional 5 million for the word "Clan" (outside of dedication) is beyond me. So plz unlock clan equipment so we can experiment with loadouts.

Thanks

Tyman4

You are not alone in this sentiment. Kanajashi has a video on youtube on how he would allow for unlocking Heat Sinks, etc. Check him out when you have the time.

[LordNothing]

at least unlock the sinks on the nova so can try some non gimped ballistic builds.

[Eboli]

Well IS usually have to pay for double heat sinks endo, ferro armour and die with ST destruction while running XL engines. The cost of upgrading all the necessities is close to the cost of Clan mechs.

Clans purchases usually get XLs and double heat sinks included plus they don't die with ST destruction

[MauttyKoray]

LordNothing, on 25 January 2016 - 01:37 AM, said:

at least unlock the sinks on the nova so can try some non gimped ballistic builds.

At the very least unlocked heatsinks for that specific variant... I would support this part, as a few ballistic clan omnis get screwed over by locked heat sinks that they don't need.

Edited by MauttyKoray, 25 January 2016 - 02:07 AM.

[Leone]

@OP, I believe you are looking for the IIC variants.

Your welcome.

~Leone.

[DovisKhan]

Leone, on 25 January 2016 - 02:34 AM, said:

@OP, I believe you are looking for the IIC variants.

Your welcome.

~Leone.

That's the best point made here.


Try an IS mech vs a IIC


You will discover what's better Clan equipment or IS + quirks



I see lot of clanners bitching and moaning here, but it's obvious they are bitching because the clan mechs are now balanced to IS mechs. What this is is people enjoying easy mode now having to work for their wins being butthurt


Simple example:


Clan med laser - 7 damage and 6 heat, with 400 range


IS med laser - 5 damage and 4 heat with 270 range, if you start at the same 400 range, the IS variant has only ~2 damage


^ That's 50% range and 40% damage boost for 50% heat disadvantage


Actually clan med laser is almost on par with IS large laser (and that one costs 5 tons)


That's just pure numbers, now if you factor in poke and hide play, it's 40% damage and 50% range boost for clanners with no disadvantage.

For quirks you most often get cooldown reduction + heat reduction, what this translates to is similar dps, though still less burst.

And for range, only locusts have almost the same range as clans, all others have shorter range.

Edited by DovisKhan, 25 January 2016 - 02:56 AM.

[Marcel Bekker]

Some Clan Omnis are built to use specific weapon types... the Nova for example is built without Endo Steel and Ferro Fibrous Armor to have a lot of free crits so you can fit a lot of small and light energy weapons and more heatsinks to support them, and it has a lot of heatsinks build in too. That tells you for what kind of weapons the Nova is optimized... the various energy weapons. And there is quite a bit of variety there. Others that follow the same scheme are the Gargoyle and the Executioner, to a lesser extent and with other variations included.

Of course, the outcome is that some pod configurations can turn out sub-par... but that can also be a challenge to rise to! Make it work, overcome the odds! A Clan Warrior strives for this!

I, as a Clan only player, would HATE to see all the fixed equipment unlocked. Clan Omnimechs have a character that the current Inner Sphere Battlemechs often lack, because of too much customization options.

Warrior Tyman4, I hereby refute your claim and declare a trial of refusal against it. Meet me in honorable single combat, in this solemn matter let none interfere!

(OOC, add me in game and we can really do a duel if you would like. I would actually enjoy a good sparring.)

Edited by Marcel Bekker, 25 January 2016 - 03:06 AM.

[Rakshasa]

The IIC's are a useful acid test. If they don't break the game then you can probably do the same to Clan OmniMechs without people getting salty. Too many of the Omni's have bad design hardwired into their frames and it seriously cripples a few of them and leaves others as way too obvious go-to choices. I can't remember the last time I saw an Ice Ferret or Mist Lynx in-game.

On the lore front, yeah...MWO is already operating outside canon, so no problems there personally.

Marcel Bekker, on 25 January 2016 - 03:02 AM, said:

Some Clan Omnis are built to use specific weapon types... the Nova for example is built without Endo Steel and Ferro Fibrous Armor to have a lot of free crits so you can fit a lot of small and light energy weapons and more heatsinks to support them, and it has a lot of heatsinks build in too. That tells you for what kind of weapons the Nova is optimized... the various energy weapons. And there is quite a bit of variety there. Others that follow the same scheme are the Gargoyle and the Executioner, to a lesser extent and with other variations included.

Nah, they're just badly designed (well, maybe not so much the EXE. Maybe) and those are the weapons they're best off using if they don't want to gimp themselves. The poor Nova can't even use the weapons it was designed for without boiling like a coffee pot with worrying regularity. Call it characterful if you like, my opinion is no 'Mech should be forced into using a weapon configuration that lets its pilot fry breakfast on the cockpit instruments by the second volley because it's being gimped by its internal configuration. At least IS mechs can have their "quirky" design elements scrubbed out and fixed by player agency.

Edited by Rakshasa, 25 January 2016 - 03:21 AM.

[Marcel Bekker]

Rakshasa, on 25 January 2016 - 03:05 AM, said:

I can't remember the last time I saw an Ice Ferret or Mist Lynx in-game.

http://mwomercs.com/...fricken-killer/

As for the Myst Lynx... that is a rarity for a Clan Omnimech, a dedicated scout. Thus the hardlocked Active Probe. People need to understand that it is not its job to run around and brawl.

I actually had a lot of successfull games in a Myst Lynx C, just scouting for my team and afterwards supporting them with ECM and AMS, or lending another large and medium laser to a Timberwolf's damage. The highest was about 750 dmg, if I remember correctly. It is not easy, but it is definately rewarding.

On the other hand... there is a lore friendly and very easy solution. Alright, unlock Endo and Ferro for Clan Omnimechs, unlock all their hard mounted equipment... but let a warning appear if you attempt to change anything that is hardlocked... "Warning: Attempting to change this equipment will turn this Omnimech into a standard Battlemech and lock all Omnipods in place on this chassis".

Yes, that is right. You can change hardlocked components, including the internal structure and armor, but at the price of the Mech losing all Omni-Capability. It in effect becomes a standard battlemech with fixed weapon and equipment hardpoints.

Edited by Marcel Bekker, 25 January 2016 - 03:18 AM.

[Rakshasa]

I'm not saying they're not fun, they are - just that they're badly designed and would benefit from being able to lavish customization upon And yus, fear the Active Probe!

I quite like the hardlock option, maybe require a large sum of Cbills to unlock it again if you don't like the config.

Edited by Rakshasa, 25 January 2016 - 03:30 AM.

[Marcel Bekker]

Rakshasa, on 25 January 2016 - 03:18 AM, said:

I'm not saying they're not fun, they are - just that they're badly designed and would benefit from being able to lavish customization upon And yus, fear the Active Probe!

I quite like the hardlock option, maybe require a large sum of Cbills to unlock it again if you don't like the config.

Well, I would prefer to not be able to unlock it again at all. In the lore that is not possible, once the omni capability is gone, you can not restore it. The Battle Computer and Gyro are compensating for the variations in weight distribution and weapon location, the easy weapon switch(which in the lore is not possible on regular Battlemechs, at least not without quite a bit of reconfiguring the software, laying new cable connections etc. and even then it is possible that glitches or malfunctions may develop if not done by the manufacturer itself) is possible due to a series of standardized connection ports throughout the frame... change the frame, change the armor, and that is gone, forever... but hey, you need 3 of the same omnimech anyway to master it, right?

If that is done though, there needs to be more of an incentive to keep them omni configurable, even if they are not optimal in that state... like the ability to select from pre-saved configs after the battlefield/map is decided, for example.

Edited by Marcel Bekker, 25 January 2016 - 03:58 AM.

[627]

I'd say you should start with locked Hardpoints of the default config when you convert your OmniMech into a BattleMech.

Afaik this is possible in Lore... Not so sure this should be ingame, though. Some mech variants are pretty optimal from a hardpoint point of view, some are pretty bad (summonor prime comes to my mind with 3 single hardpoints).

Sure you could argue about the flamer on the adder that was unlocked so why not X Y Z but I don't think this is the right way to go.

All Omnis are available for cbills these days, so everyone can get those and know what he gets. You want freedom then buy IIC mechs.

[Russhuster]

if you want to go by the lore then it is next to impossible for IS mechs to put another reactor in a mech as that comes next to building a complete new mech.

And a Omni mech should be able to reconfigure the mech IN THE LOBBY knowing what environment the planet will have
or even replace weapons IN THE FIELD
as that was the original purpose of omni mechs

[El Bandito]

kapusta11, on 25 January 2016 - 04:28 AM, said:

Your link is broken.

Yeah, it was a test to see if Imgur is still blocking mwomercs.com. Guess I'll have to upload my images on other image hosting servers.

Edited by El Bandito, 25 January 2016 - 04:30 AM.

[kapusta11]

El Bandito, on 25 January 2016 - 04:29 AM, said:

Yeah, it was a test to see if Imgur is still blocking mwomercs.com. Guess I'll have to upload my images on other image hosting servers.

I feel your pain. Even images from Hitbox Localization thread diappeared.